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Subject: Can I start the same scenario when I failed in campaign mode ? rss

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xiaohang xu
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I failed a scenario in campaign mode . According to the rule ,I can still get money from coin token and exp from exp dial ,and play the scenario again. Here is my question: If I can play a scenario many times when I fail , does it mean that I can gain as much money and exp from the begining scenario? I can purchase every item and start from level 9 ?
please answer me ,and thanks a lot .
 
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Ben Kyo
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chiese1xu wrote:
I failed a scenario in campaign mode . According to the rule ,I can still get money from coin token and exp from exp dial ,and play the scenario again. Here is my question: If I can play a scenario many times when I fail , does it mean that I can gain as much money and exp from the begining scenario? I can purchase every item and start from level 9 ?
please answer me ,and thanks a lot .

Sure, go for it. Just set money and experience to max and start from there. No one is going to stand over you with a whip in hand and force you to spend the hours of grinding boredom that it might take to get there. I have no idea why you would want to do this, but it's your game.
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Conor Davitt
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I don't know why you would do that, but I guess you could. But you'd be limited by what you can buy, too. You only start with so many items to buy until you hit higher levels of prosperity.
 
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xiaohang xu
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thanks for answer me. In some scenarios ,it is dangerous to pick some coins.Now it seems worthless.
 
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Ben Kyo
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chiese1xu wrote:
thanks for answer me. In some scenarios ,it is dangerous to pick some coins.Now it seems worthless.

The primary goal of each scenario is simply to win the scenario. The loot, experience, and goal systems provide you with optimisation puzzles - how much loot, experience, and secondary goal progress can you get while still winning the scenario. They are also sources of conflict between players - how much do you contribute towards the group win and how much to your own selfish advancement.

Of course, you can choose to ignore all that if you really want to, but I can't see the benefit in doing so.
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Emile Mulder
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I think the point is - do what's fun in the game for you. If it's fun to repeat the same scenario over and over...go for it. If you're doing a boring thing because you just want to see what it's like to be lvl 9...then you might as well just skip the boring part and set your character to lvl 9. If you want to slowly progress to higher levels while you explore the gloomhaven world, then play by campaign rules and try to win each time (accepting the occasional loss). There are rules in the game, but you are free to interpret, bend and break them as you choose and ultimately the only rule that really matters is: "have fun."
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Baker Odom
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chiese1xu wrote:
thanks for answer me. In some scenarios ,it is dangerous to pick some coins.Now it seems worthless.


I'm a little confused. It seemed in your first post you were asking if you could grind a single scenario over and over collecting experience and coins until you had a level 9 character and all the available items. However, in order to get those coins in the first place you'd have to pick them up (loot them) during the scenario so why would that be worthless?

Also, no you wouldn't be able to purchase every item since most items are locked until Gloomhaven reaches a certain prosperity level. Unless you grind through ALOT of characters and retirements you'll never get enough prosperity through grinding a couple of scenarios.
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xiaohang xu
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Thank you all sincerely.
I think I don't make myself clear:

--my first point:money is useful.
Buy items(althought equitment slot is fixed),Donation,Enhancements and so on.

--my second point:money is diffcult to get.
In some scenarios,coins are really difficult to loot.Taking more actions to loot coin may cause exhaustion.

But when I failed last scenario, I realise getting money this way is easy without penalty. (Assuming in scenario 1 ,3 character kill the first monster and loot the coin, then exhaust. )
--here is the comflict:money is easy to get,no penalty ,no limit.

thanks again for helping me. I decided to customize rules : Failure gets nothing.
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Ben Kyo
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chiese1xu wrote:
I decided to customize rules : Failure gets nothing.

Sounds like a good solution to me, if the rules bug you, you are playing solo and/or your failure rate is low.
 
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michael ray
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chiese1xu wrote:

But when I failed last scenario, I realise getting money this way is easy without penalty. (Assuming in scenario 1 ,3 character kill the first monster and loot the coin, then exhaust. )
--here is the comflict:money is easy to get,no penalty ,no limit.


No penalty? You have the time spent getting exhausted, at a bear minimum, then setting back up, etc. If you're willing to do all of that just to get extra gold/XP, then just give yourself extra gold and XP.

In my campaign, I'm the worst player, getting about 1/3 to 1/2 the gold of everyone else, but I own the game. I could always claim to be grinding scenarios solo for XP and gold every night to stay level with everyone else, but I'm not, because that's not the point of playing (to me anyways)
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Novark Perion
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I can somehow understand the point of the OP. Gamers from the classic games require a lot of grindings since enemies are that hard before! And has been made into a habit. Grabbing all the loot you can to get the best equipment for that particular milestone. Raising your exp/gold with a snap of your finger felt cheating and unfulfilling.

Good thing that Gloomhaven locks some items for future scenarios and this keeps interesting. Every new item that pops up is another field day to grind it.

So grind all you want. Although I usually match the difficulty with my grind to be on average. Your enjoyment is what matters in the end.
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Paul T.
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chiese1xu wrote:
--here is the comflict:money is easy to get,no penalty ,no limit.


Unless your time is worth nothing to you, there is a cost to grinding in this very boring way.

Seriously, just play the game as intended and you won't be disappointed. Yes, you could grind and get lots of money, but as others have said you can just make your characters level 9 and give them infinite gold if you want. Neither are in the spirit of the rules or the game. Neither is better than the other really.

Just play. It's a great game. You don't need gold or levels to enjoy it massively.
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Brendan Lapsley
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chiese1xu wrote:
Enhancements and so on.


Remember, you cannot get enhancements until you have unlocked them.
 
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Shawn R.
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chiese1xu wrote:
Thank you all sincerely.
I think I don't make myself clear:

--my first point:money is useful.
Buy items(althought equitment slot is fixed),Donation,Enhancements and so on.

--my second point:money is diffcult to get.
In some scenarios,coins are really difficult to loot.Taking more actions to loot coin may cause exhaustion.

But when I failed last scenario, I realise getting money this way is easy without penalty. (Assuming in scenario 1 ,3 character kill the first monster and loot the coin, then exhaust. )
--here is the comflict:money is easy to get,no penalty ,no limit.

thanks again for helping me. I decided to customize rules : Failure gets nothing.


Hold on, you are saying you can cheat and exploit rules when you play a game all by yourself? DUH! What do you want the game to come with some kind of rules policeman to keep you honest? Just play the way the game is intended and you are fine. You have now created a house rule that only fixes a problem you would have to make an active choice to abuse. Wouldn't it be simpler and more in spirit with the game to just make the decision not to exploit? I'm sorry but there is a very major flaw in your thinking.
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TimTamSlam
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chiese1xu wrote:
I failed a scenario in campaign mode . According to the rule ,I can still get money from coin token and exp from exp dial ,and play the scenario again. Here is my question: If I can play a scenario many times when I fail , does it mean that I can gain as much money and exp from the begining scenario? I can purchase every item and start from level 9 ?
please answer me ,and thanks a lot .


This is one of the aspects about the game I love, and where Descent fails me (I love that game!!): I can grind. I grew up playing the final fantasy's and the Breath of Fires, etc, and I would grind the hell out of them. Ridiculously overpower the dungeon/boss/end game. Gloomhaven allows for that. You can play random dungeons and replay scenarios. I'm playing mostly a two player game, where I am a Scoundrel and the other player is a MindThief (first time playing, this combo doesn't do well for the Scoundrel, as far as XP goes). I'm some 60 XP behind, I just hit level 5. I just started solo random dungeon and it is a blast.

To answer your question, yep, you can replay scenario 1 until you hit level 9 and buy a copy of every available item. Anything that is unlocked and available you can do. Remember that depending on what your personal quest is, once you have completed it and are back in gloomhaven, you have to retire.
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Drew Olds
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Huh. Descent failed me in a very different way- I was irked that the best strategy in Descent is to just b-line it to the treasure chest and ignore the actual objective- because the penalty for losing early scenarios isn't a big deal (obtaining loot is). The heroes shouldn't bother trying to win until they're powerful enough to just overwhelm the overlord.


This is a rule that will work for my group (if we get nothing for a loss, it feels like more of a downer). But we also can resist using the exploit in this case.
 
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Silly/serious question - why even bother to grind the same scenario?

Play a scenario. Pick up coins and XP when you can. If you win, move on to the next one; if you don't, repeat the same one. Why would you keep replaying the same one?

The only reason to get more gold and XP is to have a (slightly) easier time on future scenarios. But what's the point? If you're having an easy time, you'll probably just raise the difficulty anyway, because easy scenarios are boring!

I think you're caught in some circular thinking. In many other games, there's a high penalty for losing - your character dies, and even if you can reload you still have to play the same difficult area while underleveled. And so in those games, it makes sense to "grind" so that you're never under-leveled for an area. And of course if grinding is free, it's boring, so in those games they have to make gaining XP a challenge.

Gloomhaven removes both of those. Sure, you could trivially level your character to lots of gold lots of XP by just replaying the same scenario, with no risk and no fun. But there's literally no reason to do this! You can just forge ahead and keep playing new missions, and have fun WHILE leveling your character! If you get to a mission that's too hard for you, over several tries you'll naturally pick up some more money and XP and will have a better chance at it. If you're winning, you won't have to.

I love this article that Isaac posted about the design of gloomhaven. http://www.cephalofair.com/2015/03/challenge-cooperative-gam... . The challenge in Gloomhaven ISN'T just getting through the scenarios. Anyone can get through the scenarios! Lower the difficulty, grind up XP/gold, whatever it takes - this isn't a game where it's supposed to be possible to "lose" and get permanently stuck somewhere. The difficulty is in seeing how fast and how efficiently you can advance. High difficulty - play on high level, try to get all the loot the first go-around. Low difficulty - play on low level, skip most of the loot or have to do multiple plays to come back to it.
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Robert Marney
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Grinding early missions or random dungeons at prosperity level 1 will actually make the game harder. Once you are level 9, you'll be fighting level 5 enemies, who expect you to have better gear than the starter shop can provide, and also expect you to have a solid grasp of the game mechanics (which failing the same few skeleton fights over and over won't give you).

In fact, I often avoid leveling up my characters intentionally, because the fight will be much easier at difficulty 2 than 3 but the loot is the same.
 
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Des T.
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chiese1xu wrote:
I failed a scenario in campaign mode . According to the rule ,I can still get money from coin token and exp from exp dial ,and play the scenario again. Here is my question: If I can play a scenario many times when I fail , does it mean that I can gain as much money and exp from the begining scenario? I can purchase every item and start from level 9 ?
please answer me ,and thanks a lot .


You can do that, but you can also replay scenarios if you succeed. In most cases, the rewards for winning a scenario beat replaying it.

Also, if you farm the first scenario, you gain gold and xp, and can theoretically stock up on items, but the monsters scale up with you, while you'll still be sitting on beginner gear.

It's really not worth it.
 
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Mark Johnson
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Robyrt wrote:
In fact, I often avoid leveling up my characters intentionally, because the fight will be much easier at difficulty 2 than 3 but the loot is the same.


As far as I know, the only way to avoid it is to not go into town and instead go to a linked scenario, correct? If you're in town and can level up, then you're required to.
 
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Des T.
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NQbass7 wrote:

As far as I know, the only way to avoid it is to not go into town and instead go to a linked scenario, correct? If you're in town and can level up, then you're required to.


No, you can also travel from one scenario directly to the next. As long as it isn't in town, all it costs you is drawing a road event (if they're not linked).
 
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