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Subject: Tower action too powerful? rss

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Christian Henriksson
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I've played the game once completely through and one demo session with only the first era.

When we played the full game, the impression we got was that to build a huge amount of tower levels in one go the first or second round and then go to the tower scoring space almost broke the game. In our game, two players built their towers up to around level 15-20 already by the second round, while two other players tried to focus on other things in the game (temple building and the purple cards). That meant that one of those two players could score almost 20 points every round. In the end, those two players ended up with something like 150 points more than the other two players.

Is this really intended to work like this? And are the players themselves meant to self-regulate it? Because that seems kinda boring - forcing everyone to build towers just to make sure that no one else runs away with the victory. Otherwise, this game seems geared towards having several different ways to victory, and in that case forcing players to do the same thing seems counterintuitive.

Or maybe we just misunderstood the rules?
 
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Alessandro Lala
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Hi Christian

things to consider
- the tower provides no additional ships
- Marauders can attack Damascus or Uhruk punishing those players focusing on the tower only
- like in Through the Ages if you are left behind on the Military you are most likely screwed up, so in Tadmor if you get too much behind on the tower you are putting yourself in a dangerous position

I have seen people winning with Missions only, or building two Temples (!!) or collecting all rare goods or a combination of all these things. A good strategy will be a mix of developing your own strategy as well as adapting to what the other players do.

best
Alessandro
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Alessandro Lala
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A good rule of thumb I use is the 10 points benchmark.
Things you build in the game provide on average 10 prestige points each.

Rare goods and the Temple start low but ramp up quickly if you manage to do more on that front. Also they work well in pair (temple provides rare goods and the rare goods provide the ships you need to collect the extra resources you need to build more temples). To make it worth investing in the Rare goods and the Temple I must end the game with at least 6 rare goods and/or one complete Temple. Doing less takes me below the 10 points benchmark.

Missions also account for 10 points on average. This is a more linear development.

If my opponents are focusing on the tower, each level built in era I provide them with 6 points in the entire game (if not destroyed by other players... remember the tower, differently from other developments is attackable), tower levels built later in the game are valuable less points. What I really want to avoid is them taking war supplies and making more than the 10 points benchmark. I am usually happy to stay behind on the tower by say 6-8 levels. No more. If my opponent reaches 15 levels I will react. Consider that building the first 10 levels is cheaper than moving from 10 to 15 levels. So I tend to control the gap and use the saved resources to develop other things.

Alessandro
 
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Christian Henriksson
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Thanks for the reply!

Your comparison with Through the Ages is unfortunate, because:
1) I thoroughly dislike the military part of Through the Ages, so much so that I don't play the game even though I like the rest. But that's obviously just a subjective preference. However,
2) TTA is a civilisation game where it's generally understood that conflict will be a part of the game. Tadmor is not - or at least does not give the appearance of being - a civilisation game, it's a worker placement game with optimisation of resources.

Secondly, the "destroying the tower" action is very, very weak since you can only raze one level with the action. If two of your opponents are building fifteen levels in one go, what's the point of wasting one action on destroying one level of one of those players' tower?

Also, using the Marauders as a way of hindering the tower building guys is certainly a valid proposition. However, again the Marauders action is something that seems somewhat maladjusted to the game. There are quite a few comments on this in the other forum thread, and it was also the experience I got at Essen from the demos held - that people liked the game itself, but thought that the Marauders part didn't really belong in the game. It can thoroughly scupper a player's entire game, which also seems wrong in what is generally a optimisation game.

However, your other points are well-stated, and I'll certainly take them into account the next time Tadmor is brought onto the table.

One question here that arose from reading your second reply. I may have misunderstood the tower building. Is it not possible to build 200 levels of the tower in one go? Do you have to stop at 10 levels the first time, because after that you're switching to a new card?
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Davide de Martino
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About the marauder action I think it should be discussed in another thread anyway I can answer you that it forces you to have constantly a B plan. If it can scupper your turn, you must take in consideration the possibility to be the marauder.

As for the tower building strategy, this is intentionally a strong interactive game.

You should not only consider your development, you should also take in account the possibility to hinder someone else play. Moreover you should be aware that this can be done to you and the necessary counter-measure should be taken.


 
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Ferdinand Köther
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christian42 wrote:
I've played the game once completely through and one demo session with only the first era.

When we played the full game, the impression we got was that to build a huge amount of tower levels in one go the first or second round and then go to the tower scoring space almost broke the game. In our game, two players built their towers up to around level 15-20 already by the second round, while two other players tried to focus on other things in the game (temple building and the purple cards). That meant that one of those two players could score almost 20 points every round. In the end, those two players ended up with something like 150 points more than the other two players.

Is this really intended to work like this? And are the players themselves meant to self-regulate it? Because that seems kinda boring - forcing everyone to build towers just to make sure that no one else runs away with the victory. Otherwise, this game seems geared towards having several different ways to victory, and in that case forcing players to do the same thing seems counterintuitive.

Or maybe we just misunderstood the rules?


Haven't played the game yet, but I wonder how'd you do that?

For building the tower 10 levels high by using the "Build 2 Tower Blocks" action you need 10 marbles, for the next 10 you need 15!
Even if you start with 2 marbles, trade 2 wood (or stone), and are lucky to get all three marbles from the board (which cost resources) you have seven for the first round, let's say 8 by some other Improvement (I don't calculate it through to the end right now), you could build 8 levels in the first round, possibly will leave you with no resources for the next round.
I guess something went quite wrong ... or you prove me wrong
 
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