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Subject: Few rules questions after first turn rss

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Chris
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A few things that popped up on my first turn, I tried to find answers in the rulebook, but couldn't find them. I might be missing something.

1. I drew a mine/HMG package, mines have been placed on the triggering unit, they subsequently activated them (of course shake). Does the mine attack stack with other VOFs, or count as its own. It is not listed under the modifying VOFs in the NCM sequence, and the entries in chapter 9 do not really state anything. I went with using it as the worst VOF modifier (like incoming) and ignored the automatic VOF by the HMG.

2. Do the mines likewise incur the -1 burst modifier on some terrain cards? I went with yes, since it would make sense to me (burst icon, explosion would probably burst in real life as well, etc.).

3. Is there a mechanical difference between the single burst icon on action cards and the three icons? Note that I do play via Tabletop Simulator so far since the 2nd edition has not arrived at my place, so in case there is a PAC that explains it in the physical copy, I do not have access yet... (btw, I assume the icon with the three shaded soldiers is used for infiltration moves?)

Thanks a lot for the help!

Chris
 
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William Jason Raynovich
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I am not an expert but if you want a quick reply:

ElFluppe wrote:
A few things that popped up on my first turn, I tried to find answers in the rulebook, but couldn't find them. I might be missing something.

1. I drew a mine/HMG package, mines have been placed on the triggering unit, they subsequently activated them (of course shake). Does the mine attack stack with other VOFs, or count as its own. It is not listed under the modifying VOFs in the NCM sequence, and the entries in chapter 9 do not really state anything. I went with using it as the worst VOF modifier (like incoming) and ignored the automatic VOF by the HMG.


There are types of VOF. You go with the "worst" and add modifiers. So, yes, you would ignore the HMG VoF and that HMG unit would still waste ammo. However, you might get modifiers like Crossfire.




ElFluppe wrote:

2. Do the mines likewise incur the -1 burst modifier on some terrain cards? I went with yes, since it would make sense to me (burst icon, explosion would probably burst in real life as well, etc.).


I do not have the rules in front of, but I am fairly certain the answer is no. I believe this from my knowledge of the reason there is an addition modifier in Woods and other such cards. . . artillery and mortar fire has additional impact because of the branches and extra material that "rains" down on the troops from above. Many wargames have this modifier. Mines, I would assume do not have this modifier, because they are exploding from below.

ElFluppe wrote:

3. Is there a mechanical difference between the single burst icon on action cards and the three icons? Note that I do play via Tabletop Simulator so far since the 2nd edition has not arrived at my place, so in case there is a PAC that explains it in the physical copy, I do not have access yet... (btw, I assume the icon with the three shaded soldiers is used for infiltration moves?)


Yes, the three burst icons means that additional cards are hit in the strike. If memory serves correctly, the player decides where they hit if it is US and randomizer decides if it is the enemy.

Yes, three shaded soldiers is for infiltration.

ElFluppe wrote:

Thanks a lot for the help!

Chris
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Antonio B-D
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Spot on
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Juno
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raynovich wrote:
If memory serves correctly, the player decides where they hit if it is US

The player decides where they hit with the condition that the terrains cards must be adjacent to the original target.
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William Jason Raynovich
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juno29 wrote:
raynovich wrote:
If memory serves correctly, the player decides where they hit if it is US

The player decides where they hit with the condition that the terrains cards must be adjacent to the original target.


Doh! Of course. Just assumed that that would be assumed, but should have said it.

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Todd Hughes
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the THREE BURST icons represent Battalion Fire Missions... and only matter if the mission you are playing states that Battalion Fire Missions are available. (check the briefing book).

G. Battalion Fire Mission
"A variation of an HE or TOT Mission is the Battalion Fire Mission, which is only available to artillery. If a drawn card contains the 3-Bursts icon and if the Mission Instructions say Battalion Fire Missions are available, then you may perform a Battalion Fire Mission. Choose two Terrain cards bordering the original target card; place a Pending Fire Mission marker on these cards, too. These two cards do not have to be in the LOS of the observer."

pg.38 Fields of Fire Rulebook.
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Chris
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mthughes wrote:
the THREE BURST icons represent Battalion Fire Missions... and only matter if the mission you are playing states that Battalion Fire Missions are available. (check the briefing book).

G. Battalion Fire Mission
"A variation of an HE or TOT Mission is the Battalion Fire Mission, which is only available to artillery. If a drawn card contains the 3-Bursts icon and if the Mission Instructions say Battalion Fire Missions are available, then you may perform a Battalion Fire Mission. Choose two Terrain cards bordering the original target card; place a Pending Fire Mission marker on these cards, too. These two cards do not have to be in the LOS of the observer."

pg.38 Fields of Fire Rulebook.


Thanks a lot for the page! I skipped any Fire Missions that I did not have to deal with on the first mission!

I assume the three burst icon still counts towards any Fire Mission Request though? Or are they ignored completely if not used for the Battalion Fire Mission?
 
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Todd Hughes
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Absolutely, the three burst icon still counts toward any fire mission request. You just get to have some extra fun if the mission you're playing supports Battalion fire missions :-)
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Chris
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Thanks a lot to everyone, having a blast with this game (literally in some cases...whistle)
 
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Ron Lacock
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Here is some good help for understanding how to calculate VOF:

https://sites.google.com/site/fieldsoffirebootcamp/rules-ref...
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Chris
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A few follow ups:

4.3.1 notes that I do not need proper Communication to give a cease fire/shift fire to units on a card. Do I still need proper Command though? (e.g. if I have 1st Platoon HQ and a few of its squads on the card, and also a squad from 2nd Platoon, can I give a cease fire to all of them with 1st Platoon HQ? I assume the answer is no and I should not intermix in the first place, just wondering)

5.1.6A indicates that a paralyzed or pinned unit cannot move casualties or assets. Does that mean a paralyzed unit that retreats in the mutual retreat phase drops its phone?

And more of a design question (so not sure there is an answer! ): Why is diagonal movement through a PDF prohibited?
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Jerry Tresman
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ElFluppe wrote:
A few follow ups:

4.3.1 notes that I do not need proper Communication to give a cease fire/shift fire to units on a card. Do I still need proper Command though? (e.g. if I have 1st Platoon HQ and a few of its squads on the card, and also a squad from 2nd Platoon, can I give a cease fire to all of them with 1st Platoon HQ? I assume the answer is no and I should not intermix in the first place, just wondering)


Yes it is an action 4.2.4 I. "All occupants of a card with a VOF Rating whether in communication with the originator or not" and Page 29"However, once units are Engaged, they will not cease or shift fire without Commands,.." The PDF is shifted to a Card in LOS of the originator.


Strictly speaking you must follow the command hierarchy , however as all units follow the same PDF then as it shifts , all basic VoF's (incoming, already placed grenade and grenade miss etc are not basic and will remain in place) exerted from that card will be reassessed and if they still have a LOS will shift with it regardless of the command heirarchy of the originator.


The rules page 31 6.2.3 need amending from "A VOF may change but the PDF stays the same" to A VOF may change but the PDF stays the same until a shift fire or cease fire order is given.
Cease fire removes the PDF and VoFs but if there is a target they will immediately place a VoF and PDF. Shift fire is a reverse of this process in that instead of placing a VoF and then a PDF you shift the PDF and then adjust the VoF's.

There are no rules to restrict shifting a PDF so that the new direction has a valid target, if there is not a valid target I treat this case as a Cease fire Command (in an ideal world you wouldn't give a shift fire order if there were no ntargets but the battlefield can be and normally is a confusing place.

ElFluppe wrote:

5.1.6A indicates that a paralyzed or pinned unit cannot move casualties or assets. Does that mean a paralyzed unit that retreats in the mutual retreat phase drops its phone?


No , nor does it drop it's rifle , it only drops a phone or radio:- " if the last or only step of a unit with a phone becomes a casualty, there is a 1-in-2 chance that its phone will be destroyed. Select an Action card, noting the result in the “2” column of the card’s Random Assignment Area. If the result is a “1,” the phone is destroyed; remove it from play. If the result is a “2,” place the Phone marker on the map. You can have another unit pick it up and use it if commanded to do so (4.2.2h)"
ElFluppe wrote:

And more of a design question (so not sure there is an answer! ): Why is diagonal movement through a PDF prohibited?



Preacher wrote:
Straight from Ben:

The prohibition against diagonal movement through a friendly PDF is to prevent a gamey tactic of gaining the flank of an enemy without consequences. The rules will allow you to move into friendly fire card, the rule is not about doctrine or common sense, it is an artifact of the abstraction of a grid of terrain and combat resolution occurring at the end of the turn. A diagonal move through a PDF has no combat resolution. Only occupying a card at the end of a move has a combat resolution.

Hopefully that helps understand the why diagonal and not lateral. In the example the lateral movement is allowed as the unit will suffer the consequences of being under fire from both friendly and enemy fire. The prohibited diagonal move would have the unit gaining the flank of an enemy by crossing in front of his base of fire, but because combat is resolved at the end of the turn there would be no effect.


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