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Advanced Squad Leader: Starter Kit #1» Forums » General

Subject: Mixing counters from different starter kits? rss

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J Smith
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I just got the expansion pack. I already have sk1. Do I mix the counters or the counters need to be kept separate by expansion/box?
 
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Joris
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It ok to mix. All units of the same class/line are the same through the whole series (ASLSK and ASL)
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Russ Williams
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But FWIW: you don't NEED to mix, i.e. each starter kit is self-contained (AFAIK).
 
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Jim Cavallari
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russ wrote:
But FWIW: you don't NEED to mix, i.e. each starter kit is self-contained (AFAIK).


If that's the case, can the SK's be purchased out of order, or is it a "building block" kind of system?
 
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Russ Williams
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JimboThulu61 wrote:
russ wrote:
But FWIW: you don't NEED to mix, i.e. each starter kit is self-contained (AFAIK).


If that's the case, can the SK's be purchased out of order, or is it a "building block" kind of system?


I've always understood it that they are all independent. MMP's website explicitly says:
ASL Starter Kits (ASLSKs) contain everything you need to start playing ASL. Each kit adds new dimensions to the game while maximizing playability and fun. They are designed as stand-alone games that can be enjoyed either in sequence or on their own.

...

ASL Starter Kit #2 is a self-contained module which will let players start playing Advanced Squad Leader almost immediately. A liberally-illustrated rulebook teaches gamers ASL using a conversational style to teach the concepts of ASL. If you own and play ASL Starter Kit #1 you will be pleasantly surprised to find how easy it is to spot the new rules ASLSK#2 adds - we've highlighted the new rules so that you can skip rereading what you've learned in ASLSK#1 and get right to the new rules!

What does ASLSK#2 add? GUNS! Artillery pieces. Anti-tank guns. The famous and deadly German "88". Mortars and bazookas! ASLSK#2 adds the "to hit" procedure to the foundation you learned in ASLSK#1. And if you didn't get ASLSK#1? There are two "infantry only" scenarios to get you up to speed!

This answers the inevitable question we get with the Starter Kit concept. Do I need ASLSK#2 if I have ASLSK#1? The Starter Kits are self contained. Each has everything you need to play what's in the box, with the higher numbers adding to the ASL knowledge you'll have from playing previous Starter Kits. We do not anticipate changing what you've learned from prior Starter Kits (for example, ASLSK#2 adds about 4 pages of rules to the base built by ASLSK#1). A better question would be "Do I need ASLSK#1 if I buy ASLSK#2?". The short answer is a resounding no! You can dive right in with ASLSK#2. But if you do, and you like the game, ASLSK#1 adds more boards and scenarios (infantry only) for you to enjoy. We know it's a little confusing, we hope this clears it up a bit.

...

The Advanced Squad Leader Starter Kit Expansion Pack #1 adds new counters, maps, and adds rules with known errata addressed. The Pack has been designed with all levels of Starter Kit play in mind. No other module from the Starter Kit series is necessary to play the scenarios included in Expansion Pack #1.


And I've often seen this stated in the forum. (Caveat: I only own ASLSK1, so I am just reporting what I have read.)
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Robin Reeve
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JimboThulu61 wrote:
russ wrote:
But FWIW: you don't NEED to mix, i.e. each starter kit is self-contained (AFAIK).


If that's the case, can the SK's be purchased out of order, or is it a "building block" kind of system?
In any order: they each are self contained.
Note that there is a learning progression:
SK1 infantry only
SK2 infantry + guns
SK3 infantry + guns + tanks
But even the SK3 has at least one infantry only scenario.
So you czn start with SK3.
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Josh
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JimboThulu61 wrote:
russ wrote:
But FWIW: you don't NEED to mix, i.e. each starter kit is self-contained (AFAIK).


If that's the case, can the SK's be purchased out of order, or is it a "building block" kind of system?
Any order. The rules become progressively longer and more complex with each set, but they build on each other, so #3 contains complete rules for the first two. The maps, counter mix, and scenarios are specific to each set, but you wouldn't need anything out of #1 or 2 to play something in #3, for example.
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Eddy del Rio
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SK1 is Infantry only, but it is also Infantry WITHOUT Support weapons and Infantry WITH support weapons, and has scenarios for this simpler approach. I am an advocate for stepping through the SKs in order. If you start with SK3, you will have a bit more difficult time separating all the unnecessary rules, and you will have to start with one infantry+SW scenario. After that, you can try replaying the same scenario switching sides and strategy, etc., versus in SK1 playing many more Infantry only scenarios. I think the SK1 start is a better approach. Plus, there are sequential Examples of Play files that you can use to learn the system by a step-by-step annotated play. The game is fantastic for what it models - tactical level historical conflict - but it does have a relatively steep learning curve.

Good luck!
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Austin Richards
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You can mix your starter kit counters with regular ASL counters, too, if you decide to move up. There are a few large ASL scenarios that need a few extra counters.
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Gregg L

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The only reason not to mix is if you think you might sell later.
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Russ Williams
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lordpolish wrote:
The only reason not to mix is if you think you might sell later.

Or (as someone noted in some thread) if you like to take an individual small ASLSK with you someplace to play and prefer to travel light!
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Thomas Huber-Wehner
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lordpolish wrote:
... you might sell later.


HERESY!!! surprise
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J Smith
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Ok thanks everyone. I'll keep them separate for now in gmt counter trays. I plan on getting sk2 and sk3 ( should I wait for a reprint or just pay the cost people are asking now?) and decision at elst. Would a Plano xxxx be the way to go to hold all expansion packs in one case but keep them separated?

Edit: there are dark grey counters on sheet 2 of sk expansion pack 1. There is no nationalities chart that I can find that comes with it. Sk1 only shoes German American and Russian. What are the grey guys and is there a online source to see all the sk nationalities and how they break down to half squads?
 
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Joe Gochinski
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dirtcheap wrote:
Ok thanks everyone. I'll keep them separate for now in gmt counter trays. I plan on getting sk2 and sk3 ( should I wait for a reprint or just pay the cost people are asking now?) and decision at elst. Would a Plano xxxx be the way to go to hold all expansion packs in one case but keep them separated?

Edit: there are dark grey counters on sheet 2 of sk expansion pack 1. There is no nationalities chart that I can find that comes with it. Sk1 only shoes German American and Russian. What are the grey guys and is there a online source to see all the sk nationalities and how they break down to half squads?


JR

Those are Italians in SK #2

There is an "armoury" listing of all the ASLSK products, I will try load as a file in the next day or 2.

Thanks
Joe
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Jim Cavallari
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russ wrote:
And I've often seen this stated in the forum. (Caveat: I only own ASLSK1, so I am just reporting what I have read.)


I'm curious because I just ordered ASLSK#1 and didn't know if I could go out of order.
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Runs with scissors
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dirtcheap wrote:
Ok thanks everyone. I'll keep them separate for now in gmt counter trays. I plan on getting sk2 and sk3 ( should I wait for a reprint or just pay the cost people are asking now?)



Starter kit #2 is the least necessary of the 3. I would not pay much extra for it. There is a lot of incremental value in SK #3.

MMP reprints starter kits #1 and #3 fairly regularly, #2 less so. From what I've observed SK #1 and #3 are rarely out of stock for more than 6-9 months at a time. I haven't been paying attention recently, so I don't know when SK #3 stocks were exhausted, but if it's been a couple of months or more, I would expect it to be back in print by Christmas. (Note: this is not true of other starter kit expansions or the full asl products.)
 
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Mike Jackson
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I hold all the info counters you could need for a SK#1 game in a single Raaco A75 insert tray. (That is, Beyond Valor quantities plus some).I have another A75 that holds all the extra info counters you could need for an SK#2 or SK#3 game. I keep all the unit counter types introduced in each SK module in their original SK boxes. That is, all the German, American, and Russian infantry counters from SK#1-3 are all in the SK#1 box, so if I'm just playing an SK#1 game all I need is the SK#1 box and documents, boards, and the first Raaco tray to play. Likewise, all the British, Italian, and Allied Minors infantry introduced in SK#2 are in the SK#2 box. Also the SK#2 box has all the SK Guns plus some, while the SK#3 box has all the SK Vehicles plus some. Works for me. Portable organiser boxes for each nationality are great if you go beyond SK though.

As for purchases, I would strongly recommend starting with SK#1. That way you don't have to wade through irrelevant Gun and Vehicle rules mixed in with the infantry rules when you're just trying to play your first ever game! There's plenty enough to search through just in the SK#1 rulebook if you're trying to teach yourself. You just have to keep in mind that there is much more fun to be had yet when you do progress to Guns and Tanks, and it's all easier if you have someone to teach you of course.

And be aware that all the SK Rulebooks have a few holes in them that could use clarication, and the SK#3 rulebook in particular needs quite a bit of errata to really play properly. Unfortunately MMP are still (as far as I'm aware) refusing to provide such errata outside of extra module purchases (except for SK#1 errata which is on their website). Your SK expansion pack (that MMP expects people to buy to fix their errors) has quite a few fixes I believe. I think most people just end up getting the full ASL Rulebook anyway and start using it instead.
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