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Subject: Revised Rulebook? rss

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Colin Cherry
United States
Trenton
New Jersey
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Does anyone know when we might see an updated rulebook? The current one is riddled with errors and, most importantly, was clearly not playtested well. Specifically I mean that it was obviously never used as a tool to teach someone the game from scratch - it is clear that any playtesters were taught by someone that knew the game already, not from trying to learn via rulebook.

I'm a backer with no addons at the moment. I'm really interested in a rulebook that shows progress before I decide to drop more cash.
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John Di Ponio
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Lake Orion
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I am sure they will work on the rulebook. There is still plenty of time before this gets into our hands.
 
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Colin Cherry
United States
Trenton
New Jersey
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JohnnyD wrote:
I am sure they will work on the rulebook. There is still plenty of time before this gets into our hands.


You are correct. But there isn't THAT much time before the pledge manager closes. I suspect I'm not the only one that I'd making the decision to wait on buying addons until we see a better rulebook. Given some of the pitfalls of Grimlord's previous game, I think it'd be especially important to show off a clean, well-produced rulebook prior to pledge manager closure.
 
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John Whyman
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Vivian
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I buy kickstarter games for the art and quest plots. If I don't like the rules I can homebrew. Since Gloomhaven is so popular and the mechanics are unique and immersive I might try using that system for other games.
 
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Colin Cherry
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Trenton
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scurvy duck wrote:
I buy kickstarter games for the art and quest plots. If I don't like the rules I can homebrew. Since Gloomhaven is so popular and the mechanics are unique and immersive I might try using that system for other games.


I mean I buy games for that game. I don't need more miniatures for Gloomhaven.
 
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Ryan Carr
Australia
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Yeah I agree, they said that they were adding some game play stuff in updates over July but thus far they haven't which is a little disappointing because I couldn't get a great sense of the game from the rulebook such as what are these other skills on the player cards? What sort of gameplay changes do they make? etc
 
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As of this week's update, the rulebook isn't ready yet and will be up next week apparently. Just four days before the manager closes.

While the miniatures are cool and and all think I'm just going to bow out. It's seems fairly clear this wasn't a priority for them.
 
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Rod Mitchell
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Calgary
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The pitfalls of releasing a rulebook that isn't ready are far worse than losing a few impatient backers. The people that have had a chance to playtest and provide feedback (it was in one the more recent updates iirc) loved the dynamics and difficulty of game play. This to me is telling enough. I understand why some feel they need the rulebook first, but to me, its the gameplay itself that matters most. Not every company on kickstarter have the available resources to provide everything in its completion prior to launch. I hardly think this means that it isn't important to them. As with any KS project, if you are uncomfortable backing, don't. This is only one of the reasons why I disagree with $1 backers getting a chance to upgrade during the PM.
 
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Colin Cherry
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Trenton
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Grumpae wrote:
The pitfalls of releasing a rulebook that isn't ready are far worse than losing a few impatient backers. The people that have had a chance to playtest and provide feedback (it was in one the more recent updates iirc) loved the dynamics and difficulty of game play. This to me is telling enough. I understand why some feel they need the rulebook first, but to me, its the gameplay itself that matters most. Not every company on kickstarter have the available resources to provide everything in its completion prior to launch. I hardly think this means that it isn't important to them. As with any KS project, if you are uncomfortable backing, don't. This is only one of the reasons why I disagree with $1 backers getting a chance to upgrade during the PM.


There exists no world in which the rulebook and gameplay are not strongly related. Their report about other people's impressions about gameplay do little to tell me whether or not I will personally like the game.

A revised rulebook does a few things. First it allows me to see what the game is likely to be like when it is in my hands. At the current state of affairs the game is too clunky and has rules that are too unclear for me to enjoy. Second it shows that the company is focused on making rules revisions instead of just cool miniatures or an interesting theme. And finally, for me at least, it shows that the company acknowledges that backers actually deserve the updates they were offered, which goes a long way to instilling corporate confidence.

I don't think anyone is saying that we want a set-in-stone final version that cannot change from here. We just want something more than the abomination currently available.
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Matt K
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They've posted the revised rulebook:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/grimlordgames/village-a...
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Colin Cherry
United States
Trenton
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AstorSigma wrote:


No addons for me. That thing is still an impractical abomination.

I'm not seeking to get rid of my pledge or anything, but as someone that was considering buying the "all addons" bundle, this was a deal breaker. Still nearly unreadable formatting, still lack of definitions for apparently critical terms (like what determines when a tile is "full") and poor explanations for many phases and abilities.

I would venture that anyone trying to play the game from the rulebook would be frustrated at best and likely never get it. This is another sign of only playtesting with people that were taught the game by someone that knew how to play.

One day smaller developers will realize that miniatures alone won't get a sustainable fan base. Gloomhaven had only 18 miniatures in a massive game and it is a top 5 game of all time here. Hint: it isn't because of the miniatures.
 
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Spotted Goat
Netherlands
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For me the theme of the game is brilliant and with the kooks of the game enough to go all in. I was a bit frustrated with some choises in the campaign, but they show they listen to backers and I love the weekly updates.

As for the rulebook, I own Lobotomy which has the worst rulebook I ever came across, but if you bite through that and work the rulebook out with some friends where you might even set the doubtfull rules yourself, you get a beautifull game. So I'm not worried about the rulebook at all, I'm sure it can be worked out.
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Carlos D
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There is a new (almost final) version of the rulebook and it looks awesome!
Enjoy!

https://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/3c5b1a_6fca94b1d1774a3db4bb4c...

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Jan Big
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I wonder what the really displeased guy thinks of this new rulebook. Looks fantastic to me!
 
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