Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
22 Posts

Gloomhaven» Forums » Rules

Subject: Monsters Elemental Infusions - Each Figure? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
John Dalton
United States
Lake Orion
MI - Michigan
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
We know from the FAQ the each monster type consume the element if available, and all figures of that type get the effect. However, when adding elements we aren't sure if its one time, or one time for each figure?

I apologize if its already posted, I looked for awhile

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alex Florin
United States
San Jose
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jdvillan wrote:
We know from the FAQ the each monster type consume the element if available, and all figures of that type get the effect. However, when adding elements we aren't sure if its one time, or one time for each figure?

I apologize if its already posted, I looked for awhile



There aren't multiple instance of an infused element, if that's what you are asking. If a figure infuses an element that already exists, at most it will move it from the waning to the strong column.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
John Dalton
United States
Lake Orion
MI - Michigan
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
No I am asking if there are say four flame demon figures, do each of them add the infusion, moving it all the way to strong (so on the next round there will still be waning).
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chafik Badache
msg tools
Elements always move to Strong when they are added, no matter how many times they are added.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Willott
Canada
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I think this could only ever be an issue if a monster both infused and consumed an element with the same ability card. And given that more than one such creature would on the board would guarantee subsequent elemental presence, the cards would likely just be written to give that ability.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alex Florin
United States
San Jose
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Willottica wrote:
I think this could only ever be an issue if a monster both infused and consumed an element with the same ability card. And given that more than one such creature would on the board would guarantee subsequent elemental presence, the cards would likely just be written to give that ability.


That actually was discussed a long time ago if I recall. As far as I know, there are no monsters that infuse and consume the same element on one card.

As to the OP, the first demon will infuse the element, putting it in the strong column. Any further infusions do nothing as it is already in the strong column.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Björn R.
msg tools
aflorin wrote:
Willottica wrote:
I think this could only ever be an issue if a monster both infused and consumed an element with the same ability card. And given that more than one such creature would on the board would guarantee subsequent elemental presence, the cards would likely just be written to give that ability.


That actually was discussed a long time ago if I recall. As far as I know, there are no monsters that infuse and consume the same element on one card.

As to the OP, the first demon will infuse the element, putting it in the strong column. Any further infusions do nothing as it is already in the strong column.


You could argue that individual Monster types all share a turn. As elements cannot be consumed on the same turn they are created on, the first time a monster acts on an initiative turn the element is created as strong and then remains there until the next initiative turn, where characters or other monsters can consume them.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Liam Brennan
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
Eternally
badge
Deluded
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jdvillan wrote:
No I am asking if there are say four flame demon figures, do each of them add the infusion, moving it all the way to strong (so on the next round there will still be waning).


Any time an element is added to the room for any reason it always moves all the way up to strong. It doesn't matter how the element is added or who adds it, this is always the case. If the same element is added to the room again during the same round this has no effect, as it can't get any stronger. At the end of the round if the element hasn't been used it will then move down to 'waning'.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alex Florin
United States
San Jose
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
GenesisLayana wrote:
aflorin wrote:
Willottica wrote:
I think this could only ever be an issue if a monster both infused and consumed an element with the same ability card. And given that more than one such creature would on the board would guarantee subsequent elemental presence, the cards would likely just be written to give that ability.


That actually was discussed a long time ago if I recall. As far as I know, there are no monsters that infuse and consume the same element on one card.

As to the OP, the first demon will infuse the element, putting it in the strong column. Any further infusions do nothing as it is already in the strong column.


You could argue that individual Monster types all share a turn. As elements cannot be consumed on the same turn they are created on, the first time a monster acts on an initiative turn the element is created as strong and then remains there until the next initiative turn, where characters or other monsters can consume them.


That is definitely incorrect - they do not share a turn. They share an ability card and there are specific rules as to their individual turn order.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Wonham
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
INfusion:

Once Monster A (the lowest number elite, followed by other elites, followed by lowest number normal, followed by other normals) has used the ability card all other monsters of that type have NO effect on the infusion as it's already at strong and it can't go higher than that.

I'm not aware of any monsters that consume and infuse the same element on the same ability card, but if there were, I would rule that the monsters AFTER the one that infuses the element COULD consume it.

Consumption:

The first monster to consume an element removes the element. Other monsters, even if they're the same type, can't use it because it isn't there. So if you had 2 Elite WickedWidgets and 2 2 Normal WickedWidgets, who consume dark, then only the FIRST ELITE wickedWidget would get to use the element.

I think....
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Torsten Winkelsträter
Germany
Weinheim
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
from the FAQ:

If a monster type consumes an element due to its ability card, does only the first monster who acts gain the effect or all the monsters?

When monsters consume an element, all monsters of that type gain the benefit when they activate.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jay Johnson
United States
Cedar Falls
Iowa
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
mwonham wrote:
The first monster to consume an element removes the element. Other monsters, even if they're the same type, can't use it because it isn't there. So if you had 2 Elite WickedWidgets and 2 2 Normal WickedWidgets, who consume dark, then only the FIRST ELITE wickedWidget would get to use the element.


From the second edition rulebook, p. 24:
Quote:
Just like characters, monsters also have the ability to create
and consume elements. Monsters always consume elements if
they can, and every activated monster of that type will gain the
benefit of the consumed element, not just the first monster to
consume it.

So ALL of the WickedWidgets (elite and normal) would gain the benefit of dark consumption.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Simon Skov
Denmark
Copenhagen
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
What about monsters that consume any element to infuse another? Eg. consume any element to infuse frost. If both earth and fire were strong or waning, would they both be consumed?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jay Johnson
United States
Cedar Falls
Iowa
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
nom_ wrote:
What about monsters that consume any element to infuse another? Eg. consume any element to infuse frost. If both earth and fire were strong or waning, would they both bo consumed?

If there were a monster ability card that stated that, then my interpretation would be that yes, all available elements would be consumed, since the rules state "Monsters always consume elements if they can"
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tommy Wareing
United Kingdom
Oxford
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
nom_ wrote:
What about monsters that consume any element to infuse another? Eg. consume any element to infuse frost. If both earth and fire were strong or waning, would they both bo consumed?


Consistently, no. For "normal" element consumption, the element is consumed *once*, when the monsters of that type begin their turns, and then all the monsters have the advantage. The second monster's turn doesn't consume anything, and just takes the benefit that's already been applied.

So when there's a conversion listed, the same logic should apply: a single conversion happens as the first monster acts, and the second monster doesn't convert anything else.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ahmad Siddiqi
Pakistan
Lahore
flag msg tools
Yes, the simple way of thinking about it is just treat monsters of a type as a collective for the purposes of consuming or infusing elements. Do the action once, all monsters are affected.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
HenningK
Germany
Berlin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
JayJ79 wrote:
nom_ wrote:
What about monsters that consume any element to infuse another? Eg. consume any element to infuse frost. If both earth and fire were strong or waning, would they both bo consumed?

If there were a monster ability card that stated that, then my interpretation would be that yes, all available elements would be consumed, since the rules state "Monsters always consume elements if they can"


Really? I always thought that only one element is consumed, and that the players could decide which one. After all, if a player has an ability like "Attack 2. Consume any element: add +1 attack", s/he cannot consume two Elements to add +2.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
John Dalton
United States
Lake Orion
MI - Michigan
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Wow, How did I miss that the elements go directly to Strong... That's the problem However, it really only hurt my spell weaver in the party more than the monsters as we are only like 7 scenarios in.

Thanks for the followup and answering two more questions I would have had
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mike Wonham
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
JayJ79 wrote:
mwonham wrote:
The first monster to consume an element removes the element. Other monsters, even if they're the same type, can't use it because it isn't there. So if you had 2 Elite WickedWidgets and 2 2 Normal WickedWidgets, who consume dark, then only the FIRST ELITE wickedWidget would get to use the element.


From the second edition rulebook, p. 24:
Quote:
Just like characters, monsters also have the ability to create
and consume elements. Monsters always consume elements if
they can, and every activated monster of that type will gain the
benefit of the consumed element, not just the first monster to
consume it.

So ALL of the WickedWidgets (elite and normal) would gain the benefit of dark consumption.


Ok....another rule my eyes had skipped over.....good shout
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Antonis Georgountzos
Greece
Athens
Zografou
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
While we have not encountered monsters that both create and consume an element, there is a need for more clarity regarding the following situation:

-a monster activates, infusing an element

-a character activates consuming that element, THEN opening a door

-a monster of the same type is revealed in the new room and takes a turn immediately after that character.

Does the monster infuse that element again? We assumed that it does.
And another similar question: if the case was about consuming an element, would the revealed monster act as if it had been on the board at the time the original monster consumed the element?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jay Johnson
United States
Cedar Falls
Iowa
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
From the FAQ:
Quote:
If a monster type consumes an element due to its ability card, does only the first monster who acts gain the effect or all the monsters?
When monsters consume an element, all monsters of that type gain the benefit when they activate. However, monsters of the same type revealed later in the round do not gain the benefit as the element has already been consumed.

So I would say that similar logic would be applied in this case, and the newly revealed monsters in the second room would re-infuse the element.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alex Florin
United States
San Jose
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Its pretty clear per the rules: when you reveal a room, any monsters with an initiative lower then the current character do all of their abilities listed in their card. Infusion's wouldn't be an exception.

You're second question is addressed in the FAQ:

Monster - Elements

If a monster type consumes an element due to its ability card, does only the first monster who acts gain the effect or all the monsters?
When monsters consume an element, all monsters of that type gain the benefit when they activate. However, monsters of the same type revealed later in the round do not gain the benefit as the element has already been consumed.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.