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Descent: Journeys in the Dark (Second Edition)» Forums » General

Subject: Things That Bother Me In Descent rss

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Mihael R
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Hi,

I've returned to wanting to play Descent after not playing it for a year or two, and after re-reading the rules and FAQ to refresh my memory, things like LOS, counting range through obstacles, large monster movement, etc., bother me somewhat.

Either the rules aren't clear, which makes the situation more complicated than it should (imho), or they are simply weird and sometimes counter-intuitive. Some of those issues still aren't ruled in the official FAQ.

1. LOS
The way LOS is ruled bothers me quite a lot. I think the following posts speak for themselves.

The hero can't see the zombie:
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/9820988#9820988

Every tan goblin has LOS to the red goblin:
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/9681806#9681806

Funny representation of the situation in the first link:
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/9458632#9458632

Pay special attention to #6, #7 and #8:
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/12245389#12245389

2. Counting Spaces
When, say, checking whether a target is in range, you have to count around obstacles (but you count through figures), although the target is directly behind an obstacle and you have LOS to it (BTW, the image to the right at the link below is wrong, I believe. It should read 2 range for the bottom right monster, not 3):
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/9858582#9858582

3. Large Monster Movement
Everything about large monster movement seems goofy to me, especially when involving the dragon figure: the way a dragon shrinks to one space while moving, then expanding (often covering extra ground by expanding "forward") and rotating after finishing the movement, then shrinking again in the second move action, and expanding and rotating once again after finishing the second move action.

Not to mention if one interrupts a move action with another move action, which can result in expansion the moment the first move action was interrupted...

Also, did you know that you cover more ground by interrupting movement with an attack action, than by first moving, finishing the move action, and then attacking?

For ex. say there's a dragon on the left side of a room, and there's a hero in the middle. If the dragon wants to move to the other side while attacking the hero, it will cover more ground if it moves 1 or 2 spaces towards the other side, then interrupts the move action with an attack action (which requires the dragon to expand, but it expands towards the other side of the room), performs the attack, and then shrinks once again and moves another 1 or 2 spaces, and after finishing the movement, expands once again (towards the other side of the room).

Seems cheesy.

-----

Is there anything that bothers you in Descent 2.0?


Thanks
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Chris Schenck
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Just one for me: It bothers me that I don't have as much time to play it as I'd like.


EDIT: Since you're just returning from a hiatus, I'd HIGHLY recommend downloading the amazing CRRG:
https://descent-community.org/index.php/crrg/

It covers every question you could possibly think of, except for the very few minor points that are still awaiting clarification from FFG.
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Paul
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The CRRG is phenomenal. Additionally, to your first two points, I've got my Guide to Range and LOS. It doesn't fix the weirdness, but it does my best to explain how to count by the rules.

Very little bothers me more in this game than alternate phrasings that mean the same thing. That and movement.
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Jonathan Barth
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After reading this, and looking into it. I think implementing the IA LOS (1 to 2 corners) is how we will play it.
 
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Mihael R
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zaltyre wrote:
The CRRG is phenomenal. Additionally, to your first two points, I've got my Guide to Range and LOS. It doesn't fix the weirdness, but it does my best to explain how to count by the rules.

Very little bothers me more in this game than alternate phrasings that mean the same thing. That and movement.

Diagram 8 of your Guide is really interesting, if not a bit weird.

I would probably play it wrong if I didn't read it.
 
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Hermes Padilla
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You know what bothers me about Descent? That I can't find the Lieutenants for the base game anywhere! cry will someone please sell me theirs??
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Aaron Chasteen
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Without looking too much into it...

1. I switched to using the IA line of site and it makes more sense and translates great for me. I would recommend this app for checking LOS, but FF have apparently taken it down. Must be developing a replacement.

https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1242758/ios-los-checker

2. Thematically you are close enough to peek around corners safely. How could you peek around a corner if you are not physically at the corner?

3. The large figures have big legs and are stomping around you. The dragon is flying over you with his legs weaving between you. I think large monster movement makes sense, but the term "shrinking" is a poor/confusing choice of words. No little guy should prevent a mammoth from getting through.
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Alexander Steinbach
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About your last point, you may only interrupt movement to declare an attack (or any other action) when you can do so while shrunk. This means that you cannot interrupt movement to perform an attack while expanding towards a monster. The shrunk monster needs to be already adjacent to its target.
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Graham Martin
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meehael wrote:
Is there anything that bothers you in Descent 2.0?


No.
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Mihael R
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Vardaine wrote:
About your last point, you may only interrupt movement to declare an attack (or any other action) when you can do so while shrunk. This means that you cannot interrupt movement to perform an attack while expanding towards a monster. The shrunk monster needs to be already adjacent to its target.

Well, suppose the hero is at most three spaces away from the dragon. You move next to the hero by spending two movement pts, expand towards the other side of the room, attack, shrink to move by spending the last movement pt, expand once again. You've effectively covered seven spaces of ground with speed of 3.

Starting position:
DRA##X####
GON#######
##########

Move two, attack:
#####X####
####DRA###
####GON###

Resume moving:
#####X#DRA
#######GON
##########


EDIT:
Link to the ruling of the mentioned situation:
https://boardgamegeek.com/article/10617047#10617047
 
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Alexander Steinbach
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Correct, this is legal. Do note that there needs to be space to actually expand the monster. It's up to the heroes to block such moves so that the dragon has no space to expand.
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Paul
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Vardaine wrote:
Correct, this is legal. Do note that there needs to be space to actually expand the monster. It's up to the heroes to block such moves so that the dragon has no space to expand.
It is legal, and also worth noting that monsters have a relativwly low amount of MP.
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Mattigar
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1. Don't get to play it enough

2. Staying motivated to finish painting it.

3. Too many complexities and slight variations on the same thing in the rules ie attacks targeting and affecting; move actions, move up to your speed, gain movement points, move 3 spaces; figures, heroes, figures treated as heroes etc.
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Dean L
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They're dragons. They are quite fast. The designers knew this and wanted them to be able to move five spaces. With the grow/shrink rules they therefore have them a movement of three.

Yes, the expand to attack and gain two extra distance this is cheesy but is sort of the only way to do it while following FFG's design principles (which wouldn't allow them to ask you to remember the space you expanded from for the attack).
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Aswin Agastya
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That there is no small expansion companion to the Manor of the Raven!!! UAAAAAAARRRRGGH cry zombiezombiezombie
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Chris Schenck
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Vardaine wrote:
Correct, this is legal. Do note that there needs to be space to actually expand the monster. It's up to the heroes to block such moves so that the dragon has no space to expand.

This is key. For my group, careful movement and board positioning is a really fun part of the tactics of the game. If you can jam up the enemy movement even for a round or two, it can swing the momentum of the whole battle.
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Bucho Bucho
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No one's mentioned the art?

 
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gary gee
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Bucho22 wrote:
No one's mentioned the art?

i agree,most of the art was better in 1st edition.
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Leeroy Porkins
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Things that bothered me (From OL's View):

No alternating turns

No Knockdown Victory (IA had wounding Rebels as an alternative victory)

Limiting the amount of Open Groups (And then making them immobilized)

No Reinforcements in Valyndra's Lair shake

Playing as the OL in Lair of the Wyrm made me never want to play as the OL again.
 
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Dave Cohen
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Leeroy_Porkins wrote:
Things that bothered me (From OL's View):

No alternating turns

No Knockdown Victory (IA had wounding Rebels as an alternative victory)

Limiting the amount of Open Groups (And then making them immobilized)

No Reinforcements in Valyndra's Lair shake

Playing as the OL in Lair of the Wyrm made me never want to play as the OL again.



You may want to try Decent 1st ed.
 
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