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Aeon's End: War Eternal» Forums » Rules

Subject: Magus of Cloaks DR rss

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Eliwood Sain
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So MoC always has at least 2 points of damage reduction on him at all times. Is there a minimum of 1 damage dealt by any given spell to him or can his passive DR completely negate the damage of Sparks and other one damage spells (except those on Sigil Breaches)?
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Crazed Survivor
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If it doesn't say that damage is reduced to 1, the way Increased Wayward One does, then no, there is no minimum amount of damage.
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Kevin 'qxc' Riley
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Many spells will deal 0 damage to Magus of Cloaks. He presents a unique challenge that requires more planning and foresight than most other nemeses. GLHF!
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Kevin Windsor
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I want to make sure I am playing this correctly. If a spell does 0 damage, we do still remove a nemesis token?
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Crazed Survivor
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Yes. Phrased as it is,
- Target Magus.
- Calculate damage.
- Reduce damage by the amount of tokens.
- Remove a token.

So if you cast 2 sparks in his face, you remove 2 tokens, since it's one token per damage instance.
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Kevin 'qxc' Riley
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Razoupaf wrote:
Yes. Phrased as it is,
- Target Magus.
- Calculate damage.
- Reduce damage by the amount of tokens.
- Remove a token.

So if you cast 2 sparks in his face, you remove 2 tokens, since it's one token per damage instance.


regardless of how much life MoC actually loses.
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Anon Y. Mous
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This is more strategy than rules discussion, but the damage reduction has some really interesting properties.

Assuming you keep his tokens to a minimum, his effective HP varies based on the average damage of the spells you're hitting him with.

Average of 1-2 damage: can't deal damage
Average of 3 damage: 105 effective HP
Average of 4 damage: 70 effective HP (this is the "typical" Nemesis HP)
Average of 5 damage: 58.3 effective HP
Average of 6 damage: 52.5 effective HP

On increased difficulty, this calculation changes drastically.
Average of 1-3 damage: can't deal damage
Average of 4 damage: 140 effective HP
Average of 5 damage: 87.5 effective HP
Average of 6 damage: 70 effective HP
Average of 7 damage: 61.25 effective HP
...

This means on Normal, you want to be hitting him with 4+ damage spells about as often as you would be hitting a typical Nemesis to keep your damage output equivalent to what it would be against a typical 70-HP Nemesis. Whereas on Increased difficulty, that requirement goes up to 6 damage. And that's assuming you can keep his DR down to the minimum consistently, easier said than done. Mages with powerful burst damage like Garu and Quilius seem like they would be greatly appreciated in this fight, but you probably also want to dedicate someone to keeping pressure on the MoC's DR to let these bigger attacks land at full force.
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Nat Li
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Sorry I have a question about this too....

So every spell is a new instance of damage right?

does that mean if i had two 4-damage spells casted, and MoC had 4 tokens, then the first spell does 0 dam, remove a token, and then second spell 1 damage, remove another token?

Can't add the spells damage to 8 and deal 4 damage and remove 1 token right?
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alafter wrote:
Sorry I have a question about this too....

So every spell is a new instance of damage right?

does that mean if i had two 4-damage spells casted, and MoC had 4 tokens, then the first spell does 0 dam, remove a token, and then second spell 1 damage, remove another token?

Can't add the spells damage to 8 and deal 4 damage and remove 1 token right?

That is correct. You cannot combine spells into a single instance of damage - those are two separate instances of damage, and both have to deal with the reduction and remove tokens separately.
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Lai Edcy
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If there are 7 tokens on MOC, and unleash once. What will happen?
1.add 2 tokens and capped at maximum 8 tokens.
2.it cannot add 2 tokens, so gravehold suffers 2 dmg.
 
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Kevin 'qxc' Riley
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Edcylai wrote:
If there are 7 tokens on MOC, and unleash once. What will happen?
1.add 2 tokens and capped at maximum 8 tokens.
2.it cannot add 2 tokens, so gravehold suffers 2 dmg.


The second option
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Anon Y. Mous
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You do as much of the option as you can, so you add 1 token. If MOC had 8 tokens, then you have to choose the Gravehold damage option because you can't resolve the first option at all.
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Ethereality wrote:
You do as much of the option as you can, so you add 1 token. If MOC had 8 tokens, then you have to choose the Gravehold damage option because you can't resolve the first option at all.


That's incorrect - it's written in the rules that if you have two options and you cannot fully resolve one, then you must resolve the other. You only worry about partial resolution when you're not able to fully resolve either - in that case, you're forced to choose the one you can resolve more completely.

In this case, it's impossible to fully resolve "Add 2 Token", so you must resolve the Gravehold damage instead. Remember, even if that damage would destroy Gravehold and put its life in the negatives, that's still a proper 'full resolution' of any damaging effect.

(It might be debatable which you can resolve more completely in those scenarios, but I haven't actually encountered that in play as of yet.)
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Crazed Survivor
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Ruduen wrote:
Ethereality wrote:
You do as much of the option as you can, so you add 1 token. If MOC had 8 tokens, then you have to choose the Gravehold damage option because you can't resolve the first option at all.


That's incorrect - it's written in the rules that if you have two options and you cannot fully resolve one, then you must resolve the other. You only worry about partial resolution when you're not able to fully resolve either - in that case, you're forced to choose the one you can resolve more completely.

In this case, it's impossible to fully resolve "Add 2 Token", so you must resolve the Gravehold damage instead. Remember, even if that damage would destroy Gravehold and put its life in the negatives, that's still a proper 'full resolution' of any damaging effect.

(It might be debatable which you can resolve more completely in those scenarios, but I haven't actually encountered that in play as of yet.)


Gravehold can take the damage. You're not asking it to pay life it doesn't have. You're asking it to take damage. And then the next time the game checks the state of the game, it notices Gravehold has zero or less life, and then the players lose the game.
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