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Subject: "Deluxe" a bit of a joke? rss

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Robert Ell
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The box and cards are terrible. I at least expected a basic insert and dividers for the expansions. I guess its a big upgrade from the previous boxes that didn't even fit sleeved cards and/or expansions.

Probably the worst "deluxe" version of a game I've ever seen.
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Murr Rockstroh
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I'm satisfied with it. I'm not elated and jumping out of my chair saying it's the greatest deluxe version of a game ever though

The cards are fine to me, I've seen way worse. The insert was a bit of a disappointment, I was hoping for something that would hold the different sets of cards separately in the box, but we were "warned" in update #14 (October 2016) that it was going to be a piece of cardboard.

We considered a plastic insert and tried out various ideas for how that would work, but in the end none of the options proved viable -- and they would've increased the box size a bunch. I think 8.5" square is a good size for Innovation: Deluxe.

Personally I'd have been OK with a Ticket to Ride sized box with a proper insert to hold all the cards.
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Robert Ell
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I tend to not read kickstarter updates -- but "none of the options proved viable"? Give me a break. The exact same cardboard insert, in plastic, flipped upside down would have worked fine.
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Murr Rockstroh
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Here's a direct link to the update. I don't read them, but I will scan through them quickly, and look at the pictures

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/asmadigames/innovation-...
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Worse than IDW's Machi Koro: Deluxe Edition? That was also a complete abuse of the word "deluxe". Maybe "Shameless Money Grab Edition" is more appropriate.
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Murr Rockstroh
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I forgot to mention, I was disappointed that the "thick dividers" mentioned in that update were not included. At least not in my box.
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Robert Ell
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OverEngineered wrote:
Worse than IDW's Machi Koro: Deluxe Edition? That was also a complete abuse of the word "deluxe". Maybe "Shameless Money Grab Edition" is more appropriate.


Haven't seen it, but I heard it was bad.
 
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Robert Ell
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Murr wrote:
I forgot to mention, I was disappointed that the "thick dividers" mentioned in that update were not included. At least not in my box.


Mine either. Were they intended to separate the expansions?
 
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Christopher Grace
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It was in a tin at least.
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Rafał Kruczek
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Elltrain wrote:
The box and cards are terrible. I at least expected a basic insert and dividers for the expansions. I guess its a big upgrade from the previous boxes that didn't even fit sleeved cards and/or expansions.

Probably the worst "deluxe" version of a game I've ever seen.

Knowing Chris Cieslik, a bit of joke, a bit of hard work on games mix is normal for Asmadi Games.
The new exapnsions were tested for years, manual was rewritten, card "art" /icons were redone from 1 bit to 1 chnannel, card layout is completely new. There is a lot of work taht was done.
Call it "deluxe" or "Innovation Big Box" this set probably deserves it.
I was going to procure(buy, construct, repurpose) some way of conveniently holding 50 decks in one box. And as for example Summoner Wars Allinces shows it is possible to get such box/dividers, for similar price IF you have effect of the scale - SW:A had probably bigger print-run.
So it will be shame it all it was wasted , when box won't be able to hold the weith of 600 cards.
I have the first edidion box , that is very thick and sturdy and holds for almost 5 years. I have a lot of boxes taht could serve as a method tor transporting Innovation. But it would be best to have a good box in the first place...
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W. Craig Trader
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Elltrain wrote:
The box and cards are terrible. I at least expected a basic insert and dividers for the expansions. I guess its a big upgrade from the previous boxes that didn't even fit sleeved cards and/or expansions.

Probably the worst "deluxe" version of a game I've ever seen.


I think the box is fine. The insert is usable (but I found my own solution). What's deluxe are the cards and expansions:

I've been playing Innovation since the first printing of the first edition. I've been playing with the deluxe base game since I received my copy last year. While 9 of the cards were deemed unbalanced and revised, the real improvement was in the design of the cards themselves. The deluxe cards are more readable, and with cleaner design. Having all four expansions, with consistent card sizes and designs, with consistent rules, is definitely an improvement. (The Echos expansion had particularly bad rules for integration with the base game.)

Yes, it would have been nice to have cards that were sturdy enough to use without sleeves, but that would have been very expensive, and hard to justify. I'm good with Innovation Deluxe, as it is.
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Chris Cieslik
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If you're unhappy with the game and want a refund, we're happy to process one.

I'm sorry you don't like the box.
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Chris Cieslik
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Also - the lack of dividers is totally my fault. It got left off the quote, and I didn't realize it until after the games were delivered / fulfilled.

The thicker reference cards we did try, and reverted back to normal. The thicker cardstock tore up the edges of cards tucked underneath.

I know it took a lot longer to make and get to everyone than you would've liked - it's not what we intended either. A lot of factors (many of which I can't talk about) came together and made this more challenging than it should have been. I offer my apologies to anyone who is disappointed, and as said - if you'd like a refund just let us know and we'll process it.
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Mc Jarvis
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For reference, BCW trading card dividers work perfectly with innovation. They cost $1 a pack, and you'll only need 1 pack to divide the set up however you wish.
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Nathan Clegg
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When I backed this project, I took "deluxe" to mean updated/improved and with all the expansions, i.e. more than just a big box. It is in the intervening years that the term in the hobby has come to mean over-the-top components. The new design looks great and I am glad to have everything in one box.
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Chris Cieslik
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moramis wrote:
When I backed this project, I took "deluxe" to mean updated/improved and with all the expansions, i.e. more than just a big box. It is in the intervening years that the term in the hobby has come to mean over-the-top components. The new design looks great and I am glad to have everything in one box.


Yeah, when we made Mottainai Deluxe as a double-set for 3-5 players, we were thinking Innovation Deluxe as all-the-expansions would make sense. In hindsight I'd rather have called it "Innovation: Complete".
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mfl134
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angelkurisu wrote:
moramis wrote:
When I backed this project, I took "deluxe" to mean updated/improved and with all the expansions, i.e. more than just a big box. It is in the intervening years that the term in the hobby has come to mean over-the-top components. The new design looks great and I am glad to have everything in one box.


Yeah, when we made Mottainai Deluxe as a double-set for 3-5 players, we were thinking Innovation Deluxe as all-the-expansions would make sense. In hindsight I'd rather have called it "Innovation: Complete".


at least you didn't call it deluxified
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mfl134
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Innovation: Banana Edition
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Chris Cieslik
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Well I could still sharpie a few more letters onto the box...
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angelkurisu wrote:
When we made Mottainai Deluxe as a double-set for 3-5 players, we were thinking Innovation Deluxe as all-the-expansions would make sense. In hindsight I'd rather have called it "Innovation: Complete".

Maybe "The Compleat Innovation"?

When Wutai Mountain comes out, people will complain that it wasn't included in their old copies of "Mottainai Deluxe".
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Scott Russell
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I haven't played with the deluxe set yet, but I am concerned that the color blind "icons" (background) aren't there anymore.

Edit: So I may have to use the Sharpie that Chris "threatened" to use.
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Josh
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qzhdad wrote:
I haven't played with the deluxe set yet, but I am concerned that the color blind "icons" (background) aren't there anymore.

Edit: So I may have to use the Sharpie that Chris "threatened" to use.
The shape around the Age of the card is keyed to the card's color. So, yeah, not as great for us colorblindos, but hey, MORE Innovation!
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Travis Dean
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moramis wrote:
When I backed this project, I took "deluxe" to mean updated/improved and with all the expansions, i.e. more than just a big box. It is in the intervening years that the term in the hobby has come to mean over-the-top components. The new design looks great and I am glad to have everything in one box.


This is a very good perception. When I saw the kickstarter, I thought of this as Deluxe in the sense that it was complete with all expansions in one box. But recent "Deluxe" games are definitely over the top components and have shifted the expectation of a game that uses that word.
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Chris Cieslik
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JoshBot wrote:
qzhdad wrote:
I haven't played with the deluxe set yet, but I am concerned that the color blind "icons" (background) aren't there anymore.

Edit: So I may have to use the Sharpie that Chris "threatened" to use.
The shape around the Age of the card is keyed to the card's color. So, yeah, not as great for us colorblindos, but hey, MORE Innovation!


Yeah - with the new latticework, the old location for the colorblind indicators went away. Instead we did the shape around the value in the top-left. As a bonus, that should be more visible when your hand is fanned out.

I'm hoping it works well for you all!
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Andrew Lloyd
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Yea, count me among the disappointed. I LOVE the game, but was really hopping for a sturdier box and thicker card stock. Oh well, the curse of Carl Chudyk lives on.
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