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Subject: The No-End Game rss

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Steve Crow
United States
Iowa City
Iowa
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We seemed to get into a game that couldn't end the other night. We couldn't build enough to get through the Building Tile stack or build anymore (which meant no one could exhaust their building supply). The cultural tokens had all been snatched up by the Specialist that gets an extra cultural token, so we couldn't buy out the specialists. We had plenty of boats in reserve.

In fact, we had run through all of the money in the game and were forced to writing it down on paper.

Our question is, when do boats go back into the reserve, and when they do they go out of the game? For instance, if you sell boats, where do they go? We had so many boats at the end that it seemed like some of them should have been out of the game. The rules for (for instance) selling aren't clear.

Thanks!
 
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Matt L.
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I'd love to see more details (have a picture?) of the board state.

Question though, check the component list in the rulebook and verify that you don't have too many ships of any color, I got like 6 extra Red ships in my box, which could be a problem.
 
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David Chapman
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Gislef wrote:
We seemed to get into a game that couldn't end the other night. We couldn't build enough to get through the Building Tile stack or build anymore (which meant no one could exhaust their building supply). The cultural tokens had all been snatched up by the Specialist that gets an extra cultural token, so we couldn't buy out the specialists. We had plenty of boats in reserve.

In fact, we had run through all of the money in the game and were forced to writing it down on paper.

Our question is, when do boats go back into the reserve, and when they do they go out of the game? For instance, if you sell boats, where do they go? We had so many boats at the end that it seemed like some of them should have been out of the game. The rules for (for instance) selling aren't clear.

Thanks!


It should always be possible to build more. So long as ships can be placed, it's possible to swap two of them with Fleet 8 and create a building opportunity next to any empty island.
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Lawrence Love
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Kingwood
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Unless I counted wrong, there are 82 spots on the board where boats can be placed. There are only 80 boats in the game. Unless you’re doing something wrong (and I believe you might be), you will almost certainly run out of boats eventually. As a reminder, as soon as you run out of any color of boat, that ends the game.

Unless you provide nore info (photos, if available), then we can’t really help, other than just guessing at a number of things that could be going on.

I’d imagine there could be certain RARE scenarios where you play the game correctly and still wind up in a stalemate, but I can’t think of any.

My suggestion would be to read the rules again to see if you missed something, or beter yet, watch a “play through” video on YouTube to see if maybe there’s something that they’re doing different.

Personally, every game I’ve played has ended because of one of the following: 1) someone played their last standard building or 2) we tan out of one of the boat colors.

NOTE: It is also possible to end the game by not being able to refill the Specialists or the Builds at the beginning of a new round, but I’ve never run into that scenario.

To answer your questions:

1. Once a boat is played to the board (docked at an island) they stay there for the duration of the game, and never go back into reserve. If you are putting them back into the reserve/supply, that’s probably the problem.

2. When you sell a boat, it goes back into the supply.
 
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Alluvian
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I see two issues with this which are maybe confusions in how the rules work.

1) It is not possible to get into a state where you cannot build on an island.

Two fleets that help build on crowded boards that your group may not have been using are:
There is the one that lets you destroy two boats on the board (return to the reserve). You can use this to take boats away from an island so you can place boats next to the island and therefore build on it.

There is also the fleet that lets you swap the position of two boats on the board. You can place out some ships, then swap one of your just placed ships with a ship on a surrounded island. This lets you then build on that surrounded island, because you placed that boat this turn, even though you moved it.

2) Even if the board really was impossible to build on (don't think this is possible), when people take fleets, they must take the ships on them. They can only sell 1 ship each turn, so if they are not placing out ships then they have to be putting those ships on their board, either on the port place or the penalty spot which gives you a -1 for every 2 unused boats at the end of the game. So either by placing boats out on the board, or by incurring penalty boats on the player boards, the boats WILL all get used up. There are too many fleets that give you more than 1 boat, so you cannot consistently always sell them all off.
 
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Alluvian
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lawrencelove wrote:

1. Once a boat is played to the board (docked at an island) they stay there for the duration of the game, and never go back into reserve. If you are putting them back into the reserve/supply, that’s probably the problem.


Not correct, fleet 7 takes two boats on the board and puts them back in the reserve. Of course this HELPS you to build buildings and does not hinder.
 
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Lawrence Love
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alluvian wrote:
Not correct, fleet 7 takes two boats on the board and puts them back in the reserve. Of course this HELPS you to build buildings and does not hinder.


Thanks, alluvian... I quickly looked through the fleets and specialists as I was writing my response, but I missed Fleet 7.
 
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Shoosh shoo
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Ive played this game a handful of times and I have never seen anything remotely close to what you have described. I suspect you and your group may have made some errors that caused this to happen.

Maybe play through the game again and write down any possible concerns or questions that come up? There has to be something wrong here. If you provide some questions on this you feel you're not too sure of we could answer them here for you and see what's up.

It's also possible that you may have stumbled onto a unique situation too who knows!
 
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Martin Larouche
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Longueuil
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Pretty positive it's impossible for this game to not be able to end.

Not enough boats to cover all spaces... right there is the key.

Very rarely will boats go back in the reserve. Selling or special action once every two/three turns or so and that's it really. All other boats stay on the board more or less permanently, making the reserve dissappear.

I think you may be removing boats from the board when you build a building... you don't.
 
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Marcin Bigoraj
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Well, something is completely wrong or untrue here.

So you are telling, that there are many boats in reserve.
Let's assume, that you cannot build anywhere anymore (no colors matching building colors). Then you can:
1. Sell boats to get money
2. In proper momment, use swap boats ability
3. Buy another boat and use all of them in prepared spot for building

But let's further assume, that none of you have thought about such tactic.
Then: you get boats, but cannot place them anywhere. Then they land in your port, which they NEVER leave.
After some rounds, all of you should have many boats in ports. And number of boats in reserve will be decreasing. There is 100% guarantee, that one of colour will be missing very soon.
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