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Star Wars: Rebellion – Rise of the Empire» Forums » General

Subject: New Players rss

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Ry Guy
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I am a veteran of the base game and just bought the expansion. For those of you who have played the new expansion, if I'm going to be playing with a brand new player to the game do you suggest we start with the base game or jump right into the expansion? Setup suggestions?

Thanks
 
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Don Draper
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Base game with new combat, and new cards but old starting units, a new player won't understand the nuisance of protecting the dsuc
 
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David Umstattd
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ryazii3000 wrote:
I am a veteran of the base game and just bought the expansion. For those of you who have played the new expansion, if I'm going to be playing with a brand new player to the game do you suggest we start with the base game or jump right into the expansion? Setup suggestions?

Thanks


The preset setup rules for the base game are fine for a game with newbies as picking setup can be really hard for new players. As for the expansion no real reason not to use the extra missions, objectives and leaders. The real question is if you use the advanced tactic cards or not. It is a bit complicated I will say. The whole "cards only block hits not damage" thing is tricky, especially for newbies I imagine. But if you teach the old combat system they'll just have to unlearn it later.
 
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jooice ZP
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ou1975 wrote:
Base game with new combat, and new cards but old starting units, a new player won't understand the nuisance of protecting the dsuc


this is a good suggestion!

Since you don't know the new cards as well the playing field will be slightly more level.
same goes for the objectives.
and I agree that for a first time player the DS is a good way to go.

Although Don's suggestion doesn't specify i am assuming he means to play with expansion units as well - otherwise the new combat system won't really work.

 
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Ry Guy
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So essentially I am using the new expansion with all the rules that come with it, except using the setup from the base game? Adding in the new combat, new mission/objective cards, and new units is the entire new expansion right? Am I missing anything?

I was just wondering if the new expansion makes the game more complex for a new player, but it seems like it doesn't with the exception of the new setup which requires an understanding of base strategy. Is that assessment correct?
 
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Ry Guy
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David Umstattd wrote:
ryazii3000 wrote:
I am a veteran of the base game and just bought the expansion. For those of you who have played the new expansion, if I'm going to be playing with a brand new player to the game do you suggest we start with the base game or jump right into the expansion? Setup suggestions?

Thanks


The preset setup rules for the base game are fine for a game with newbies as picking setup can be really hard for new players. As for the expansion no real reason not to use the extra missions, objectives and leaders. The real question is if you use the advanced tactic cards or not. It is a bit complicated I will say. The whole "cards only block hits not damage" thing is tricky, especially for newbies I imagine. But if you teach the old combat system they'll just have to unlearn it later.


What do you mean by "cards only block hits not damage"? I just read the expansion rules yesterday and I'm not 100% certain what this means. I'm thinking it means that tactic cards can't remove damage already taken from a previous round? Lightsaber rolls can do that though right?
 
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Dan P
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ryazii3000 wrote:
What do you mean by "cards only block hits not damage"? I just read the expansion rules yesterday and I'm not 100% certain what this means. I'm thinking it means that tactic cards can't remove damage already taken from a previous round? Lightsaber rolls can do that though right?
Cards that say "Prevent" red or black hits only affect dice that are rolled in that round of combat - the card prevents that number of dice hits from being assigned as damage.

Cards that "deal damage" assign that damage immediately, before any dice are rolled.

Sabers and cards that "remove" damage can only do so if damage has already been assigned, regardless of where that damage came from or what round it was done.
 
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Foggy Leggy
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For a new player I'd say use the mechanics (combat cards, characters, units etc. )from the expansion but use the old unit setup and the original mission decks, both of which are offered as choices in the expansion instruction manual.

Reasons:

The new rebel deck is (IMHO) harder to play than the old one while the new imperial one is stronger. For a newbie playing rebel this could be overwhelming as it's hard for new rebel players to wrap their heads around rebel strategy at first and the new objectives are (again IMHO) also a bit harder to pull off than the old ones. Given that the objective deck is now also blind build, it can be a bit much for new rebel players.

The older setup is also a bit easier on new players as it gives the rebel players a better starting fleet and one more system they can use as a base since the empire won't be choosing a space for a starting DSUC. Having a fully operational death star from the get-go is also more informative as to how a game plays to a newbie I think. Managing a DSUC is a slightly more advanced concept.
 
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Bob Klindworth
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Bobb Feta wrote:
Cards that say "Prevent" red or black hits only affect dice that are rolled in that round of combat - the card prevents that number of dice hits from being assigned as damage.


I'd also note that "hits" and "direct hits" are different things. The cards that prevent red or black hits specifically show the "hit" icon. In other words, they don't prevent "direct hits" unless the card specifically states it. "Damage" is the most inclusive term.
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Ry Guy
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BobKlindworth wrote:
Bobb Feta wrote:
Cards that say "Prevent" red or black hits only affect dice that are rolled in that round of combat - the card prevents that number of dice hits from being assigned as damage.


I'd also note that "hits" and "direct hits" are different things. The cards that prevent red or black hits specifically show the "hit" icon. In other words, they don't prevent "direct hits" unless the card specifically states it. "Damage" is the most inclusive term.


I'm beginning to understand how the new combat system could be confusing for a new player, as stated earlier by David. But it makes little sense to force them to relearn it later.
 
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Ry Guy
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gamer31141 wrote:
For a new player I'd say use the mechanics (combat cards, characters, units etc. )from the expansion but use the old unit setup and the original mission decks, both of which are offered as choices in the expansion instruction manual.

Reasons:

The new rebel deck is (IMHO) harder to play than the old one while the new imperial one is stronger. For a newbie playing rebel this could be overwhelming as it's hard for new rebel players to wrap their heads around rebel strategy at first and the new objectives are (again IMHO) also a bit harder to pull off than the old ones. Given that the objective deck is now also blind build, it can be a bit much for new rebel players.

The older setup is also a bit easier on new players as it gives the rebel players a better starting fleet and one more system they can use as a base since the empire won't be choosing a space for a starting DSUC. Having a fully operational death star from the get-go is also more informative as to how a game plays to a newbie I think. Managing a DSUC is a slightly more advanced concept.


Does using the original mission cards have an impact on other aspects of the expansion? Are the expansion leaders less valuable then?

I apologize for asking these questions without having played the expansion or having read all the new cards. I am trying to withhold from doing so in order to give myself some surprises.
 
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Don Draper
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No because you still include the new leaders mission cards even if using the original setup
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Sebastiaan Ringoot
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Would the combined wisdom of topic deem it wise to not use action cards for first time players?

Since they tend to break rules most of the time, I found using action cards with new players to cause a lot of damage.

I'm playing vs a new player yet experienced gamer myself soon, so far I figured out this:

- Expansion missions ( too lazy to change them again )
- Base game unit set up ( no DSUC troubles and fewer units the player must gasp and understand before starting )
- Advanced tactic cards ( doesn't matter which new system you have to explain )
- No action cards ( only for recruitment )
- Advanced set up, but helping the inexperienced player; giving him a few options, pointing out what he'll want or not want to do T1 etc.
- Have the new player read all the objectives and let him ask questions about them, make sure he understands all.








 
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jooice ZP
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Sringoot wrote:


- Expansion missions ( too lazy to change them again )
- Base game unit set up ( no DSUC troubles and fewer units the player must gasp and understand before starting )
- Advanced tactic cards ( doesn't matter which new system you have to explain )
- No action cards ( only for recruitment )
- Advanced set up, but helping the inexperienced player; giving him a few options, pointing out what he'll want or not want to do T1 etc.
- Have the new player read all the objectives and let him ask questions about them, make sure he understands all.




Expansion missions seems like a good idea, your familiarity will be closer to his (compared to the old missions), also agree with unit setup and tactics.
i also do advanced set-up, it is just too bland to play with basic setup.
going thru the objectives is a good idea. i would tell the new player which objectives in the game, while keeping myself in the dark, i think that trade off would be beneficial.

as for action cards, it would be quite a big hit to the game not to have them...i think. makes choosing the leaders really interesting.
if you are playing an experienced gamer i would keep them in.
i do think that giving the new player an extra leader is a good idea, the natural cap at 8 makes it even be more natural. give him SAW/Motti without the requirement of their starting action card.
 
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