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Time of Legends: Joan of Arc» Forums » General

Subject: Armies unbalanced? rss

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Kooky Kooks
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So I crunched a few numbers with a little help from Mithrandir82's excel list and came up with this:
English:
- Units: 156
- Miniatures: 438
French:
- Units: 103
- Miniatures: 235
Holy:
- Units: 29
- Miniatures: 56
Neutral:
- Units: 59
- Miniatures: 154
Ottoman:
- Units: 14
- Miniatures: 36
Unholy:
- Units: 33
- Miniatures: 71
(Stretch goals and Addons included)

I am well aware of the fact that the scenarios and the point system will be balanced, but for creating huge battles the lack of french units/miniatures might be a hinderance.

Has anyone else noticed this? Am I overthinking it? Should I get more minis during the PM? What are your opinions.
 
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Francesco
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First, I am glad you find the excel file useful.

In case somebody is not aware of it, I would like to clarify that the units sheet is based on the cards published by Mythic Games up until now.

It means that, while the list of miniatures is almost complete (new miniatures could still be revealed during the Pledge Manager), I expect we haven't seen yet all the cards for each miniature. For example I am expecting both a French and British version for almost all the siege engines.

Furthermore, at the least in the battle mode, the creation of army lists may allow mixing French and neutral cards for example.

Thus I wouldn't be worried about French or English armies. I am quite sure that the French and English factions will end up with the biggest number of cards/options.

I am more concerned about holy army lists. Looking forward to see some of them from Mythic Games.

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nephi somerville
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LOCHWINNOCH
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Interesting as the English are supposed to be a smaller elite army I read somewhere???

Assuming additional box's of units will be available

On another note, how many French men do you need for them to run away at the first sight of an enemy?
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Max Maloney
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"If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason." -Jack Handey
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lilikin wrote:
On another note, how many French men do you need for them to run away at the first sight of an enemy?

Dunno, how many Englishmen do you need steal the resources of a native people while saying how much they love the Queen?
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nephi somerville
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Dormammu wrote:
lilikin wrote:
On another note, how many French men do you need for them to run away at the first sight of an enemy?

Dunno, how many Englishmen do you need steal the resources of a native people while saying how much they love the Queen?


Mate........ Your American........
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Ben Wall
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Unless I am greatly mistaken a lot of the minis are usable by either side. It's only the cards for them that are different. If you're worried about options I say just get Legendary battles(or a second core box).

Not particularly worried about the lack of holy/unholy units in the base box as you can get a lot of them from the add ons. Not to mention that lots of their units are strong and don't need to be in huge numbers.

So to sum up my opinion is get as much loot as your significant other will abide lol.
 
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Francesco
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duke_scookum wrote:
Unless I am greatly mistaken a lot of the minis are usable by either side. It's only the cards for them that are different. If you're worried about options I say just get Legendary battles(or a second core box).


I agree with you Ben that miniature counting is quite different from the types of units which have still to be revealed. I wouldn't even suggest Legendary Battles if somebody is interesting in having more different options (unit types) than miniatures. As far as I remember the box contains all the miniatures you have already in the Core Maiden box but the Mounted Sergeants at Arms (I could imagine between two and four cards for this type of miniatures).

But I have to admit I am not a big fan of this add-on which I consider more suitable for battles involving more than two players.

duke_scookum wrote:
Not particularly worried about the lack of holy/unholy units in the base box as you can get a lot of them from the add ons. Not to mention that lots of their units are strong and don't need to be in huge numbers.


I wouldn't say I am extremely worried, since I have still many hopes for the Pledge Manager. However, at the moment, I think there is a quite big gap between the options offered for the English and French factions, and the ones offered for the holy one (but also for the ottoman faction). That was also the reason why other gamers got involved into the discussions about asking additional holy options for the Pledge Manager and suggestions for the holy faction.

I clearly remember that, before discussing the possibility of other holy options during the Pledge Manager, Mythic Games clearly said that the Apocalypse box is strictly needed in order to have a full playable holy army. This is not the case for the French and English factions which have already a quite complete set of miniatures from the Core Maiden Box, and can choose between the Legendary Battles and Siege add-on to improve it further. For different reasons some holy faction lovers (my family included) won't be able to go for the Apocalypse add-on, and that's why the holy options during the Pledge Manager would be "crucial" for some of us. whistle

It's true that some neutral units could be part of holy army lists (or even better they could have dedicated holy cards as variant to the English and French ones), and I think this is definitely a cheaper options (than creating new miniatures) which Mythic Games is evaluating.

To sum up I think we have already a quite full set of options for the English and French factions, available for different tastes. Not the same for the holy faction, for which I am still hoping rumours (and wishes) may become (partially) true during the Pledge Manager to reduce the gap.






 
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Jason Dreger
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Something seems off to me about this breakdown.

A bunch of the miniatures are not specifically French or English, the cavalry, the polearms, bow men, crossbowmen. There may be more english characters, but you probably won't use all of the characters at one time.

So, I'm not sure what it means when it says "English Miniatures: 428" vs "French Miniatures: 235"

I see at least 317 troops (knights, polearms, bowmen, crossbowmen, etc) that are shared by both the French and English (And potentially the Holy and Unholy armies as well).
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Ben Wall
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Poor Legendary battles. I think it has been unduly maligned in this campaign. I game with more people so it fills that niche for me because I really don't have interest in a second core box.

Having more of the same minis will give you more options in army construction especially if minis are able to represent different units. Looking forward to seeing the cards for Vlad's army
This is one of the things I love about this game. Many different army lists essentially using a common pool of minis. Not totally dissimilar from Warhammer Epic which I used to play.

The Holy Army thing will be a bit more difficult if you are not getting the Apocalypse box although I do suspect that some of the lists are going to include cards for using some of the "normal" troops from the box in holy/unholy armies. If you're playing battle mode the core box as is is probably not enough for more than a small battle although I think the "regular" angels are something like 200 points each? Like you said hopefully the pm should solve that problem.

Super excited for this game. Now if only MBP would arrive to help me fight off the shakes lol.
 
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Francesco
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homedrone wrote:
Something seems off to me about this breakdown.

A bunch of the miniatures are not specifically French or English, the cavalry, the polearms, bow men, crossbowmen. There may be more english characters, but you probably won't use all of the characters at one time.

So, I'm not sure what it means when it says "English Miniatures: 428" vs "French Miniatures: 235"

I see at least 317 troops (knights, polearms, bowmen, crossbowmen, etc) that are shared by both the French and English (And potentially the Holy and Unholy armies as well).


Jason, I agree with you that maybe it has been a misunderstanding.
In the excel file it is also explicitly stated that there are the following miniatures (considering all the add-on):

8 English
10 French
624 Neutral (including 149 terrain elements, 22 animals, 35 siege engines and 14 characters)
31 Ottoman
70 Holy
125 Unholy

And indeed most of the neutral units could be used in various army lists mainly based on different factions. We don't have a full picture of the playable unit cards yet, still we can see already that most of the neutral miniatures have both an English and French unit card.
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Homo Ludens
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We have no idea how the game will scale for mass battles.

LB add-on looks like poor value compared to a second base game.

It may be possible to buy extra units in the PM. How this will compare to either LB or a second base game we will have to wait and see.
 
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Aaron Gelb
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I fear people are really thinking this is a free form tabletop miniatures game.

It’s not. It’s a tactical war game with minis.

Sure, they are Making it so you can have skirmishes and build your force, but that’s a bit of an afterthought. The game is meant to be played via scenarios.

Don’t get me wrong - I’m excited about this game. I’ll mainly be playing the scenarios. Also, I am a tabletop miniatures gamer and am mostly excited about being able to use the minis with other rule sets.

The value is great for the number of minis you get.

But I’m not expecting the “skirmish” mode to be all that great, and certainly this isn’t a game where you will “pick a faction” and just play with them.

I’m not sure the battle system is that interesting. It’s much better as a scenario based game.
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