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Subject: additional base game decks rss

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Veljko Dobrijevic
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Recently I acquired Evolution (a game similar to RFTG in many regards) and it's expansions Climate and Flight (which aren't compatible with each other). Then later I ordered a separate deck of cards from the base game (which includes all the cards from the base game, but none of the other components) from the publisher for a measly 7$ (though the shipping is more than that).
So what I'd like to know is it possible to buy a core RFTG deck cheaply like that, without buying the whole game ? I'd like to have one to play with first-timers as is, or maybe with just the first expansion, and one more to play with all 3 expansions.
Please post a link if you know where it can be found !
 
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Jędrzej Jarocki
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Great idea I would like to know that too
 
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Tom Lehmann
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No, it is not possible to do this.

We discussed putting out a base cards product (like RGG does for Dominion) and RGG decided against it on the grounds that the base cards represent too high a % of the game (unlike Dominion).

We also looked at the cost of shipping the decks as "spare parts" and the cost of fulfillment and shipping (particularly international shipping) was too high.
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Gregg Saruwatari
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Tom Lehmann wrote:
No, it is not possible to do this.

We discussed putting out a base cards product (like RGG does for Dominion) and RGG decided against it on the grounds that the base cards represent too high a % of the game (unlike Dominion).

We also looked at the cost of shipping the decks as "spare parts" and the cost of fulfillment and shipping (particularly international shipping) was too high.


When is a new Core set- or something similar coming out, Tom?!
 
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Tom Lehmann
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The regular game is available in stores now. There are no plans for any "new core set".
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Veljko Dobrijevic
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Tom Lehmann wrote:
No, it is not possible to do this.

We discussed putting out a base cards product (like RGG does for Dominion) and RGG decided against it on the grounds that the base cards represent too high a % of the game (unlike Dominion).

We also looked at the cost of shipping the decks as "spare parts" and the cost of fulfillment and shipping (particularly international shipping) was too high.

Damn, that's too bad. I hate swapping out cards, but I'm not going to buy another whole base game just for that.
I don't understand why it's not financially possible when there's a number of games/publishers (like Evolution) for which you can get a base game deck for under 10$ (don't remember exactly how many cards there are in the RFTG base deck, but there are 129 in Evolution, I think that's roughly similar). I know international shipping can be outrageous but still...
Thanks for the answer anyway !
 
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Andrew Brown
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Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
Tom Lehmann wrote:
No, it is not possible to do this.

We discussed putting out a base cards product (like RGG does for Dominion) and RGG decided against it on the grounds that the base cards represent too high a % of the game (unlike Dominion).

We also looked at the cost of shipping the decks as "spare parts" and the cost of fulfillment and shipping (particularly international shipping) was too high.

Damn, that's too bad. I hate swapping out cards, but I'm not going to buy another whole base game just for that.
I don't understand why it's not financially possible when there's a number of games/publishers (like Evolution) for which you can get a base game deck for under 10$ (don't remember exactly how many cards there are in the RFTG base deck, but there are 129 in Evolution, I think that's roughly similar). I know international shipping can be outrageous but still...
Thanks for the answer anyway !


I have three base sets for the three expansion arcs. Don't regret it.
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Tom Lehmann
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Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
I don't understand why it's not financially possible when there's a number of games/publishers (like Evolution) for which you can get a base game deck for under 10$

Not every publisher's internal structures are the same and, therefore, their capabilities differ.

I don't know how Northstar is structured, but if -- as some companies do -- they have a European partner who can handle spare parts fulfillment and shipping, then that makes it easier for them to do this cheaply.

In addition, Evolution has significant additional components (boards, wooden markers, food tokens, bags, etc.), which may affect their decision making since they are reasonably sure that customers ordering decks are not doing so to avoid buying the game itself.
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Yeah, what is in the RFTG core besides the deck? The role-selection cards, a couple of token punchboards, and a rulebook? I imagine it's hard to sell the whole package for full price alongside "just the cards" for $7-10.

(I found two used copies, one in a ding-and-dent, to add to AA and XI)
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Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
Damn, that's too bad. I hate swapping out cards, but I'm not going to buy another whole base game just for that.
I don't understand why it's not financially possible when there's a number of games/publishers (like Evolution) for which you can get a base game deck for under 10$ (don't remember exactly how many cards there are in the RFTG base deck, but there are 129 in Evolution, I think that's roughly similar). I know international shipping can be outrageous but still...
Thanks for the answer anyway !


I'm not really sure what you're looking for here? The base "game deck" is literally the entire deck minus the role selection cards. If they were to release a 10 dollar "base deck" why would anyone even bother buying the core game?
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Veljko Dobrijevic
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vulg4r wrote:
I'm not really sure what you're looking for here? The base "game deck" is literally the entire deck minus the role selection cards. If they were to release a 10 dollar "base deck" why would anyone even bother buying the core game?

To get the whole game ? Because if you're not going to go printing for yourself you still need the manual, the player aids, the tokens, the role cards...
I really don't know why you're so surprised and outraged, there's a "base game deck" available for sale in many similar cases...
 
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Tom Lehmann wrote:
In addition, Evolution has significant additional components (boards, wooden markers, food tokens, bags, etc.), which may affect their decision making since they are reasonably sure that customers ordering decks are not doing so to avoid buying the game itself.

Indeed, it would be fairly trivial to play RftG with a replacement deck as the action selection cards + VP chips could easily be proxied.
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Tom Lehmann wrote:
The regular game is available in stores now. There are no plans for any "new core set".

A while ago you mentioned there was a possibility that a new edition with a few modifications might be considered by RGG. I'm guessing this is what Gregg might mean. Is this no longer a possibility?
 
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Daybreak wrote:
Yeah, what is in the RFTG core besides the deck? The role-selection cards, a couple of token punchboards, and a rulebook? I imagine it's hard to sell the whole package for full price alongside "just the cards" for $7-10.

(I found two used copies, one in a ding-and-dent, to add to AA and XI)


I'm STILL confused just what "RftG core" means. Components wise, the majority of the game is cards... start worlds, action cards, deck cards. Then you have the VP chips, rulebook, and player aids. Is this thread talking about just the action cards?


Dominion has that modularity since the common components across ALL sets have been broken down into "The Base Cards".... Estates + other Victory cards, Copper + other Treasures, and Curses. With RftG, the entire deck of base game cards comprise of "the core". Savings don't seem to be significant.
 
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Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
vulg4r wrote:
I'm not really sure what you're looking for here? The base "game deck" is literally the entire deck minus the role selection cards. If they were to release a 10 dollar "base deck" why would anyone even bother buying the core game?

To get the whole game ? Because if you're not going to go printing for yourself you still need the manual, the player aids, the tokens, the role cards...
I really don't know why you're so surprised and outraged, there's a "base game deck" available for sale in many similar cases...



Its not outrage, just confusion. A "base set" as you describe it would literally be the entire game in this case. I got my extra core games used off ebay so i could avoid pulling cards out AA and XI. I got the core + aa packaged together for about 30 shipped, and a second base copy to add to XI ran me 17 dollars used. keep an eye on ebay and geekamarket
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Veljko Dobrijevic
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vulg4r wrote:
Its not outrage, just confusion. A "base set" as you describe it would literally be the entire game in this case.

It literally wouldn't be. Like I said above there's several other things in the box, so your statement is simply not true, objectively.


vulg4r wrote:
I got my extra core games used off ebay so i could avoid pulling cards out AA and XI. I got the core + aa packaged together for about 30 shipped, and a second base copy to add to XI ran me 17 dollars used. keep an eye on ebay and geekamarket

Shipping to here would cost me a lot more, and I'm not likely to find used copies locally...
 
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Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
Damn, that's too bad. I hate swapping out cards, but I'm not going to buy another whole base game just for that.


I own three base games with each expansion arc mixed in.

For me it is worth it. If it is not worth it to you that is your call but don't whine about it.

Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
I don't understand why it's not financially possible when there's a number of games/publishers (like Evolution) for which you can get a base game deck for under 10$ (don't remember exactly how many cards there are in the RFTG base deck, but there are 129 in Evolution, I think that's roughly similar). I know international shipping can be outrageous but still...
Thanks for the answer anyway !


It's always easier to spend money and make business decisions when it's not actually your business.

This is similar to the "couch coach" or "armchair quarterback" for sports games where every fan always makes better decisions than the people who are actually running the team and in the game.

It seems like to me you are just being cheap and wanting someone else to front some of your costs.
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Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
vulg4r wrote:
Its not outrage, just confusion. A "base set" as you describe it would literally be the entire game in this case.

It literally wouldn't be. Like I said above there's several other things in the box, so your statement is simply not true, objectively.


What other things? From a quantity count perspective, the cards make up are around 90% of the box.

You don't really need the rules nor the player aids.

VP tokens could be proxied, even if necessary

the action cards, homeworlds, and deck cards make up the core.

You're essentially buying another full, base game
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Veljko Dobrijevic
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Runcible Spoon wrote:
For me it is worth it. If it is not worth it to you that is your call but don't whine about it.

It seems like to me you are just being cheap and wanting someone else to front some of your costs.

And it seems to me like you're being a rude jerk, like some other people in this thread as well but in their case to a lesser degree.


ackmondual wrote:
What other things? From a quantity count perspective, the cards make up are around 90% of the box.

You don't really need the rules nor the player aids.

VP tokens could be proxied, even if necessary

the action cards, homeworlds, and deck cards make up the core.

You're essentially buying another full, base game

People I can understand that you like the game fanatically and are willing to dish out any amount of money for it. That's OK and that's normal.

What's not OK and not normal is ignoring facts, banging your head against the wall, and arguing against yourselves, just because you're such fans.
Ackmondual, you just said in the post above the deck IS the whole and also that it ISN'T. Two opposite statements in the same post. You're obviously thrown all logical arguments to the wind.
No sense in me (or anyone else) wasting any more time on this thread, so enjoy the rest of your lives of people... Cheerio !
 
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Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
vulg4r wrote:
Its not outrage, just confusion. A "base set" as you describe it would literally be the entire game in this case.

It literally wouldn't be. Like I said above there's several other things in the box, so your statement is simply not true, objectively.


vulg4r wrote:
I got my extra core games used off ebay so i could avoid pulling cards out AA and XI. I got the core + aa packaged together for about 30 shipped, and a second base copy to add to XI ran me 17 dollars used. keep an eye on ebay and geekamarket

Shipping to here would cost me a lot more, and I'm not likely to find used copies locally...


unfortunately that's the best advice I can offer. Good luck.
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I don't understand why you're being so petulant to people who have told you that with the cards (including action and start worlds), you technically don't need the rest of the game. In fact, technically you could print copies of the cards right now since the art is out there. Pair that with a publicly-available rule book, and you could play the game for the cost of a few sheets of paper, some cards, and sleeves. There's no incentive for the company to sell you just the cards and nothing else.
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Enkidu_of_Abydos wrote:
Runcible Spoon wrote:
For me it is worth it. If it is not worth it to you that is your call but don't whine about it.

It seems like to me you are just being cheap and wanting someone else to front some of your costs.

And it seems to me like you're being a rude jerk, like some other people in this thread as well but in their case to a lesser degree.


ackmondual wrote:
What other things? From a quantity count perspective, the cards make up are around 90% of the box.

You don't really need the rules nor the player aids.

VP tokens could be proxied, even if necessary

the action cards, homeworlds, and deck cards make up the core.

You're essentially buying another full, base game

People I can understand that you like the game fanatically and are willing to dish out any amount of money for it. That's OK and that's normal.

What's not OK and not normal is ignoring facts, banging your head against the wall, and arguing against yourselves, just because you're such fans.
Ackmondual, you just said in the post above the deck IS the whole and also that it ISN'T. Two opposite statements in the same post. You're obviously thrown all logical arguments to the wind.
No sense in me (or anyone else) wasting any more time on this thread, so enjoy the rest of your lives of people... Cheerio !


I'm being genuine here in saying up until this point, I really was STILL trying to understand what you folks like yourself were trying to pitch.

Now that it's been confirmed that you indeed are seeking a "core set" for Race such that this set only includes the cards, I'd have to agree with those that state this isn't feasible from publisher financial, logistics, and production perspectives.


Not everything is black or white, so your remark that I've said opposite things isn't applicable. That's because you're so much yearning for such a product, doesn't mean it'll "automagically happen"

Concerning facts, none of us know the details behind their operations. A long time ago, somebody asked if Race can get some Collectors/anniversary edition not being possible due to their relative lack of copies out there. Games like Dominion have more "muscle" since having won a Spiel De Jahres, it gives them more clout. IIRC, Ticket To Ride shares that same situation... award, and extra options for publishers.
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Octavian wrote:
Antagonistic, insulting, or otherwise disruptive comments ARE NOT welcome here.

I completely support this policy.
WHEN applied equally and neutrally on everyone. Including people who for no reason start insulting other people and calling them cheap just because they asked a perfectly reasonable question.

Btw Tom Lehman gave one of the very few useful and informative answers in this thread, most of the others seem to be just pointless foaming at the mouth...
 
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