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Subject: Terraforming Mars- Why I like the Game and I shouldn't rss

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Andrew Young
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And if you never have, you should. These things are fun and fun is good.
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So, I had taken a hiatus for about 18 months or so from gaming. I came back and saw this game. I wasn't sure about it as this type of game usually doesn't impress me. I like more player interaction games where people and the game are constantly challenging you to navigate the myriad storms.

I also have shied away from games that require intricate card combinations. I never really got into any CCGs or LCGs in the past though I've tried most of them. To me, TM is one of the more card combo necessary games I've played.

And I love it. In fact, I think there is more player screwage or interaction than I had assumed. I'm unsure as to what player count I like best (again, I typically like more players on the board in most games as its more challenging- I have some notable exceptions) but I've only played with 2,3,4 players. I'd like to play with 5.

Last night, I played my first 2 player game with a player that lives to mess with me, wants me in last, and will stop at nothing to see if I've made a mistake in calculating stuff. LOL! It's great, I'm constantly under scrutiny and this game offers many avenues for that!

She crushed my plant stores, reduced my energy production, placed cities in the path of my forest-terraforming machines, etc. So awesome. I want more of this with more players. The 2 player game is fun but its a... two player game in one I think was made for more players.

Why isn't 5 the best on this? Generally, I think people don't like mroe players on the Geek b/c of 'downtime' or what was talked about years ago- 'multi-player chaos'.

50% of the player count poll does NOT recommend 5 players. Why?

devil

In any event, I'm excited about this game. BTW, we played the Hellas map last night. Any thoughts on that would be cool too.
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Chris Berry
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With a 5 player game, folks are just more likely to not accomplish as much. And it definitely has more down time every player you add.
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Andrew Young
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delewobmesid wrote:
With a 5 player game, folks are just more likely to not accomplish as much. And it definitely has more down time every player you add.


Right, you wouldn't get as many cards out and therefore interesting combos?
 
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RyuSora
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With 5 is not great because

- Not enough rounds
- Down time
- You dont get to build a cool engine, and the small engine you build you will barely get a chance to use it
- A bit of chaos because a lot of the 'take that' cards will be probably be used

But i have played 3-4 times with 5 players, and the game is pretty interesting and you will run through the deck very quickly, so all the cards about interaction will come and probably be used.

I love TM at any player count really (1-5p).
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Jack Francisco
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Love it with 2p and 3p. Will never play it again with 5p.
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Matt Smith
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I've played it several times with 5 players, and I like it quite a bit for the following reasons:
- More targets to spread out the pain of the attack cards
- More of the corporation strategies are being exercised in a single game (space, cities, energy, plants, metals, etc.)
- The game often takes less time overall to complete, as long as each player is ready for his/her next turn

Probably 3-4 players is the sweet spot, but I won't turn down a 5-player game.
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Bryan Thunkd
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I like it all player counts. I think it's just as good at 5 player. It does have slightly more downtime, but not that much. My group plays fairly quickly so I've never particularly been bothered by it.
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Peter S.
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I do think the game is slightly less awesome with a full table (agreeing with the reasons mentioned), but only slightly. Plus, if you play the "long variant" with the Venus expansion, that'll likely balance out the low round count (and, conversely, I wouldn't recommend playing Venus without the solar phase at low player counts).
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Andrew Young
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mvettemagred wrote:
I've played it several times with 5 players, and I like it quite a bit for the following reasons:
- More targets to spread out the pain of the attack cards
- More of the corporation strategies are being exercised in a single game (space, cities, energy, plants, metals, etc.)
- The game often takes less time overall to complete, as long as each player is ready for his/her next turn

Probably 3-4 players is the sweet spot, but I won't turn down a 5-player game.


Interesting. I would think 5 could be a lot of fun. Different... you're not going to get 12 Space cards in play, you're not going to be awash in a cross functioning plant/steel/or microbe machine. I.E. you get less and have to win with less. But, you see more cards and more of the board fought over.

Hmm..
 
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Marc Espie
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medievalbanquet wrote:


Why isn't 5 the best on this? Generally, I think people don't like mroe players on the Geek b/c of 'downtime' or what was talked about years ago- 'multi-player chaos'.

50% of the player count poll does NOT recommend 5 players. Why?


I think I've done any number of players, including 5, and I find it just fine. It's a different game with 5 players, a bit more hectic and quick-paced.

I wouldn't recommend 5 players for beginner terraformers, you have to be way more aware of what's going on. And also you need to avoid slow players if you don't want to fall asleep.

One of the largest differences with five players, assuming no venus expansions, is that most of the project cards will come out.

So there's a way higher probability you'll get attacked if you know a project that can you put down. Yep, I'm talking about titanium production reduction, or huge asteroids and deimos in the sky.
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Jahz
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With my gaming group we're considering playing quite a lot TM this year (unless we end-up on Great Western Trail or Gaia Project), and since we're 9, we'll probably have sometimes a 4p and 5p game in parallel.

5p being controversial on the base game (as we can see in this topic and in the community poll), I was wondering if people find it better with Hellas and/or Venus ?
 
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Martin H.
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well i played probably 20 to 30 non solo games of TM...4 of those were 5 players...the cons of 5 is the longer play time though less generations...it is more dependent on your neighbours...weaker players tend to not look what other people need..they just take the best card for them into hand and pass good stuff on...the more players you have the higher the chance you have some "n00b" in it...as we have 3-4 regulars who know what they are playing...the 1 or 2 extras somehow "screw up" the consistency of the game if you know what I mean...I know nobody who would prefer 5 to 3 or 4 players....but it is hard to pinpoint...just feels not a perfect fit...probably the shorter playing time and the engines can not develop themselves fully...because shorter play means less money...I guess with 5 players...if venus gets a bit neglected..the game could be over Gen 7-8 with WG..it just does not feel satisfactory
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Örjan Almén
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Jahz wrote:
With my gaming group we're considering playing quite a lot TM this year (unless we end-up on Great Western Trail or Gaia Project), and since we're 9, we'll probably have sometimes a 4p and 5p game in parallel.

5p being controversial on the base game (as we can see in this topic and in the community poll), I was wondering if people find it better with Hellas and/or Venus ?


Hellas/Elysium is just boards and doesn't change anything regarding player count/playing time. It's increasing replayability and variation.

Venus adds new features as a new global (non-required) parameter and some new resource types among the new cards. With the World Government Terraforming in Solar Phase, it is not increasing play time, rather shorten it. One of my groups has gotten up to the same speed with Venus as without without using the WG terraforming, so it's mostly up to the group speed, I'd say.
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Bryan Thunkd
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Jahz wrote:
5p being controversial on the base game (as we can see in this topic and in the community poll), I was wondering if people find it better with Hellas and/or Venus ?
I don't think those expansions particularly change the 5 player experience (which I enjoy).

If you're concerned about a long 5P game then use the new "solar phase" rule from Venus where the start player increments one of the global parameters each generation (but doesn't get a TR or any direct bonuses for doing so). It'll speed up the game a fair bit.
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