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Subject: Alternate Objective Card Ideas? rss

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David Miles
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As the game only comes with 5 objective cards and 3 are in play each game I figured it wouldn't be long before each combination has been played a few times.

Does anyone have some neat objective ideas which we could potentially turn into PnP cards to add some replay-ability to the game?

EDIT - One I can of right now is first player to build any modern Wonder
 
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Jonathan Maisonneuve
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ThatMisterM wrote:
As the game only comes with 5 objective cards and 3 are in play each game I figured it wouldn't be long before each combination has been played a few times.


It requires 60 10 games to play each combination once each. So, it will be long before you play each combination a few times.
 
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Aleksander Zav
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first player to build is bad idea, limiting this victory condition to the one player only
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Koen Wijnants
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Did not play tested this, but:

1) Do 3 trades.
2) Cover up 2 barbarian spawn points with control token or city.
3) Attack rival capital city and win. (For more player interaction)
4) Build 3 wonders of a different color.
5) Upgrade all his focus cards to minimum level II.
6) Own 4 different resources.
7) Own 3 cities on different or same terrain types.
8) Build 2 cities next to water.

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David Miles
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Wildhorn wrote:
It requires 60 games to play each combination once each. So, it will be long before you play each combination a few times.


Are you sure it's not 10? It doesn't matter which order the cards come out in and there are 2 objectives per card so you can have

ABC
BCD
DEA
ABE
CDE
ACE
ADE
AEB
ABD
BDE
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Koen Wijnants
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Yes you are right. It is a combination and not a permutation. My bad.
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David Miles
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siberianhusky wrote:
first player to build is bad idea, limiting this victory condition to the one player only


You are correct. My bad. It should be "Build a Modern Wonder". I think I auto-piloted when typing 'first player to...'
 
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David Miles
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ververken wrote:
First one that can do 3 trades.
First one that can defeat 5 barbarians.
For more player interaction --> First one that attacks rival city.
First one to build 3 wonders of a different color.



I like the rival city and 3 wonders ideas. If people quickly build over barbarian spawns it could quickly lock off any barbarian objectives though
 
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Erik R.
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I've been wondering how it would work if each victory objective was on its own card instead of paired with another one (giving you 15 cards instead of 5)
 
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Koen Wijnants
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ThatMisterM wrote:
ververken wrote:
First one that can do 3 trades.
First one that can defeat 5 barbarians.
For more player interaction --> First one that attacks rival city.
First one to build 3 wonders of a different color.



I like the rival city and 3 wonders ideas. If people quickly build over barbarian spawns it could quickly lock off any barbarian objectives though


You are right. I change it into:

Cover up 2 barbarian spawn points !

Other possibilities:

1) Do 3 trades.
2) Cover up 2 barbarian spawn points with control token or city.
3) Attack rival capital city and win. (For more player interaction)
4) Build 3 wonders of a different color.
5) Upgrade all his focus cards to minimum level II.

6) Own 4 different resources.
7) Own 3 cities on different or same terrain types.
8) Build 2 cities next to water.
 
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pacemaker 67
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Wildhorn wrote:
ThatMisterM wrote:
Wildhorn wrote:
It requires 60 games to play each combination once each. So, it will be long before you play each combination a few times.


Are you sure it's not 10? It doesn't matter which order the cards come out in and there are 2 objectives per card so you can have

ABC
BCD
DEA
ABE
CDE
ACE
ADE
AEB
ABD
BDE


Oups, you are right. Well, it is 9 (In your list you have ABE et AEB which are the same)

ABC
ABD
ABE
ACD
ACE
ADE
BCD
BDE
CDE


Missing BCE, so 10

5 choose 2 = 5 choose 3 = 10

You could also list the pairs of non-chosen cards, for there are 10.

AB
AC
AD
AE
BC
BD
BE
CD
CE
DE
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François Mahieu
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ververken wrote:
Did not play tested this, but:

2) Cover up 2 barbarian spawn points with control token or city.
3) Attack rival capital city and win. (For more player interaction)
4) Build 3 wonders of different colors.
8) Build 3 cities next to water.



Those are really nice. The other ones are too easy/doesn't work to me.

I would add:
Own 2 (or 3) natural wonders.
Control 2 city-states.
Own 3/4/5 diplomacy cards with 2/3/4 players.

 
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Sport Botaniker
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nice ideas around here

Own 3/4/5 diplomacy Cards with 2/3/4 players I like, but is impossble.
You can only possess 1 of each opponent.

attacking rival city is somehow already included at the warmonger card.

3 Trades is far too easy. This we had done in our game after 30mins.
Cities can be close to each other... I would go for 6 or 7.

3 different wonders is way too easy, should be 4 instead.
-> this is half of the ancient era in a 4p game. Slot 3 + 2 tokens + 1 resource and you already have 7 production. think of two opponents being nearby to each other, and a city-state. every 2nd rounde you can make a caravan arrive at a city and next round you build a wonder. if you have used up resource tokens you wait little longer to have it on lvl 5.

Upgrade all Focus Cards at least once is quite well.

Cover Up 2 Barbarian Spots could be alternate option to defeating Barbarians 5 Times. This is a cool combo.

Own 2 natural wonders I like, maybe quite difficult to achieve.

Build 3 cities next to water I like, depending on the landscape impossible for some to achieve.... how about following :
Have 5 mature cities and alternate to this have 3 cities on Mountains.

Conquer 1 wonder of an opponent. ( good way to interact as building wonders is quite often alternative way to proceed )

Have 4 different City-State Diplomacy Cards. ( good way to interact as those are de-activated the moment they get conquered. )

 
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Gandalf the Greyjoy
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ThatMisterM wrote:
siberianhusky wrote:
first player to build is bad idea, limiting this victory condition to the one player only


You are correct. My bad. It should be "Build a Modern Wonder". I think I auto-piloted when typing 'first player to...'

"Build a Modern Wonder" would discourage players from building last Medieval Wonder, as it feeds your rivals.
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David Miles
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Libero03 wrote:
"Build a Modern Wonder" would discourage players from building last Medieval Wonder, as it feeds your rivals.


Thinking about it a little more, I think you're right.

Some really nice ideas floating around - I'll have to give some a try next time I play, thank you all. Once people have found out which the better ones are perhaps we could create some PnP cards, possibly include the original objectives 1 per card (rather than 2 per card) to add extra variation.
 
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Alex Bardy
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spobo77 wrote:
nice ideas around here

Own 3/4/5 diplomacy Cards with 2/3/4 players I like, but is impossble.
You can only possess 1 of each opponent.

attacking rival city is somehow already included at the warmonger card.

3 Trades is far too easy. This we had done in our game after 30mins.
Cities can be close to each other... I would go for 6 or 7.

3 different wonders is way too easy, should be 4 instead.
-> this is half of the ancient era in a 4p game. Slot 3 + 2 tokens + 1 resource and you already have 7 production. think of two opponents being nearby to each other, and a city-state. every 2nd rounde you can make a caravan arrive at a city and next round you build a wonder. if you have used up resource tokens you wait little longer to have it on lvl 5.

Upgrade all Focus Cards at least once is quite well.

Cover Up 2 Barbarian Spots could be alternate option to defeating Barbarians 5 Times. This is a cool combo.

Own 2 natural wonders I like, maybe quite difficult to achieve.

Build 3 cities next to water I like, depending on the landscape impossible for some to achieve.... how about following :
Have 5 mature cities and alternate to this have 3 cities on Mountains.

Conquer 1 wonder of an opponent. ( good way to interact as building wonders is quite often alternative way to proceed )

Have 4 different City-State Diplomacy Cards. ( good way to interact as those are de-activated the moment they get conquered. )



I agree that several of these are already covered:

WARMONGER = defeat 1 rival capital city
PRESERVATIONIST = control 2 natural wonders
POPULOUS = control 5 mature cities

As for the other suggestions. Here's my tuppence-worth...

Gaining 5 diplomacy cards could work if you include cards from both players and city-states in the resolution of it.

Re. Trading objectives: potentially, you could have a victory condition which is fulfilled when you have at least two trade tokens on every card in your focus bar (plus at least 2-3 resource tokens), which might work?

Having all your FOCUS cards at least at level II might work, although potentially this is likely to happen during a game without any real effort, so I'd probably scratch that idea (similarly, I think the Technophile objective is misplaced, because it's very likely you'll get to Tech level 24 during a game, anyway).

Covering up barbarian spawn points might work, but it'll need to be at least 3 barbarian places, rather than just 2. Defeating barbarians is very easy, especially with higher TRADE focus cards that allow caravans to defeat barbarians.

Building cities next to water is a possible objective, although I'd say it should be at least 4 rather than just 3 — I appreciate it depends on where you start on the board, but there's plenty of water tiles in the game, and building cities is relatively easy, regardless.

Conquering someone else's World Wonder has some possibilities as an objective, but given this'll move you towards other 'wonder' objectives, perhaps a more generic "build 5 medieval or modern wonders of any type" would work as an alternative? Arguably, though, if you have this, you will automatically satisfy one of the other objectives of having 2 of the same colour wonders, probably...?

I would also agree with the general conclusion/opinion that the individual objectives could be separated so they're not tied to each other, or both sides of an objective card can count towards victory. In this case, though, completing 4-5 objectives from a pool of 8 (4 cards), or 5-6 objectives from a pool of 10 would be reasonable (albeit extend the game a little, too).

Hope this helps.

Alex Bardy
 
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david kennedy
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i like the idea of satisfying more victory conditions. but allowing both parts of a card to be completed. maybe showing 3 cards needing 4 objectives or 4 cards needing 5 objectives.
 
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Andrew
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pacemaker67 wrote:
Wildhorn wrote:
ThatMisterM wrote:
Wildhorn wrote:
It requires 60 games to play each combination once each. So, it will be long before you play each combination a few times.


Are you sure it's not 10? It doesn't matter which order the cards come out in and there are 2 objectives per card so you can have

ABC
BCD
DEA
ABE
CDE
ACE
ADE
AEB
ABD
BDE


Oups, you are right. Well, it is 9 (In your list you have ABE et AEB which are the same)

ABC
ABD
ABE
ACD
ACE
ADE
BCD
BDE
CDE


Missing BCE, so 10

5 choose 2 = 5 choose 3 = 10

You could also list the pairs of non-chosen cards, for there are 10.

AB
AC
AD
AE
BC
BD
BE
CD
CE
DE


Just because I think it's fun... Google can do combinatorial math.

Just search "5 choose 3" and you will get "10".
 
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Andrew
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mangozine wrote:
spobo77 wrote:
nice ideas around here

Own 3/4/5 diplomacy Cards with 2/3/4 players I like, but is impossble.
You can only possess 1 of each opponent.

attacking rival city is somehow already included at the warmonger card.

3 Trades is far too easy. This we had done in our game after 30mins.
Cities can be close to each other... I would go for 6 or 7.

3 different wonders is way too easy, should be 4 instead.
-> this is half of the ancient era in a 4p game. Slot 3 + 2 tokens + 1 resource and you already have 7 production. think of two opponents being nearby to each other, and a city-state. every 2nd rounde you can make a caravan arrive at a city and next round you build a wonder. if you have used up resource tokens you wait little longer to have it on lvl 5.

Upgrade all Focus Cards at least once is quite well.

Cover Up 2 Barbarian Spots could be alternate option to defeating Barbarians 5 Times. This is a cool combo.

Own 2 natural wonders I like, maybe quite difficult to achieve.

Build 3 cities next to water I like, depending on the landscape impossible for some to achieve.... how about following :
Have 5 mature cities and alternate to this have 3 cities on Mountains.

Conquer 1 wonder of an opponent. ( good way to interact as building wonders is quite often alternative way to proceed )

Have 4 different City-State Diplomacy Cards. ( good way to interact as those are de-activated the moment they get conquered. )



I agree that several of these are already covered:

WARMONGER = defeat 1 rival capital city
PRESERVATIONIST = control 2 natural wonders
POPULOUS = control 5 mature cities

As for the other suggestions. Here's my tuppence-worth...

Gaining 5 diplomacy cards could work if you include cards from both players and city-states in the resolution of it.

Re. Trading objectives: potentially, you could have a victory condition which is fulfilled when you have at least two trade tokens on every card in your focus bar (plus at least 2-3 resource tokens), which might work?

Having all your FOCUS cards at least at level II might work, although potentially this is likely to happen during a game without any real effort, so I'd probably scratch that idea (similarly, I think the Technophile objective is misplaced, because it's very likely you'll get to Tech level 24 during a game, anyway).

Covering up barbarian spawn points might work, but it'll need to be at least 3 barbarian places, rather than just 2. Defeating barbarians is very easy, especially with higher TRADE focus cards that allow caravans to defeat barbarians.

Building cities next to water is a possible objective, although I'd say it should be at least 4 rather than just 3 — I appreciate it depends on where you start on the board, but there's plenty of water tiles in the game, and building cities is relatively easy, regardless.

Conquering someone else's World Wonder has some possibilities as an objective, but given this'll move you towards other 'wonder' objectives, perhaps a more generic "build 5 medieval or modern wonders of any type" would work as an alternative? Arguably, though, if you have this, you will automatically satisfy one of the other objectives of having 2 of the same colour wonders, probably...?

I would also agree with the general conclusion/opinion that the individual objectives could be separated so they're not tied to each other, or both sides of an objective card can count towards victory. In this case, though, completing 4-5 objectives from a pool of 8 (4 cards), or 5-6 objectives from a pool of 10 would be reasonable (albeit extend the game a little, too).

Hope this helps.

Alex Bardy


My 2-cent, on topic this time...

I agree that many of the ideas posted are already part of the game objectives.

The city water objective is a neat idea... but it feels to much like the Explorer (15 tiles next to water or board edge) objective. At any rate those two would be an easy two point pick up if they hit the board together.

How about "Spend one of each resource token"? This feels to me about on par with the other Objective cards. I would pair this with a industrial wonder... but those don't exist.

Other idea is PACIFIST. You start with the objective complete, but must remove your control token if you attack another city (player or city state). A player would still be able to complete the alternative objective if they lost the PACIFIST object.

This one slightly breaks the core rules, so it's less than idea IMHO.

One thing from a design aspect I really love about this game, is that the objectives are not dependent on player number.

Hope this helps!

Andrew
 
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