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Subject: So, I'm probably missing something... rss

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The Texsun
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I'm something of a game hoarder. I bought Castle Ravenloft and then later got Temple of Elemental Evil, though I hadn't played CR yet.

I finally got CR to the table a bit in the summer, and was quite excited. But I think I'm missing something. I've dwelled on it for a few months but I'm admittedly having a hard time understanding the overall flow of the game.

I tried CR solo. I got through the first scenario, with one character, no sweat. Then the next one I played with a full(er) party. What I found was very little reason to explore. Essentially, you reveal an adjacent tile, activating monsters. Fighting ensues. You kill the monsters. Reveal the next tile. More monsters, more fighting. Kill 'em. Repeat again, and again, and so on.

So...I'm not seeing a reason to go and reveal tiles when you have active monsters on the board to fight as it is. Maybe you have no choice but to maneuver onto a space that's on the edge of a tile, which would reveal the next tile over (right?), but otherwise, why would you willingly do that and put more monsters on the map? It just seems rather silly to add even more of them by moving to reveal another tile.

That said, NOT doing that means a pretty boring game - as I summarized above, reveal tile, spawn monsters, fight and kill (or die), reveal next tile, and so on until you get to the Final Bits(TM).

I figure I'm missing something, or maybe not and I'm just not looking at the reason for revealing new tiles and monsters in the right light. Maybe it IS about revealing those new tiles and putting more of a challenge out there, though if you're playing with more than 1 player that might be kind of a bad thing to do, to be That Guy that adds more fuel to the fire. Maybe that's the point. I don't know.

Does this make any sense? Can anyone set me straight with this? Much appreciated.
 
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Miguel Lupino
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Ok. First, take a breath. You seem nervous about the issue. Second, think about this: Castle Ravenloft is THE FIRST on a serie of D&D related Board Games. Rules on the first are simpler than in the others, adding on 2nd game and after that more complexity. But also, think about that's a dungeon crawler game for a fast and fun noon or night. You cannot EVER take a comparison between these games and a RPG. Apart from that, well... the mechanic is... yes... quite simple. Explore, spawn monsters (or not explore and suffer Encounter cards), combat and continue until reveal the specific tile to get the adventure objectives. Between that, you have to combine effort with all heroes to get the less damage possible while defeat monsters and overcome traps and Encounters. Sometimes, the game objectives are not related directly to combat (like confront the Golem with items to calm his emotions), but, as I said before, the game is, in a whole term, quite simple (more than, for example, Descent-Journey into Darknes or Advanced HeroQuest, or perhaps Massive Darkness). But here is your immagination to improve game with house rules, as it is done here with Event Cards for Special Tiles, new Heroes, Optional Rules and so on. Me, for example, have created several adventures with special rules that try to improve the playing experience about the game. Feel free to ask more people here in BGG and try to find your way to enjoy these games. Good luck!!
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Luke
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It sounds like you aren't using encounter cards. Is that correct?

Just checking!
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The Texsun (Texscripter)

I think you might be missing something. you didn't mention Encounter cards and Treasure cards(?)

Those are notorious for being brutal in CR and WoA to the point where those games can be hard to win. but in a fun challenging way. it reduces HP's by the time you ge tto the objective tile or villain. not so much in LoD and ToEE.

if you follow the sequence cards...

you draw an Encounter card when you don't get to an unexplored edge on the current hero's turn. which means you aren't revealing a tile.

you also draw an Encounter card when the revealed tile has a black triangle.

most players will say a priority is to explore to get to an unexplored edge on each heroes turn. and to get ot the objective tile faster.

encounter cards can be worse than monsters. at least you can control how a monster moves and attacks to a certain degree within the AI. such as where to place a monster adjacent to a hero.

so the reason you want more monsters is to kill them to gain their XP experience points to build up a pool for the entire party of heroes in order to cancel Encounter cards. 5XP of defeated monsters per encounter card. you get to look at the encounter card to decide if you want to cancel it. or if you literally want to roll the dice such as for attack encounters.

you also draw much needed treasure cards when monsters are defeated. one per turn no matter how many monsters are killed on a hero's turn.
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Mike Fox
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SirHowlerLupino wrote:
Ok. First, take a breath. You seem nervous about the issue. Second, think about this: Castle Ravenloft is THE FIRST on a serie of D&D related Board Games. Rules on the first are simpler than in the others, adding on 2nd game and after that more complexity. But also, think about that's a dungeon crawler game for a fast and fun noon or night. You cannot EVER take a comparison between these games and a RPG. Apart from that, well... the mechanic is... yes... quite simple. Explore, spawn monsters (or not explore and suffer Encounter cards), combat and continue until reveal the specific tile to get the adventure objectives. Between that, you have to combine effort with all heroes to get the less damage possible while defeat monsters and overcome traps and Encounters. Sometimes, the game objectives are not related directly to combat (like confront the Golem with items to calm his emotions), but, as I said before, the game is, in a whole term, quite simple (more than, for example, Descent-Journey into Darknes or Advanced HeroQuest, or perhaps Massive Darkness). But here is your immagination to improve game with house rules, as it is done here with Event Cards for Special Tiles, new Heroes, Optional Rules and so on. Me, for example, have created several adventures with special rules that try to improve the playing experience about the game. Feel free to ask more people here in BGG and try to find your way to enjoy these games. Good luck!!


Not sure why you think he needs to take a breath. I thought the OP was clear and well paced, it's just lengthy because it's thorough.

To the OP, it should be the case that not exploring means drawing from the Encounter deck, and those cards are killer. They are great reason to explore!
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Mike Fox
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Collection 1138 wrote:
The Texsun (Texscripter)

I think you might be missing something. you didn't mention Encounter cards and Treasure cards(?)

Those are notorious for being brutal in CR and WoA to the point where those games can be hard to win. but in a fun challenging way. it reduces HP's by the time you ge tto the objective tile or villain. not so much in LoD and ToEE.

if you follow the sequence cards...

you draw an Encounter card when you don't get to an unexplored edge on the current hero's turn. which means you aren't revealing a tile.

you also draw an Encounter card when the revealed tile has a black triangle.

most players will say a priority is to explore to get to an unexplored edge on each heroes turn. and to get ot the objective tile faster.

encounter cards can be worse than monsters. at least you can control how a monster moves and attacks to a certain degree within the AI. such as where to place a monster adjacent to a hero.

so the reason you want more monsters is to kill them to gain their XP experience points to build up a pool for the entire party of heroes in order to cancel Encounter cards. 5XP of defeated monsters per encounter card. you get to look at the encounter card to decide if you want to cancel it. or if you literally want to roll the dice such as for attack encounters.

you also draw much needed treasure cards when monsters are defeated. one per turn no matter how many monsters are killed on a hero's turn.


I agree with this, you generally want to keep up a good pace. I find pushing towards the goal is the best way to beat a scenario, and scenarios aren't too easy if you are doing encounters correctly.
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Ben Bosmans
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Another example of someone who plays the game wrongly and think he should kill the game.

The first response was completely wrong too btw.

When I read such threads I wonder how many games are played in a complete wrong mode and then are trashed because of it.

I think 30% of the ratings could easely be ignored.

It is a shame these days where we hop from game to game faster then putting on new underwear...
 
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Bryce K. Nielsen
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As CT stated, it sounds like you're not drawing Encounter Cards for when you don't explore. If you don't draw these cards, the game is incredibly easy. These cards ratchet up the difficulty so much that you want to explore just to keep from drawing those cards.

-shnar
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Robin
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Ben_Bos wrote:
Another example of someone who plays the game wrongly and think he should kill the game.


They literally said they thought they were missing something, and asked if we could put them straight. If anyone's jumping to conclusions it's you.
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Miguel Lupino
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"Take a breath" were words to say that it feels like he was a little worried about enjoying the game. This is what happens when someone cannot speak face to face (like whatsapp). So, don't take those words literally, please.
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Mr Osterman
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SirHowlerLupino wrote:
"Take a breath" were words to say that it feels like he was a little worried about enjoying the game. This is what happens when someone cannot speak face to face (like whatsapp). So, don't take those words literally, please.


Also looking down the avatars and flags with them we've got a LOT of nationalities chatting here. It's quite possible that in one version of English the phrase takes on one meaning while in another country it means something else. "Knocking her up" isn't nearly as violating in British English (classical at least) as it is in American.

Just sayin'.
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Miguel Lupino
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MrOsterman wrote:
SirHowlerLupino wrote:
"Take a breath" were words to say that it feels like he was a little worried about enjoying the game. This is what happens when someone cannot speak face to face (like whatsapp). So, don't take those words literally, please.


Also looking down the avatars and flags with them we've got a LOT of nationalities chatting here. It's quite possible that in one version of English the phrase takes on one meaning while in another country it means something else. "Knocking her up" isn't nearly as violating in British English (classical at least) as it is in American.

Just sayin'.


You're totally right.
 
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Mr Osterman
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SirHowlerLupino wrote:
MrOsterman wrote:
SirHowlerLupino wrote:
"Take a breath" were words to say that it feels like he was a little worried about enjoying the game. This is what happens when someone cannot speak face to face (like whatsapp). So, don't take those words literally, please.


Also looking down the avatars and flags with them we've got a LOT of nationalities chatting here. It's quite possible that in one version of English the phrase takes on one meaning while in another country it means something else. "Knocking her up" isn't nearly as violating in British English (classical at least) as it is in American.

Just sayin'.


You're totally right.


Speaking of, my favorite non-English phrase of late is "Que onda" which I had never learned in a Spanish class, and even my American Born, first Generation Mexican-American Aunt had never heard either. Yet I understand it's pretty much "standard" Mexican for "whassup?"
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The Texsun
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Thanks to all of you for your input, it's much appreciated.

I want to say I did use the Encounter cards, but maybe I wasn't using them correctly. I'll have to give it another shot.

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Luke
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Texscripter wrote:
Thanks to all of you for your input, it's much appreciated.

I want to say I did use the Encounter cards, but maybe I wasn't using them correctly. I'll have to give it another shot.



Cool, I'll just review then in case something pops out at you.

Each turn, after a hero has performed their movement/action stuff, if they are at the edge of a tile, they explore.

If they are not, they do not explore.

Then, if they did not explore, draw an encounter card.

Or, if they did explore and the newly placed tile has a black arrow, draw an encounter card.

There are more black arrows than white (someone correct me if I'm misremembering that please), so on most hero turns the hero will be drawing an encounter card.

Encounter cards hit for up to three damage and sometimes for a minimum of one.

Some are traps, which also do serious damage.

Others are weird hinderances.

But mostly they just do damage.

The game is designed such that each hero should be taking at least 1-2 damage per turn from monsters and encounters.

Anything sound odd there?
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Jerry Whizzlenipples
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mournful wrote:
Texscripter wrote:
Thanks to all of you for your input, it's much appreciated.

I want to say I did use the Encounter cards, but maybe I wasn't using them correctly. I'll have to give it another shot.



Cool, I'll just review then in case something pops out at you.

Each turn, after a hero has performed their movement/action stuff, if they are at the edge of a tile, they explore.

If they are not, they do not explore.

Then, if they did not explore, draw an encounter card.

Or, if they did explore and the newly placed tile has a black arrow, draw an encounter card.

There are more black arrows than white (someone correct me if I'm misremembering that please), so on most hero turns the hero will be drawing an encounter card.

Encounter cards hit for up to three damage and sometimes for a minimum of one.

Some are traps, which also do serious damage.

Others are weird hinderances.

But mostly they just do damage.

The game is designed such that each hero should be taking at least 1-2 damage per turn from monsters and encounters.

Anything sound odd there?


This is a hilariously perfect explanation. I think I'm just going to start calling them "damage cards" as the endless supply of cheap, sometimes unavoidable damage is their main function lol.

"You didn't explore, so draw a card from the damage deck and see how much damage you take."
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Alan Stewart
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MidGuard wrote:
This is a hilariously perfect explanation. I think I'm just going to start calling them "damage cards" as the endless supply of cheap, sometimes unavoidable damage is their main function lol.
When I was playing them with the youngster they immediately started referring to the Encounter Cards as "Punishments".
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