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Subject: Privilege Card Question rss

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Scott Timberg
United States
Los Angeles
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folks,

the privileges seems a bit weak, unless you get a bunch of them. are you allowed to show what priv card you have when offering them for trade? it would become a much hotter item if people knew it would help them build an block of adjacent properties....

similarly, do you show people your msgs, small and large order, etc when trading?
 
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Miguel de la Casa
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Re:Privilege Card Question
stimberg (#28863),

It's funny. We haven't even thought about it. Showing our stuff was implicitely forbidden by my group... cool

I agree about privileges, and the solution: get many of them. The point is that they are more valuable the more you already have. As ToG is about differences in value among different players I find it right the way we play, i.e. with all cards concealed. angry
 
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Nate Sandall
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Re:Privilege Card Question
stimberg (#28863),
I don't think Traders of Genoa benefits from limiting the items that are available to be traded or negotiated. We actively trade for privileges but we guard which ones we have until we are in a negotiation, and even then we don't show everybody what we have. We also negotiate over the placement of the tower when a start any space special card is used. The game is all about the deal making.

By the way, our games usually end very close. First game me and one buddy of mine tied for first! Third game he beat me by only 10 ducats! Is this common?
 
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Luca Iennaco
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Re:Privilege Card Question
stimberg (#28863),

We do not show orders (large or small) and messages once they're in our hands (simple strategy: if you know that I need to deliver something somewhere, you probably will NOT help me... not for free, at least! )

If only 2 players get the majority of Privileges, they often try to do some "exchanges" of them to maximize their score (they gain an advantage over the other 3 players).

However we use commonly this option: if you propose to the active player (for example) to go to the Post Office and split the messages, an outbid is "I offer a split too, but you read the two messages and choose the one to keep".

Overall I agree that everything avaible for trade should be traded in this game!
 
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Scott Timberg
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Re:Privilege Card Question
Luke the Flaming (#28942),

Thanks for your note, tho i'm still a bit confused. you say you dont show orders or messages -- but do you show privileges to others?

and if not, how does any player do purposeful "exchanges" is he does not know what he's getting? blind trading still does not seem to me a successful way to rack up linked privilege cards.

tks. scott
 
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Karl Kieninger
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Re:Privilege Card Question
stimberg (#30508),

Most stuff goes blind, but occasionally the deal is worked out based on a specific card. We allow any player to show any card at anytime, but rarely do they get shown except for privilege cards. Remember, also, that privilege cards are goods for 1:1 Trades.
 
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Nick Landi
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Re:Privilege Card Question
Though it does not state it specifically in the rules, it is implied that during a trade you may reveal cards related to the transaction. Check out page 5 of the Rio Grande rules and then read the example turn. Towards the bottom is says "David, can I have one of the 2 small orders? / Ok, but I get to pick which one." To me, this means that an opponent can look though your cards and choose what he wants. The way we play rather that just turning over our cards for trading (which btw I don’t think is a proper interpretation of the rules) is have the player wanting to trade ask something like "Do you have any orders involving salt". I like this way because it adds a slight bluffing element.
 
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Joltin' Joe
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Re:Privilege Card Question
stimberg (#28863),

I think the privilege cards a a bit of a problem. It's very easy to win the game if you collect a lot of them. They are not weak at all. If you are playing with people who think they are, then just collect them as your main focus. When the game is over, you will have won.

Why is this a problem? Well, it isn't if you are playing with people who know the game well. They will try their best not to allow you to have a lot of privilege cards, and even MORE so if you are allowed to show people which ones you have. There's no point in showing them. If your opponents know that by trading you a privilege card you will have a good block of connected ones, they're not going to let you have it. No matter what strategy you are persuing, people who know this game know that they have to collect some of the privilege cards, lest one person get too many and win the game.

This is a problem if you are playing with new players, who don't realize that the privilege cards are a game breaker. The first time I played the game, my group had a bad experience with this. None of us had played before, and each selected a different strategy. One person concentrated on large orders, one on privilege cards, and one on a mix of orders. The privilege card person cleaned house, winning easily by over a hundred ducats. It wasn't even close. The two losers became soured on the game because the one strategy was so much more effective.

Now, we did play with 3, and the game seems to be much better with 5, where it is far less likely that anyone is going to get so many privileges that they trounce the others so soundly.

I'm surprised to hear people say that privileges seem weak.
 
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Re:Privilege Card Question
I agree with Joe. Priv Cards are valuable - of that there can be no doubt. However, their value changes on a sliding scale - the ore of them a player has, the more valuable each incremental Priv Card becomes. If you only have one or two, they're not very valuable at all in your hands. Then, they become trade bait.

Therefore, the trick always is to control how many of each Priv Card a player has. Easy to say, hard to do in practice. The only advice I can give is to offer a Priv Card in trade only if your trade partner doesn't have a lot of them. (Of course, if he does, you can squeeze him for more - use the payoffs on the Priv Card to estimate how much he might make out of it and squeeze him for at least that much.)
 
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Robert Rossney
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Re:Privilege Card Question
Every game of this I've played has included a last-turn deal between the two players who collected the most privileges sharing their hands and figuring out how to split the joint increase in value that the two would share from an optimal trade.
 
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