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i am thinking to create a game for Asian hot pot.
my friend said it is bad idea as it will kill off quite a lot potential game players cos they may not like cooking meat or wont eat pork, beef, for different reason. is it really true tha
1. Cooking food is not a good idea ?
2. Asian hot pot is a theme that wont attract any America or Europe type of player?
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Jeremy Lennert
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Ryan Keane
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I eat a whole-foods plant-based diet (basically vegan but I don't call it that - I eat honey and have a down jacket) and think fighting over food in a boiling hot pot is a fun theme. Just make the meat worth negative points and the tofu, greens, and mushrooms worth lots of points.

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Ryan Byrd
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If the game is good, I expect the theme will only put off the VERY sensitive. I am against killing people, or taking land, or smashing my car into things and people. However, I do this all the time in games. They are games.

I am a flexitarian (I eat chicken and fish, sometimes), but I do not care if a game has beef or pork. My food choices are purely health related, though. Maybe there are vegetarians that would not touch a game with meat, just like there may be some who do not like games with witchraft themes.

I am only a voice of one, but I suspect that there would not be a large group that would flat out reject a game with meat. Doing a search for games with "pizza" in the title brings up almost 100 games. I do not know how popular those games are, but I bet they have meat. There are definitely other games with meat as well.

I hope you get a good answer.
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Not at all. If you're really concerned about this, put variations in tyd back of the rulebook to make the game more vegan friendly or more lactose intolerant friendly or sumsuch.
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Various vegetarians and vegans have different reasons for their choices. I was raised vegetarian. I wouldn't have an issue with a game that includes food that a zillion people eat, although I might not get drawn in.
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As an ethical vegetarian, I still enjoy games like A la carte, Sushi Go!, etc. and the vegans/vegetarians I've played them with enjoy them too.

I'm ideologically opposed to other things too, but will still play games based on them, because I can separate reality from fiction.

I mean, I'm more opposed to the leather cup in Stone Age, than I am in the ability to simulate hunting in it. If that makes sense. So, as long as you don't include animal flesh in your game, I'll still be willing to try it

Edit: I did really appreciate that the Kickstarter for Top This! A Pizza Flicking Game included the veggie toppings stretch goal. That was nice.
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My wife is a life-long vegetarian, and what does she do every game of Agricola? Grab all the sheep and eat them. I'm always the one living on bread.

I don't think a hot pot game should have dairy though. That's weird. Aren't like 95% of East Asians lactose-intolerant?
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Ryan Keane wrote:
My wife is a life-long vegetarian, and what does she do every game of Agricola? Grab all the sheep and eat them. I'm always the one living on bread.

I don't think a hot pot game should have dairy though. That's weird. Aren't like 95% of East Asians lactose-intolerant?

Not dairy, but soy milk hotpot is quite popular in Japan.
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A large amount of the given population is against war.

That said there are a lot of war games made and played.
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A slightly dissenting voice:

I'm a vegetarian, and I can't imagine ever avoiding a game that included meat out of principle. Use whatever theme you want.

BUT I think part of the reason I don't enjoy New York Slice as much as its predecessor (Piece o' Cake) is that all the pizza has pepperoni on it, and it Just Looks Gross to me. I've spent a lifetime learning that those little meat circles mean "close this box, maybe the next one has something you can eat". I really just find myself not wanting to collect slices in the game!

So I might say, if actual pictures of food are a big part of the visual impression your game makes on players (check out photos of New York Slice to see what I mean), *then* you might want to take care to make the foods appealing to a wide variety of players.

But drawing a card that says "Beef" and has a little beef icon on it is not a problem.
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grasa_total wrote:
A slightly dissenting voice:

I'm a vegetarian, and I can't imagine ever avoiding a game that included meat out of principle. Use whatever theme you want.

BUT I think part of the reason I don't enjoy New York Slice as much as its predecessor (Piece o' Cake) is that all the pizza has pepperoni on it, and it Just Looks Gross to me. I've spent a lifetime learning that those little meat circles mean "close this box, maybe the next one has something you can eat". I really just find myself not wanting to collect slices in the game!

So I might say, if actual pictures of food are a big part of the visual impression your game makes on players (check out photos of New York Slice to see what I mean), *then* you might want to take care to make the foods appealing to a wide variety of players.

But drawing a card that says "Beef" and has a little beef icon on it is not a problem.


Yeah, that's a good call. Like if your war game showed graphic depictions of violence, that could obviously be a turnoff to people who might otherwise not mind playing a war-themed game. Not to equate the horrors of war with the horrors of pepperoni, but generally speaking images can illicit a much more emotional and visceral reaction.
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thx.. i didnt notice that before there is a food catagory.
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I'm a vegetarian and I couldn't care less. It's just a game.
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Aaron Gelb
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Caring would be like when PETA asked Games Workshop to stop sculpting space marine miniatures with "fur"....crazy! Its one thing not to support the wearing of fur/eating of meat, its another to be against the portrayal of it in movies/art/gaming.

I think you'll be fine with that theme.

 
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terrychu wrote:
i am thinking to create a game for Asian hot pot.
my friend said it is bad idea as it will kill off quite a lot potential game players cos they may not like cooking meat or wont eat pork, beef, for different reason. is it really true tha
1. Cooking food is not a good idea ?
2. Asian hot pot is a theme that wont attract any America or Europe type of player?

It's probably a bad idea to make a board game. A lot of potential customers don't like board games very much.
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..
Ryan Keane wrote:
I'm vegan and think fighting over food in a boiling hot pot is a fun theme. Just make the meat worth negative points and the tofu, greens, and mushrooms worth lots of points.



hahaha.. yea. . I love the theme and I am so reluctant to change it.
Your suggestion is great and I would make it as consideration..
 
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ryan_c_byrd wrote:
If the game is good, I expect the theme will only put off the VERY sensitive. I am against killing people, or taking land, or smashing my car into things and people. However, I do this all the time in games. They are games.

I am a flexitarian (I eat chicken and fish, sometimes), but I do not care if a game has beef or pork. My food choices are purely health related, though. Maybe there are vegetarians that would not touch a game with meat, just like there may be some who do not like games with witchraft themes.

I am only a voice of one, but I suspect that there would not be a large group that would flat out reject a game with meat. Doing a search for games with "pizza" in the title brings up almost 100 games. I do not know how popular those games are, but I bet they have meat. There are definitely other games with meat as well.

I hope you get a good answer.



Thanks Ryan.. What you said makes a lot sense. I do believe at the end it is matter of the game play / design over the theme.
That's why I prefer spending more time on the game test to get more feedback before I killed this idea and change theme.

Maybe it is just a worry but as a first timer game designer. People would recommend to take an easier path to have full set of audience.
 
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soiledshortz wrote:
As an ethical vegetarian, I still enjoy games like A la carte, Sushi Go!, etc. and the vegans/vegetarians I've played them with enjoy them too.

I'm ideologically opposed to other things too, but will still play games based on them, because I can separate reality from fiction.

I mean, I'm more opposed to the leather cup in Stone Age, than I am in the ability to simulate hunting in it. If that makes sense. So, as long as you don't include animal flesh in your game, I'll still be willing to try it

Edit: I did really appreciate that the Kickstarter for Top This! A Pizza Flicking Game included the veggie toppings stretch goal. That was nice.



I will keep in mind to have a stretch goal for veggie only version.. that would make everyone happy. Game is all about fun..
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grasa_total wrote:
A slightly dissenting voice:

I'm a vegetarian, and I can't imagine ever avoiding a game that included meat out of principle. Use whatever theme you want.

BUT I think part of the reason I don't enjoy New York Slice as much as its predecessor (Piece o' Cake) is that all the pizza has pepperoni on it, and it Just Looks Gross to me. I've spent a lifetime learning that those little meat circles mean "close this box, maybe the next one has something you can eat". I really just find myself not wanting to collect slices in the game!

So I might say, if actual pictures of food are a big part of the visual impression your game makes on players (check out photos of New York Slice to see what I mean), *then* you might want to take care to make the foods appealing to a wide variety of players.

But drawing a card that says "Beef" and has a little beef icon on it is not a problem.


I agree. It is more matter how to present in a way that makes people feel comfortable.

The art work I preferred would be more like Sushi go than the real food visual impression like NewYork Pizza. I hope it could avoid people to link it to violence.
 
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There are games about murder, crime, plagues, demons, etc. Games are fantasy not reality. I'd have a pretty good laugh if a vegan complained about cooking meat in a game, but then played any game involving violence (which they probably do).
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asgelb wrote:
Caring would be like when PETA asked Games Workshop to stop sculpting space marine miniatures with "fur"....crazy! Its one thing not to support the wearing of fur/eating of meat, its another to be against the portrayal of it in movies/art/gaming.

I think you'll be fine with that theme.



I don't think anyone is looking at a GW mini and saying "I want to dress like that Space Marine." so I don't think PETA had a leg to stand on. Because the portrayal is in the context of fantasy/sci-fi.

But many are against the portrayal of fur-wearing in movies and art that are intended to be contemporary and can inspire viewers to want to emulate that. Cultural norms shift - portrayal of smoking as something that is attractive and should be emulated is frowned upon now, and illegal in some forms. I can dream that someday it will be frowned upon to show a commercial of meat as appetizing. I believe it already is illegal in the US to advertise any health benefits of eating meat and eggs (edible and omega-3's is about all they can say for eggs).
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