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Subject: Why not just an open auction for bidding on cars? rss

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Robert Yates

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So, the only part of the rules that seem a little convoluted is the initial car auction. Would there be any downside to just letting people bid in millions, skip the cards and do it that way?

Doesn't sound like it would changes things much to me, and would skip all the what did I draw nonsense and "if you don't have this, then" rules?
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Greg Michealson
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I think it would diminish some of the fun. A big part of the game is trying not to pay too much for cars at the beginning. That could be mitigated somewhat by allowing people to see each other's bids.
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Jason Webster
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That is exactly how previous edition did it. You should have no problem doing an open auction.

I think the only other rule to that is everyone had to have at least 1 car. Therefore you couldn’t bid on a car if you already had one and the number of players left without a car was equal to the number of cars left.
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Henry Allen
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I've played Downforce a couple of times now and I'm really not liking the bidding compared to the auction from Daytona and Detroit-Cleveland Grand Prix. With the single card bid you have very limited control to ensure you get the car or cars that you feel will work for your hand and I think this system is a lot more fun when you have cars that work for for your hand (or when you can at least make others overlay to get them).
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Phil Hendrickson
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Try it a few times and post your results.
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Robert Yates

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Right, I am not just talking about getting rid of blind bid - but getting rid of the cards when bidding entirely.

Bidding in increments of 1 million and going up, open auction. Of course if it went to high this would mean that someone may handicap themselves out of the game (which is the main thing the cards help prevent) but other than that it would provide more control and less confusing card elements (do I have a color, do I have a high number, do I have a wild etc.) Then also once someone has a car they cannot bid on one, pass's are reauctioned at the end - and if someone ends up without a car, their strategy/loss on bets.
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Barry Churchill
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Wouldn't it take longer doing it that way? The auction part of the game is just an aside from the real racing.

This variant sounds like it will just drag out the auction part longer
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James C
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Part of the reason I sold DCGP when Downforce was announced because of how much better the bidding was handled.

But as others have said, yes, you can certainly do it that way.
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Jay M
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I do like the secret, silent auction with simulataneous reveal.

I do not care for doing it with the cards you happen to be dealt. I think a some sort of cardboard tokens or bid cards would have worked better.
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Henry Allen
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Bazmondo123 wrote:
Wouldn't it take longer doing it that way? The auction part of the game is just an aside from the real racing.

This variant sounds like it will just drag out the auction part longer


For me, the auction in the preceding games was an integral part. Not so much an aside, more like a starter to warm up for the main course. It does take longer but makes the whole experience more satisfying (and fun) from my perspective.

That said, I love what they did with the graphic design, components, and presentation type stuff and I'm glad more people are discovering and enjoying this great game system. I just discovered it a couple of years ago when someone gave me Daytona 500 despite my protests. I was stunned to discover how much I enjoyed a crusty old game about racing in circles!
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Justin Jacobson
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This was a design choice for us to achieve two benefits. First, while the results of the original auction method are important, the process itself isn’t particularly fun. We wanted to streamline it to get to the fun part more quickly. Second, having a constraint on the bidding makes it more strategic while also eliminating overbidding. Particularly among new players, overbidding can effectively eliminate someone from contention before the race even begins. We like the way the new system requires you to incorporate the cards in your hand, the power, and the pole position in your bidding decision, constrained by what your hand will allow you to bid.

That said, there is nothing wrong with an open auction. If you want to add it back in, it’s your game now. Do whatever you find most fun.
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JR Honeycutt
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I've played ~50 times and I strongly prefer the current bidding system, for what it's worth

<3
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Vince Leamons
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jayahre wrote:
I've played ~50 times and I strongly prefer the current bidding system, for what it's worth

<3


How do you handle the case where all bids are zero? Where nobody wants a car (or at least not enough to pay for it)? Our games are devolving into just bidding on the pole car and then being forced to take another car amid a raft of zero bids.
 
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Justin Jacobson
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I’m not sure I understand mathematically how that works out. If someone bids 6 for the pole position car, you get a car for, let’s say, 2, and it comes in second, you should be winning the game. Bet on the lead car, hamper the middle of the pack.

One of the things I love about this game is how the meta game shifts among play groups over time.

To answer your direct question, cars without bids go to the bottom of the stack and are brought up a second time after the others are auctioned off. If no one bids on them a second time, no one owns them, but they still race. Of course, if no one else owns a car, the pole car owner automatically wins if they finish in first or second and probably third. (Keep in mind, race results is the tiebreaker.)

Anyway, I’d love to hear more about everyone’s experiences with how the auction works in your group. I’ve heard some groups think a power is dominant (interestingly different powers for different groups) and ghat drives the bidding.
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Vince Leamons
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Interesting - I was under the impression that everybody had to have a car.
 
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JR Honeycutt
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SJAirshark wrote:
jayahre wrote:
I've played ~50 times and I strongly prefer the current bidding system, for what it's worth

<3


How do you handle the case where all bids are zero? Where nobody wants a car (or at least not enough to pay for it)? Our games are devolving into just bidding on the pole car and then being forced to take another car amid a raft of zero bids.


I don't understand why your group is playing this way. If you receive a car for a bid of $1 or $2, as long as that car doesn't finish in 6th/DNF, you at least break even on the car.
 
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JR Honeycutt
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jayahre wrote:
SJAirshark wrote:
jayahre wrote:
I've played ~50 times and I strongly prefer the current bidding system, for what it's worth

<3


How do you handle the case where all bids are zero? Where nobody wants a car (or at least not enough to pay for it)? Our games are devolving into just bidding on the pole car and then being forced to take another car amid a raft of zero bids.


I don't understand why your group is playing this way. If you receive a car for a bid of $1 or $2, as long as that car doesn't finish in 6th/DNF, you at least break even on the car.


Also, the power cards certainly should play into the bidding - some are better than others depending on your hand.
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Vince Leamons
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That hasn’t been my experience. There is one power card (Strategic) that is quite weak. The rest are more or less equal, pretty much independently of what your hand looks like.
 
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Justin Jacobson
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This brings up another point. The value of the powers varies by player count as well. Strategic can be extremely powerful in a low-player-count game.
 
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Robert Yates

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Thanks for all of the feedback so far everyone - opened and started sorting my copy today and hoping to get some games in over the holidays laugh
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Vince Leamons
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JustinDJacobson wrote:
This brings up another point. The value of the powers varies by player count as well. Strategic can be extremely powerful in a low-player-count game.


That was brought up in the recent Downforce review thread. The dynamics change a lot with lower counts. At four players, the game is probably a lot better. Unfortunately, I've played most of my games with six.
 
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Justin Jacobson
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SJAirshark wrote:
JustinDJacobson wrote:
This brings up another point. The value of the powers varies by player count as well. Strategic can be extremely powerful in a low-player-count game.


That was brought up in the recent Downforce review thread. The dynamics change a lot with lower counts. At four players, the game is probably a lot better. Unfortunately, I've played most of my games with six.

It's certainly more strategic if that's your bag. My personal favorite way to play is with 6 on the tight board as a pure beer-and-pretzels affair.
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Barry Churchill
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Anyway enough of this chitter chatter, the only real question is when are the new tracks coming Justin!?

Surely you should be knocking them out every month and making Downforce a Living Track Game
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Justin Jacobson
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Bazmondo123 wrote:
Anyway enough of this chitter chatter, the only real question is when are the new tracks coming Justin!?

Surely you should be knocking them out every month and making Downforce a Living Track Game

Something concrete to announce on that soon. Like, a week or two tops.
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Christian Villarreal
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JustinDJacobson wrote:
Bazmondo123 wrote:
Anyway enough of this chitter chatter, the only real question is when are the new tracks coming Justin!?

Surely you should be knocking them out every month and making Downforce a Living Track Game

Something concrete to announce on that soon. Like, a week or two tops.


Just point me in the direction of the 'pre-order' button
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