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Comanchería: The Rise and Fall of the Comanche Empire» Forums » Rules

Subject: When are stacking limits enforced? rss

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Phil Davies
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After a wonderfully tense game which has seen my band of Comanche harried and threatened but still clinging on, I am left with the following delicious situation:

It is the start of a new series of operations and the PoT marker is at 5 on the operations track, therefore there is a high probability that this will be my last set of operations before the end of the first age. I am currently fulfilling the victory check. However-

The West has one final empty space to fill with a settlement. That space being space 3 of Upper Arkansas. The West's instruction display has Settle (3) topmost and there are no enemy APs saved on the General Record Track. There is a high probability that the West will build at UA3 and therefore v probably cost me the game.

I can move a band from a nearby Racheria to UA3 and leave it there, but will this prevent the West from Settling there?

At first I was thinking as per the first bullet point of step two of 6.3.8 (Settle)-

Place the counter into a space within stacking limitations (2.4)

Therefore the Band that I place at UA3 would prevent the settlement from being placed as it would mean stacking limits are violated.

Reading 2.4 reinforces this; that the new settlement can't be placed as it violates stacking requirements but looking at the section marked Enforcement it says the following:

In each space where stacking limits are exceeded, remove Band counters to stock until the space is no longer in violation.

This has got me thinking that all placing a Band at UA3 will do is see it wiped out when stacking limits are enforced rather than stopping the West's settlement.

Any thoughts? Are the stacking limits enforced in this instant in favour of the Band stopping the settlement? (Theme-wise I see this as Spain not wanting to settle somewhere where Comanche bands have been spotted) or is the settlement still placed and the Band subsequently removed?

Joel does say in his tutorial that the Comanche liked to gamble so maybe I should play in true to their spirit and see if my gamble that the West doesn't activate over the next 4 turns, or accumulate enough APs to activate Settle, pays off...

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Phil Davies
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So here is how it went:

I had a idea. If I raided the West's settlement in Llano Estacado that would force the West to try to recover rather than Settle. I took the racheria's Mahimiana alongside a 2-5 Band and two sets of horses. I raided twice and had some success, but a lot of enemy AP generated. I then returned this Band to the rancheria with its loot. I then activated a second Band (another 2-5) to sit finished in Upper Arkansas 3.

A roll of 1 and one finished Band in racheria A meant the enemy got a free activation which was West (of course!) Settle became Recover (they succeeded) and I then pulled a 4 AP chit out of the bag and the Spanish in the West step up once again. Next activation was again a successful Recover meaning that the West could once again move against me. Which they certainly did! War 4 generated a war column, and then Peace (3) meant drawing a war card which was West:2. The column steamed up to my Band (losing a point to attrition).

Next operation. The war card gets me a lucky Travois and I pull Rancheria A from Upper Arkansas 4 to UA5 hoping that the column is suitably worn down by the time it reaches me. The battle goes badly and my lone Band is wiped out with no losses for the Spanish. With my culture on 1 and military on 0 I took a Culture action boosting my culture to 4 with the idea of next turn I would take a Planning action to lift my military as well as share out the successes that rancheria A had from raiding.

With no APs saved on the General Record Track the enemy pulls a 4AP chit and it is the West to go again. Top of their instruction display is Culture 3. With 3 settlements on the map it is a loss of 4 Culture.

Game over.

What a game! These last couple of turns only being only two highlights from many. It really felt as though the Spanish took umbrage at me trying to hold them out of Upper Arkansas and so they formed an army and wiped my Band off the map. As it was the Settle action was the least of my worries it was the loss of my culture that brought me down.
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To answer your question in the subject: only during the Operation Cleanup Phase (Rule 3.4, step 1).

Withnails liver wrote:
I can move a band from a nearby Racheria to UA3 and leave it there, but will this prevent the West from Settling there?


Yes.

Withnails liver wrote:
At first I was thinking as per the first bullet point of step two of 6.3.8 (Settle)-

Place the counter into a space within stacking limitations (2.4)


Exactly. When choosing the space where to place the Settlement counter, you cannot violate stacking limits, therefore a Band in UA3 would make that space unavailable for Settle.

The enforcement in Rule 3.4 is there because you can violate stacking limits when moving your Bands (nothing in Rule 5.2.2 restricts the choice of space, so your Bands can move anywhere).
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Phil Davies
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evacbs wrote:
To answer your question in the subject: only during the Operation Cleanup Phase (Rule 3.4, step 1).

Withnails liver wrote:
I can move a band from a nearby Racheria to UA3 and leave it there, but will this prevent the West from Settling there?


Yes.

Withnails liver wrote:
At first I was thinking as per the first bullet point of step two of 6.3.8 (Settle)-

Place the counter into a space within stacking limitations (2.4)


Exactly. When choosing the space where to place the Settlement counter, you cannot violate stacking limits, therefore a Band in UA3 would make that space unavailable for Settle.

The enforcement in Rule 3.4 is there because you can violate stacking limits when moving your Bands (nothing in Rule 5.2.2 restricts the choice of space, so your Bands can move anywhere).


Thank you. That's what I thought too but I felt that leaving a Band to prevent the West from settling was a bit too much like gaming the system.

As it was I did that anyway and, as can be seen in my resolution above, it was v much as though Spain reacted like a real opponent would have done: recoup losses then launch an attack on the lone Band, driving them away.
 
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