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Unconditional Surrender! World War 2 in Europe» Forums » Rules

Subject: Circumventing Straits rss

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Chris Welden
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According to the rules, it costs +2 movement to cross a strait during a naval move. However, in many cases, in order to cross a strait at all, the phasing faction must already control one or more sides of the strait due to cities found there.

Using a Western Allies controlled Gibraltar as an example, couldn't a western fleet, having already paid the cost to move into Sea Zone 16 simply move into Gibraltar for free and then out into Sea Zone 17 at a cost of one movement?

The example for Naval Transport (6.4.4) seems to suggest that this is a perfectly acceptable thing to do. Am I missing something?

Thanks ahead of time.
 
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Salvatore Vasta
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Camerus wrote:
Using a Western Allies controlled Gibraltar as an example, couldn't a western fleet, having already paid the cost to move into Sea Zone 16 simply move into Gibraltar for free and then out into Sea Zone 17 at a cost of one movement?


No. Because it is all part of one activation, the naval unit is considered moving through the strait. If it helps, think of moving into the port (rather than the hex containing the port) as actually docking in the port. That would be the equivalent of ending the naval unit's activation.

Quote:
The example for Naval Transport (6.4.4) seems to suggest that this is a perfectly acceptable thing to do. Am I missing something?


In that example, the naval unit is not docking in Suez or Port Said, but entering one end of the canal and exiting the other.

A player can avoid paying the strait crossing MP in the manner you described. However, to do so requires a second activation, i.e. you land and end one activation in Gibraltar and then activate again and move out of Gibraltar. You avoid the movement points, but gain another Sortie.

Sal
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Chris Welden
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Thanks for the quick response Sal. Maybe the living rules are out of date?

The example I have says this:
Quote:
The air unit is now in Alexandria; its activation ends and it adds one
Sortie to bring its total to two. The naval units still have three
movement points left. The Western faction then moves them into
Sea Zone 26, into Port Said, through the Suez Canal, and finally
into Suez. Their activation ends and each add one Sortie. The
warship has two and the convoy has three.
Since the air and naval units still have less than 6 Sorties, they could
activate again this Actions Sub-Phase.


So the fleet and convoy didn't drop the air unit off in either Suez or Port Said. Rather, they moved onto Alexandria, dropped the air unit off, and then moved out of the port.

For what it's worth, although I find the naval rules a little finnicky, I love the game!

-- Chris
 
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Salvatore Vasta
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Camerus wrote:
Thanks for the quick response Sal. Maybe the living rules are out of date?


Oh, probably so, I need to look at that.

Quote:
The example I have says this:
Quote:
The air unit is now in Alexandria; its activation ends and it adds one
Sortie to bring its total to two. The naval units still have three
movement points left. The Western faction then moves them into
Sea Zone 26, into Port Said, through the Suez Canal, and finally
into Suez. Their activation ends and each add one Sortie. The
warship has two and the convoy has three.
Since the air and naval units still have less than 6 Sorties, they could
activate again this Actions Sub-Phase.


So the fleet and convoy didn't drop the air unit off in either Suez or Port Said. Rather, they moved onto Alexandria, dropped the air unit off, and then moved out of the port.


Ah, I better understand you. Yes, moving in and out of the port, even as part of a naval transport when you drop off a unit, doesn't cost a movement point. However, that still does not negate the cost to move through a strait if it is all part of a single activation.

Quote:
For what it's worth, although I find the naval rules a little finnicky, I love the game!


Glad you do. Have fun!

Sal
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Chris Welden
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Sorry to keep dragging this out but I still don't think we've gotten to the core of my issue.

This is what you said:
Quote:
If it helps, think of moving into the port (rather than the hex containing the port) as actually docking in the port. That would be the equivalent of ending the naval unit's activation.


This is from the naval transport example (6.4.4):
Quote:
Units in a Map Box can be considered stacked so the convoy and warship are also activated. All three then move into the Arabian Sea Map Box, into Sea Zone 31, into Suez, through the Suez Canal, into Port Said, into Sea Zone 26, and into Alexandria. This costs seven naval movement points. Remember moving into and out of ports does not cost movement points.
The air unit is now in Alexandria; its activation ends and it adds one Sortie to bring its total to two. The naval units still have three movement points left. The Western faction then moves them into Sea Zone 26, into Port Said, through the Suez Canal, and finally into Suez. Their activation ends and each add one Sortie.


I don't know how to reconcile your assertion that moving into a port ends the unit's activation with the naval transport example which shows a naval unit moving into a port (not a strait) and back out of it as part of the same activation. Unless I'm misunderstanding, if your statement is correct then the example is wrong. And if the example is correct, then it seems like I can circumvent the strait in my Gibraltar example.
 
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Salvatore Vasta
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Camerus wrote:
Sorry to keep dragging this out but I still don't think we've gotten to the core of my issue.


No problem. Let's try it again.

In your original post you talked about a naval unit avoiding the extra strait mp cost by moving into and out of the Gibraltar port during the move (as opposed to starting or ending in Gibraltar). I understood that to be a Rebase Action.

A Rebase starts and ends in a port. A unit does not move into and out of other ports during that move. Nor can one do that to avoid paying the strait cost. There are two exceptions to moving into port hexes during a naval move (and I don't think of them as exceptions). One has to do with moving through a canal and the other is Naval Transport.

If moving through a canal, the naval unit needs to move into and out of the port hexes on either end of a canal. The ports at either end are almost irrelevant. They merely represent both ends of the canal.

A Naval Transport Action does allow for temporarily stopping in a port during a move in order to drop off the transported unit. The naval unit can then either ends its activation in that port or continue moving. If it continues moving, it is simply following the movement rules it would for a Rebase. That is, if it is passing from one Sea Zone across a strait into another Sea Zone, it pays the strait mp cost. The fact that it dropped off a unit in a port that is part of the strait does not matter.

Now if the above is still confusing, you can consider the following a ruling.

A naval unit performing naval movement pays to cross a Strait unless it begins in its activation in one of the hexes the Strait symbol points to.

Sal
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Chris Welden
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I see. I was mistakenly assuming that any naval movement followed the same rules, regardless of the particular naval action (e.g. rebase vs. transport) being taken. Instead, I just need to treat the rules for each action independently.

Thanks for working through that with me, arduous though it may have been.

Cheers,
-- Chris
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