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Subject: Loop Garoux Setup Help? rss

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Shane Childress
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Alright, so we are planning on playing the mentioned mission tonight, but while I was looking over it to familiarize myself with the setup, I am completely at a loss regarding the Minions. My interpretation of it seems to leave some glaring questions, so here goes.

If you are playing with 4 Saints, as we are, it says to flip face down the Lizzards, Mancubs, Skunks and Matadors. When you encounter a Minion, if its facedown you just go straight to Win, so that means 4 players only have 2 Minions they really have to fight? Yet if you are playing 1 or 2 players, it says to only flip the first couple of gangs (Lizzards and Mancubs), so fewer players have more fights in the same number of nexuses? That sounds incredibly unbalanced if I am right. Nothing seems to indicate a way that the facedown cards can flip though, so I think I am correct in this.

In a 5 or 6 player game you will use all the gangs, I guess, so that makes sense. But to me, the rules regarding 1 or 2, and 1 to 4 almost seem... backwards? So if you have 2 Saints, you would facedown four of the gangs and only have to fight two, whereas 3 and 4 Saint games would facedown the Lizzards and Mancubs and have four gangs to deal with. Then 5 or 6 Saints would have all. Doesn't that seem more... reasonable?

Anyone with thoughts or opinions, I would love to know what you think or how you handled this scenario. Hopefully I can figure this out before gametime or we will have to pick a different scenario on the fly.

Thanks everyone!
 
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Gado Del Ellion
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I think this mission setup is worded a bit awkwardly. I believe the intention is that for 1-2 players, 4 minions are flipped. For 3-4 players, 2 minions are flipped.

The 'also' is probably what's causing you confusion, but think of it like this. It tells you to flip 2 minions if you're playing with 1-2 players, which you're not, so you don't. Then it tells you to also flip 2 minions if you're playing with 3-4, which you are. The also isn't telling you to do both flips, it's telling you to check for both parameters.
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Byron Campbell
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Santa Clarita
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I agree with Gado's interpretation. The first flip says "1 OR 2," while the next flip says "1 TO 4." Since you are not playing with one or two players, you ignore the first flip. The "also" is not helpful here, and the flips should have been listed in the opposite order.
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Shane Childress
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Thank you for your quick replies! I can see now how it's very easily a wording problem. And it makes much more sense. Much appreciated! Wish us luck on our first foray into the turf wars of Chicago!
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David Spetz
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kittenhoarder wrote:
I agree with Gado's interpretation. The first flip says "1 OR 2," while the next flip says "1 TO 4." Since you are not playing with one or two players, you ignore the first flip. The "also" is not helpful here, and the flips should have been listed in the opposite order.


I actually have the opposite outlook on it, and agree with Shane that it seems to make the game easier when you have more people (which is strange but maybe mechanically fitting). I read it as "if you play with up to two players do X, if you play with up to four players do X and Y". That is the only real way that the sentence makes sense as written, because "also" can only refer to flipping the first two cards facedown.

I have currently been thinking about how playing the mission with only two face up minions would work out with four people. The best thing I can come up with is that you have an easier time fighting off the gangs now, but you lose out on possible lycanthropy that might be good or bad later in the campaign. Either that or there is a much more blatant error in the missions set up. I am going to run it tonight with the four minions flipped down and see what happens.
 
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Aviva Schecterson
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Hey, just to clear this up:

With 1-2 players, you should confront The Jacks and The Griffs.
With 1-4 players, you should confront the The Jacks, The Griffs, The Lizzards, The Mancubs.
With 1-6 players, you will need to confront all the gangs.

I understand how this wording may be confusing, as the “also” makes it seem like you flip more cards when you have up to 4 players:
If playing with 1 or 2 saints, flip The Lizzards and The Mancubs facedown. If playing with 1 to 4 saints, also flip The Skunks and The Matadors.

Perhaps if you read it this way, it may make sense:
If playing with 1 or 2 saints, flip the archetypes for The Lizzards, The Matadors, The Mancubs, and The Skunks facedown. If playing with 3 or 4 saints, flip only The Matadors and The Skunks. If playing with 5 or 6 saints, display all the archetypes faceup.
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patrick mullen
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The overlap of 1-X is what is most confusing to me. I would say:
all player counts - confront jacks and griffs
with more than 2 players - add the lizards and mancubs
with more than 4 players - add the matadors and skunks

or

1-2: confront jacks and the griffs
3-4: confront jacks, griffs, lizards, and mancubs
5-6: confront jacks, griffs, lizards, mancubs, matadors, and skunks

or

if playing with less than 5: dont include matadors and skunks
if playing with less than 3: dont include lizards or mancubs
 
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C Sandifer
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Lutherville
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AvivaYalla wrote:
Hey, just to clear this up:

With 1-2 players, you should confront The Jacks and The Griffs.
With 1-4 players, you should confront the The Jacks, The Griffs, The Lizzards, The Mancubs.
With 1-6 players, you will need to confront all the gangs.


Shouldn't this be:

With 1-2 players, you should confront The Jacks and The Griffs.
With 3-4 players, you should confront the The Jacks, The Griffs, The Lizzards, The Mancubs.
With 5-6 players, you will need to confront all the gangs.

If not, I'm more confused than when I started.

Edit: OK, that's what the person above just said. Can you be ninja'd 2 days ago? Probably not.
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David Spetz
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Something else that I wanted to point out, having just played this mission last night:

The mission set up says to layout out the nexuses in a loop, and then to have the Train move around the loop. The actual wording says that the train moves to the left, but that felt a little confusing considering you are talking about a circle. So instead we decided that the train moved clockwise.

We did the same thing with the nexuses, setting the Station and then laying out the rest of them clockwise in the order listed in the storybook. That way the train moves through the loop in the right order.

I actually really liked this mission and thought it was a good intro to the Skinwalkers chapter, but the layout in the storybook definitely could use some clarification.
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Aviva Schecterson
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wkover wrote:
AvivaYalla wrote:
Hey, just to clear this up:

With 1-2 players, you should confront The Jacks and The Griffs.
With 1-4 players, you should confront the The Jacks, The Griffs, The Lizzards, The Mancubs.
With 1-6 players, you will need to confront all the gangs.


Shouldn't this be:

With 1-2 players, you should confront The Jacks and The Griffs.
With 3-4 players, you should confront the The Jacks, The Griffs, The Lizzards, The Mancubs.
With 5-6 players, you will need to confront all the gangs.

If not, I'm more confused than when I started.

Edit: OK, that's what the person above just said. Can you be ninja'd 2 days ago? Probably not.


You're right, sorry. I'm not sure why I was thinking in that pattern. Regardless, I hope everything is clear now
 
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Desi W.
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We're trying to play this scenario now, and we aren't sure where to shuffle in the Minion archetypes...into only the two Nexuses that have The Griffs and the Jacks, or one minion per Nexus, and when we get a Minion Archetype, we fight either Jacks or Griffs. How do we know when to fight which Minion?

(Playing 2-player.)
 
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Canada
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As per the rules in the storybook:
-- During setup, 1 random card from Minion 1-6 is seeded into each nexus.
-- When you confront a Minion card, if its corresponding True Threat card is displayed face down, you automatically win that confrontation (go to Win).

With 2 players, that means you automatically go to Win against Minion 3-6. For Minion 1 and Minion 2, you go through the confrontation against its corresponding True Threat as usual.
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Desi W.
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Ghotimonger wrote:
As per the rules in the storybook:
-- During setup, 1 random card from Minion 1-6 is seeded into each nexus.
-- When you confront a Minion card, if its corresponding True Threat card is displayed face down, you automatically win that confrontation (go to Win).

With 2 players, that means you automatically go to Win against Minion 3-6. For Minion 1 and Minion 2, you go through the confrontation against its corresponding True Threat as usual.

Thanks. That's what we did, but it felt a little odd just auto-winning, not that we minded. Good to know we got it right.
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