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Subject: Who wins the trick? rss

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Guillaume Desmarais
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Who wins the trick if both card share the same number and none of them is the trump suite ?
 
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Dustin Schwartz
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Horux wrote:
Who wins the trick if both card share the same number and none of them is the trump suite ?


In the scenario you present, the winner of the trick would be the player who led the trick (because their opponent did not follow suit).

The rulebook puts it this way (page 5): "If neither card in the trick is in the trump suit, the player who played the card in the lead suit with the highest rank wins the trick."
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Marco Olivares
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I would say the first one who played. The second player does not respond with the same suit and higher value, does not respond with a trump.... so he loses the trick.
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Jason Winter
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this rule does not seem clarify the question as presented. it does not seem to refer to tied values nor does it say you loose the trick if you cannot follow lead suit regardless of value. i have always believed do what the rules say not what they do not say. It states if you do not meet the criteria listed for a win "the lead suit with the highest rank wins" it must not be a win. it must be a loss. other wise you would loose every time you couldn't follow suit as if you had trump. we play that neither wins the trick. you didn't beat it with a trump card you didn't beat it with a higher value. so it seems to me in a tie no one wins. you could house rule next win, wins both tricks. but if it is the last 2 cards played no one wins the trick. either way it does need to be clarified. we played the 7 on the last card neither is trump suit. neither card meets win criteria neither is a win. it does not say any where lead suit wins regardless of value it states it has to have a higher value.
 
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darksurtur
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Jason Winter wrote:
this rule does not seem clarify the question as presented. it does not seem to refer to tied values nor does it say you loose the trick if you cannot follow lead suit regardless of value. i have always believed do what the rules say not what they do not say. It states if you do not meet the criteria listed for a win "the lead suit with the highest rank wins" it must not be a win. it must be a loss. other wise you would loose every time you couldn't follow suit as if you had trump. we play that neither wins the trick. you didn't beat it with a trump card you didn't beat it with a higher value. so it seems to me in a tie no one wins. you could house rule next win, wins both tricks. but if it is the last 2 cards played no one wins the trick. either way it does need to be clarified. we played the 7 on the last card neither is trump suit. neither card meets win criteria neither is a win. it does not say any where lead suit wins regardless of value it states it has to have a higher value.


It clearly says "the card in the lead suit with the highest rank wins."
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Gillum the Stoor
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Right.

It's a question of interpreting the English properly.

It means, look at all the cards of the suit led (assuming no trump played), and identify the one of those with the highest rank. That card wins the trick.

It does not mean, a card wins a trick if it is of the suit led and has rank higher than any other card played.

Not only is the first interpretation fairly standard among trick-taking games (and a natural English-language interpretation), the latter fails to cover all cases.
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Jason Winter
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just got clarification.
it seams if a Key is trump and i play a Bell 2 and the other player plays a moon 11. bell 2 wins. in my earlier case on last trick we both played 7's neither were the trump suit she led with a Moon i played my last card a Bell 7 she wins the trick. because i couldn't follow suit. just as the other posters previously stated.

My argument was that in case of a tie no one has a higher rank and in order to win based on the rules is seemed higher rank would win rank is number not lead suit but i was wrong.
if you cannot follow lead with trump or suit. lead suit wins regardless of "rank"
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Jason Winter
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i felt the lead suit would not have a higher rank if i played a card with a higher rank

you are saying rank means nothing if it is not of the suit led or trump.

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Gillum the Stoor
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Jason Winter wrote:
you are saying rank means nothing if it is not of the suit led or trump.

That is correct.

In addition, the rank of the suit led means nothing if there is a trump played.

(You do, however, get to use the power of odd ranks - e.g., a 5 lets you draw then discard a card - regardless of its suit.)
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Jay M
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In fairness to those having trouble seeing it, this is a long tradition in trick-taking games such as Bridge, Spades, Hearts, etc. Those of us who understood this game in that context had that extra context.

It's always been the case that the only two suits of any consequence in a trick are the lead suit and the trump suit. All other plays are called "sluffing" or "sloughing" (same word).
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Randy Hoyt
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(Publisher here. @Jason emailed with me about this question this morning, and he asked me to post my reply.)

If two non-trump cards of the same rank but different suits are played in one trick, the player who led wins the trick.

Here's a more detailed explanation:

* Trump: Keys

* Player A leads 7 Moons.
* Player B follows with 7 Bells.

As Dustin pointed out, the rulebook says this (page 5): "If neither card in the trick is in the trump suit, the player who played the card in the lead suit with the highest rank wins the trick." The lead suit in this example is Moons, so the player who played the highest Moon card wins the trick.

In fact, the number of the Bell played by Player B does not matter (unless of course it also has a special power that changes something). Even if Player B followed with 10 Bells, Player A would still win the trick: the 7 Moons is still the highest Moon.

I hope that helps!
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Joshua Buergel
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The compact way I always write it is "The highest trump card wins the trick. If none, the highest card of the lead suit wins." This isn't super easy to learn from, but it's certainly terse.
 
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