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Legend of the Five Rings: The Card Game» Forums » General

Subject: Can I buy this game if I don't like to deckbuild? rss

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Alex Limoges
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It might seem strange, but I much prefer playing CCG's when I don't have to deckbuild... I like having a deep enough faction deck that I don't need to come up with a prebuilt personnal deck, and have my opponent do the same. It's time consuming and means we need to either deckbuild on the spot, or have multiple games and take time to do it at home.

I understand it's limiting, but for most games, it worked perfectly well for me. With Netrunner, I was able to play with the starter faction decks, having only bought one expansion to get some contracts, and all the deckbuilding we ever did was changing some contracts playing the corporations.

I played Summoner wars and never really changed anything to the decks. It's true that factions are numerous and it never got repetitive.

Same for Arkham Horror: I just use the starting decks and improve it with the XP points (I guess it's some form of deckbuilding)

I also played Call of Cthulhu the CCG with faction decks (but I have only a few games played).

How about L5R?
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Hedyn Brand
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Solipsiste wrote:
all the deckbuilding we ever did was changing some contracts playing the corporations.

You're doing it wrong! For tournament play, that is. You're doing it right for casual play if you're enjoying it

Quote:
I played Summoner wars and never really changed anything to the decks.

Seems like a game where there isn't much need anyway, from what I've read. You slap together some decks, perhaps add a recruit pack or whatever it's called, and you're golden.

Quote:
Same for Arkham Horror: I just use the starting decks and improve it with the XP points (I guess it's some form of deckbuilding)

You're doing it right! AHLCG is VERY casual in its deckbuilding; you can start with a bad deck, scrape through scenarios and just pump up your increasingly damaged investigators with cards from the expansion packs. That is exactly how it seems FFG intended it.

Quote:
I also played Call of Cthulhu the CCG with faction decks (but I have only a few games played).

I did the same, and we both might have been doing it wrong
But monofaction decks have great synergies on their own, and the resource system is so lenient. You focus on 60 cards just for the faction, which really is a lot.

Quote:
How about L5R?

There are a lot of neutral cards usable by all, so if you get enough cores and packs that both players can have an equal footing you can just keep making small upgrades to the faction-specific cards.

Strongholds seem to be generic, so give each side the same ones and just slap the faction cards you have together. It COULD be a build once and upgrade with expansions sort of game for casual players.

L5R is somewhat special since you build two decks, so you'll at least need 2-3 cores to actually have decent, fun and consistent decks for two players. But you will also have to do that initial build

I think you may be able to build 3-4 factions out of 3 cores, based on the number of neutral staples included. Perhaps more if you agree on 2x of each per deck. It will be fairly similar to how Netrunner is, except the whole wide card pool can be accessible to all factions. Take a look at the manual.
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Alex C
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As with almost any ccg/lcg out there you can netdeck something and have fun with that. Unless you plan on hitting the tournament scene that's perfectly acceptable.
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David Boeren
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You're going to have a deck of cards to play the game, there is no getting around this.

It doesn't matter who chooses the cards. If you don't like choosing them yourself, you can download a deck someone else made. It can be some guy online. It can be a list printed in a box. It can be a deck made by an expert. What's the difference?

Basically what I'm saying is that there is no spoon. I'm not sure the distinctions you're asking about actually exist unless you force them to in which case it's kind of your own choice then.

Speaking of Call of Cthulhu... I played this game at a competitive level and I can authoritatively say that mono-faction decks can be quite viable even at high levels of play. Most deck were dual-faction which was generally considered the "sweet spot". But, even more factions could at times be very good if you knew what you were doing which was one of the great things about the game, tremendous flexibility and creativity in deck design.
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Jasper Mangus
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gnurf wrote:

Strongholds seem to be generic, so give each side the same ones and just slap the faction cards you have together.

Strongholds are clan specific.
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Chopa wrote:
Strongholds are clan specific.

Ah, I thought it looked like they could be used by anyone in some description I read. In that case it could be simpler to work with fewer cores for that at least.
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gnurf wrote:
Quote:
Same for Arkham Horror: I just use the starting decks and improve it with the XP points (I guess it's some form of deckbuilding)

You're doing it right! AHLCG is VERY casual in its deckbuilding; you can start with a bad deck, scrape through scenarios and just pump up your increasingly damaged investigators with cards from the expansion packs. That is exactly how it seems FFG intended it.


If you want a really random game yeah sure. As for me, preconstructed and the lack of deckbuilding options with a single copy of the game really didn't make me enjoy AHLCG.
 
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Gil Miller

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The good thing about CCG's, and even more so with LCG's, is deckbuilding doesn't have to be overly involved if that's not a part of the game you're interested in.

I've played Magic for 25 years, and I still really enjoy playing most of the preconstructed products they release. And on the other hand, I love deckbuilding. These things aren't even remotely mutually exclusive. It just depends on what kind of experience you're looking for at the time.

With LCG's especially, deckbuilding can be approached from a long term, iterative design angle. Mean that, when you start out, usually with just one core set, you and a friend can pick out factions, slap together those precon deck lists that're (almost) always included, and start playing to get a feel for things. After a while, if you get more core sets, or just feel like a particular card or two just isn't pulling its weight, swap them out, then play some more with those changes. Small changes over time add up. Its a long term, organic approach to deckbuilding, without ever having to spend more than 5 minutes sitting down staring at a pile of cards, thinking about which ones to put in a deck.

Same thing when expansions come out. Usually, an LCG expansion pack will only have one or two cards a particular deck is interested in, especially with games like L5R or Doomtown, where there are a lot of faction-specific things.

Even if FFG doesn't provide decklists, it won't be long before the community comes up with some good, reasonably balanced lists, trust me. Community lists always end up being better, anyways, obviously (there will be lists for 1/2/3 core sets, they'll be more focused in general, and will usually be more balanced and lead to more enjoyable games than company lists). Then, once in a while, make a tweak here or there if/when you feel the need, or there's just some new cards you want to try out. At most, just make a note of what you're changing, assuming that you're taking the decks apart between sessions (which will probably be necessary if you want to try out multiple factions).

Deckbuilding doesn't need to be an overwhelming, time consuming process on its own. You can make it just a tiny fraction of your gaming experience, and still feel like you have some agency over what you're playing.

Razoupaf wrote:
If you want a really random game yeah sure. As for me, preconstructed and the lack of deckbuilding options with a single copy of the game really didn't make me enjoy AHLCG.


Yeah, the stock lists for AH didn't really lead to an enjoyable experience past the initial scenario. But then, I don't think they're really intended to. They do a fine job of letting you jump into the game, but it can get downright miserable after a while.
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Since everyone is dancing around it let me give it to you straight. If you do not like deck building do not buy this game. L5R uses a coordinated two deck system so it will amplify inferior card choices and ruin your day if you do not know what you are doing. Due to the complexity of coordinating two decks, netdecking will not teach you how to play what you have copied unless you are at least somewhat knowledgable about the meta. In addition, there is an immersive clan/faction flavor to the game that you will only be able to appreciate if you delve into the subtleties and interaction of deck creation. There are other games out there so why force that which should not be?

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Alex von der Linden
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... the guy said he didn't like deckbuilding, not that he was going to go into the game not knowing what he's doing. You don't have to build the car to be good at racing it.
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mathew rynich
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I think if you dislike deck building there are probably better games to spend your money on right now. For any LCG deck building is going to be a large part of the experience. That said you could always just look up tournament winning decks and play that way so it's not really a required aspect of the game. Though the deck building exercise will be replaced by deck researching so take that for what it's worth.
 
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Craig Hallstrom
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I don't love deck building either - but was a great fan of old Legends of the 5 Rings (O5R). It took very little effort to get the basic idea of what a deck type was like, copy it with the cards I had, add in whatever extra cards I needed that seemed similar and play.

I did a bit of casual play, tweaked it a bit and then took a deck like that to a Kotei. I went 3 out of 5 (though losing my first 2 so definitely performed well in the losers bracket).

Overall, L5R can be a really fun game to play. Figuring out how to drive a deck that someone else designed can be just as much a part of the fun as doing the design.
 
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