Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
34 Posts
1 , 2  Next »   | 

Gloomhaven» Forums » Strategy

Subject: Did we do something wrong or does scenario #67 simply stand apart from the rest? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Flo P
Austria
Vienna
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Mild spoilers ahaed, if you haven't found/been to scenario #67 don't read past this point!

The scenario I am talking about is called the arcane library and the topic I wan't to talk about is the end "boss" (not really a boss): the arcane golem. We went to this dungeon right after our first retirement, since we wanted to get a feel for the new characters during a side mission. Playing with 3p the scenario level was 2 (= normal difficulty), which meant the arcane golem was level 3 and had a whopping 45 hitpoints combined with 3 shields! Once we opened that last door and saw what was ahead of us we instantly knew that we won't be able to tackle this beast before going exhausted.

I mean the massive HP alone would already be a nice challenge, but combined with 3 shields that probably means an effective HP pool of way beyond 150. Seriously, are we missing something? Even if we ignore the imps and bears in the first room, rush into the golem room and lock the door behind us such that we don't have to deal with the skipped monsters, we won't be able to tackle this beast without being exhausted. How many cards does the average character have that reliably do 4+ damage without being lost?

I feel like I am either missing something here (maybe there is a certain character with a lot of piercing attacks in the deck, as for now the bow is the only one-time item that grants piercing), as there aren't even environmental gimmicks like traps that can aid you in bringing the golem down. we already suspect that poison and wounds will be our friends here, but even so we feel like we can get 10-15 points of damage from the wounds at most before being exhausted, so I am not sure whether this alone will suffice.

If you can give some hints, particularly without spoilering too much of characters we might encounter along the way it would be very helpful (we know the tinkerer, cragheart, mindthief, spellweaver and the harrower, tried the scenario with CH, harrower and mindthief). I don't need an exact strategy guide on how to beat this scenario, I just want to make sure we haven't glossed over some major part of the game and would like to know how others have dealt with this situation.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
michael ray
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmb
Are you sure 2 is the right level? After your first retirement, you were able to start with level 3 characters? It's average / 2, rounded up.

Otherwise, poison + wound, plus building your decks for high damage single attacks over AOE as much as possible. Do any of your characters have cards that would give them retaliate?

EDIT: You can also donate to the church or whatever, get a few blessings added to your decks for higher chance of 2x hits.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ken Brenner
United States
New York
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmb
squegeeboo wrote:
Are you sure 2 is the right level? After your first retirement, you were able to start with level 3 characters? It's average / 2, rounded up.


Definitely check that: Scenario Level 2 should only be used if the combined levels of your 3 characters is 7 or higher, which is entirely possible if you've done more than a few scenarios but worth making sure.

Can't stress the efficiency factor of getting through that first and second room quickly enough. Definitely go for Bless if you can afford it. Even if all the 2x come up in room 1, it's okay cause you'll dispose of the Imps and Bears faster. Try to time the springing of the traps (if no disarm available) with a character who was about to long rest anyway.

Poison + Wound is the way to go. Poison effectively reduces the Shield to 2 but it's more valuable than even that if you hit your Crit. You'd be surprised how often you can hit for 4 or more with some careful deck selections. I also love the
Spoiler (click to reveal)
Horned Helm if Gloomhaven Prosperity is 2
for any high-moving character melee attacks.

EDIT: All of the above being said, this scenario is, I believe, the only one designed by Rob Daviau, of Heroscape, and pretty much all of the Legacy games except Charterstone, fame. You're not alone in that it does feel a little different.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
michael ray
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmb
DukePhoenix wrote:
squegeeboo wrote:
Are you sure 2 is the right level? After your first retirement, you were able to start with level 3 characters? It's average / 2, rounded up.


Mostly, this. Scenario Level 2 should only be used if the combined levels of your 3 characters is 12 or higher, so you'd need to all be around Level 4 unless 1 character is blowing the other 2 away in terms of XP.


I don't think your math is right, in a 3 player game, a combined level of 7 would get you to lvl 2. ((3+2+2)/3)/2=1.16, rounded up, that's 2.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve Hope
United States
Woodside
California
flag msg tools
badge
Likes: Mountains, Tundra Turn-offs: Serpents, Marsh
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
My tips for that scenario:

1. Make sure you have jump/fly moves for the middle room.
2. Wound/poison, as people have said.
3. Don't waste any big one-shots in the first room.

We had an experience with this 2p where it was basically the same story when we opened the door and found the Golem--no way were we going to beat that guy with essentially one person in the room. This is one of the scenarios that doesn't scale down from 4 quite as easily as the others because of the requirement to be in other locations.

SO if you can get a 4th that would help, but I don't think you'll have any severe problems. Harrower obviously great for poisoning and the mindthief will be able to do some large attacks. CH I don't really remember having many big 1v1 attacks, but you may be able to get some damage with the obstacles going.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ken Brenner
United States
New York
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmb
squegeeboo wrote:
DukePhoenix wrote:
squegeeboo wrote:
Are you sure 2 is the right level? After your first retirement, you were able to start with level 3 characters? It's average / 2, rounded up.


Mostly, this. Scenario Level 2 should only be used if the combined levels of your 3 characters is 12 or higher, so you'd need to all be around Level 4 unless 1 character is blowing the other 2 away in terms of XP.


I don't think your math is right, in a 3 player game, a combined level of 7 would get you to lvl 2. ((3+2+2)/3)/2=1.16, rounded up, that's 2.

You're right, it's not! I was calculating what the limit for level 2 would be, not level 1! Fixed it, and thanks!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Flo P
Austria
Vienna
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Wow so many answers already! Thanks for the tips, it seems as if we already had the right strategy in mind. Getting "blessed up" a lot is definitely something to consider before this scenario. I would love to hear if all the people giving advice here have already beaten this scenario and at which player count that was accomplished, just to give me a better feel for this one (first scenario we lost so far blush).

Character Levels were 5 for CH, and 2 for both Harrower and MT, which results in an average party level of 3, thus the level 2 scenario. Harrower was the new character after "retirement" of our tinker (Xorn uses his body as a host now XD) and our spellweaver decided to start a second char at this opportunity since he feels he is still far off from accomplishing his personal quest, which is why the Mindthief joined the mission.

Regarding the advice on rebuilding your deck: I don't see how this is possible if one sticks to the rules of "active availabe card pools". Once you choose your new card during level-up you are locked into that choice, so for example our obstacle manipulating CH cant go full single target damage all of a sudden.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
michael ray
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmb
bluesheep wrote:


Regarding the advice on rebuilding your deck: I don't see how this is possible if one sticks to the rules of "active availabe card pools". Once you choose your new card during level-up you are locked into that choice, so for example our obstacle manipulating CH cant go full single target damage all of a sudden.


It depends on the characters for sure, but, esp. for a level 5 character, you should have....7 extra cards to chose from? (3 X cards, plus extra 4 level up cards)

You might not be able to go full DPS over AOE, but you should be able to at least move your deck towards one way or the other based on the scenario.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Flo P
Austria
Vienna
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
squegeeboo wrote:
You might not be able to go full DPS over AOE, but you should be able to at least move your deck towards one way or the other based on the scenario.


Thanks, I will keep that in mind and see whether our group manages to fine tune properly for this dungeon.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ken Brenner
United States
New York
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmb
bluesheep wrote:
Wow so many answers already! Thanks for the tips, it seems as if we already had the right strategy in mind. Getting "blessed up" a lot is definitely something to consider before this scenario. I would love to hear if all the people giving advice here have already beaten this scenario and at which player count that was accomplished, just to give me a better feel for this one (first scenario we lost so far blush).

Character Levels were 5 for CH, and 2 for both Harrower and MT, which results in an average party level of 3, thus the level 2 scenario. Harrower was the new character after "retirement" of our tinker (Xorn uses his body as a host now XD) and our spellweaver decided to start a second char at this opportunity since he feels he is still far off from accomplishing his personal quest, which is why the Mindthief joined the mission.

Regarding the advice on rebuilding your deck: I don't see how this is possible if one sticks to the rules of "active availabe card pools". Once you choose your new card during level-up you are locked into that choice, so for example our obstacle manipulating CH cant go full single target damage all of a sudden.


My group has beaten it, but it's hard to compare because our characters were level 5, 4, and 3 (so essentially, the absolute highest sum of 12 for still getting to play at Level 2.) Another difference was we had a Brute who was a melee god at that point, and a Level 3 Scoundrel who could apply poison and take advantage of the Brute's adjacency, not to mention Disarm in Room 2.

We actually did lose the scenario the first time because we don't look at enemy stats until that enemy type is activated for the first time and we were completely unprepared for the HP plus shields.

Perhaps a random dungeon to level up the Harrower and MT, and take advantage of the averaging system, with the CH bailing them out when needed? They could get some money, gain a level each, get blessed, and be more on par with the monsters (who are at Level 3?)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
michael ray
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmb
bluesheep wrote:
Wow so many answers already! Thanks for the tips, it seems as if we already had the right strategy in mind. Getting "blessed up" a lot is definitely something to consider before this scenario. I would love to hear if all the people giving advice here have already beaten this scenario and at which player count that was accomplished, just to give me a better feel for this one (first scenario we lost so far blush).



Sorry, forgot to answer your other questions, I haven't played this scenario yet, but have it unlocked and looked at it quickly. We've only got a few plays in as a 4 person team, but as a (terrible) scoundrel player, I've been trying to work on ways to figure out massive single attack damage to help out on these 'boss' levels. I've managed to get a few in the lower teens before modifiers...which are then normally the null symbol.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alex Kerr
United Kingdom
Preston
Lancashire
flag msg tools
mbmb
Wow we literally just finished this one 30 minutes ago! I think it's one that scales better for higher levels where more of your attacks are getting through the Shield 3. We had a Lvl9 MT, Lv4 SW and Lv4 'Sun'. Failing that you need someone who can get through shields, or the lower hit points at lower levels wont make much of a difference at shield 3.

Didn't think we would have the damage to fell the golem's 54HP (did the maths wrong should have been 51!) but managed it with poison, wound, and getting all three of us in the room ASAP. Lvl9 MT was pulling a lot of rolling +1 and could hit multiple times a turn for high damage, consistently doing 3-6 per hit after shield. We were also able to re-apply a stun every single time it wore off to keep the Golem stunlocked indefinitely.

But yeah without a beastly single target character wouldn't have worked so well. Getting through the 2nd room was a nightmare as we had to take it in turns to step on almost every trap for stuns and 5 damage as the Sun had no jump at all yet.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scot Rose
United States
South Burlington
Vermont
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
This was the 3rd scenario I did in a solo campaign with the Mindthief and Scoundrel. They had just become level 2 and with the level bump from playing solo, the golem was also level 3.

Since I knew I only needed to kill one monster, I decided to try to ignore the rest. The MT used his new Hostile Takeover card to focus the initial monsters, and allowed my heroes to sprint through, jump the traps, and get to the pressure plate. It worked out with no new monsters in the second room. I figured the Scoundrel was going to have to take the golem alone, because I could only get one hero in the room. He went invisible to make a big hit with a Singled Out Venom Shiv on his opening attack.

At this point, I hadn't faced a boss, or anything this big. When I read the stats of the golem, I realized the Scoundrel was going to need the help from his ally to trigger the extra damage from his cards. Thankfully, the pressure plate inside the room allowed him to let the MT in after two rounds of imp crowd control.

With both in the room, the golem was poisoned and wounded. The Scoundrel was able to land a Blessed hit on his Backstab with the last Single Out bonus. Since he was near exhausted and the golem was severely damaged, he took the focus and sacrificed himself. The MT was able to get in a few minor hits and the wound finished him off.

Both classes being able to do 4+ damage was a huge asset.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Flo
Germany
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
We failed the scenario yesterday. The party consisted of Brute, Spellweaver, Tinkerer and Mindthief. The first card that the imps in the first room drew was some target two with poison. This was hard for the brute since he played his taunt and drew most of the imps on himself with their double attacks. IIRC he had to lose 3 cards due to damage in the first round and had 8 curses in his deck. Then we probably made the mistake of killing everything in the first room before proceeding. We couldn't get the tinkerer through the second room because he didn't have any jump/fly abilities so we started the boss without him. We were all level 3 and played on hard so the golem had level 4 and 68 health! This was just absurd. Brute was exhausted after one attack which left my mindthief and the spellweaver to deal damage. When tinkerer finally arrived he had 2 turns left. Spellweaver and I were exhausted short after that with 19 health remaining on the golem.

I'm not even sure whether we would be able to succeed in this scenario with a different strategy and tinkerer with jump. It seems so hard compared to the usual campaign scenarios. We'd played around 7 scenarios, last 5 on hard and haven't lost any of them until now.

We nevertheless agreed to proceed with a different scenario until the tinkerer can afford the jump shoes. But I'm wondering whether rushing to the last room and locking the imps out is the proper strategy. After all it 's a long way and someone needs to tank them since they move absurdly far and have absurdly long range.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ravi Bhikhie
Netherlands
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
We JUST finished this scenario with a L2 SW, L3 CH, L4 MT and L3 Brute.
I also thought it was impossible but we managed to whittle down the 'Boss' by switching disarms and stuns and we had everyone blessed.

Update: We played the scenario on Level 3(instead of 2) because someone insisted.

It also helped that a few of us had jumps for the middle room.
The Cragheart and Spellweaver went exhausted, the Brute and Mindthief had one turn left.
Brute was doing a Pierce with some frequency.
We have also tuned our Attack Modifier decks to remove negative cards as much as possible.

It's a tough one, but very interesting.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Flo
Germany
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
Iceman_B wrote:
We JUST finished this scenario with a L2 SW, L3 CH, L4 MT and L3 Brute.
I also thought it was impossible but we managed to whittle down the 'Boss' by switching disarms and stuns and we had everyone blessed.

It also helped that a few of us had jumps for the middle room.
The Cragheart and Spellweaver went exhausted, the Brute and Mindthief had one turn left.
Brute was doing a Pierce with some frequency.

It's a tough one, but very interesting.


Did you kill every monster from the first room or did you rush for the boss and close the door behind you?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ravi Bhikhie
Netherlands
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
We killed every monster in the first room.
We decided to not want to deal with Forest Imps biting our legs off as we scurried forward.

We also had no idea that the second room was such an....obstacle.
But because we tried to kill the monsters in the firsts room asap, I didn't notice that my(Cragheart) jumps were already lost.

So I had a bit of trouble keeping up with the rest in the second room.
The Brute and Mindthief managed to deal the final blows just after I got exhausted.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sean Hagans
United States
Colorado
flag msg tools
mb
If this is the scenario where
edit: never mind this post.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Darren Nakamura
United States
Columbus
Mississippi
flag msg tools
http://www.destructoid.com/author.phtml?a=1364
badge
Darren@destructoid.com
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
That strategy is specifically disallowed by the special scenario rules:
Gloomhaven Scenario Book, Page 86, Special Rules wrote:
The elite Stone Golem is one level higher than the scenario level, up to a maximum of 7, and it has HxC hit points, where H is an elite Stone Golem’s regular hit point value. This is the Arcane Golem. It cannot enter or pass through door 2.


Emphasis mine.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sean Hagans
United States
Colorado
flag msg tools
mb
Well then, oops. Guess we'll replay that one and do it right.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul
Brazil
Sao Paulo
flag msg tools
Using Two-Mini Class I wonder if it would be legal to ...

Spoiler (click to reveal)
... use Disorienting Roar and Swap the Golem with other figure outside the room. It's said it can't pass through the door but using Roar it's basically not passing through the door but being ... teleported ? What do you guys think ?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Darren Nakamura
United States
Columbus
Mississippi
flag msg tools
http://www.destructoid.com/author.phtml?a=1364
badge
Darren@destructoid.com
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I think it goes against the spirit of the scenario rules, if not the letter of them.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Darren Nakamura
United States
Columbus
Mississippi
flag msg tools
http://www.destructoid.com/author.phtml?a=1364
badge
Darren@destructoid.com
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
And though the OP probably doesn't care any more, I can say how we beat this one. Pretty easily, too.

Angry Face + Circles
Spoiler (click to reveal)
Summoner surrounded the Arcane Golem with summons, Doomstalker hit it with the Doom that grants summons +2 to their attacks. We had our third character tanking damage for the summons, and they burned the Arcane Golem down in like four rounds. Faster than we expected.


The general notes are what everybody else is saying. Poison, Wound, true damage, and high single target damage are what you should focus on.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gabriel Rockman
United States
Maryland
flag msg tools
It's always fun seeing someone finding a way to use Circles extremely effectively. It's the most challenging class to learn, but it's got huge potential when played right.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Flo P
Austria
Vienna
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Thanks Darren, that is really cool way to tackle the golem.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.