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No Retreat! The North African Front» Forums » Rules

Subject: Again CB rss

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arubioe arubioe
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hi

sorry but i read all threads about CB and I'm still confused


Rules say 13.0: "the Non-Phasing player declares additional Target Hexes that must also be attacked by the Phasing player if adjacent at the start of this combat phase..."


OK, it seems CB marker must be place in a non-phasing player unit adjacent to a phasing-player unit, not?


But, what rule exactly say that mechanized units can receive a CB marker without being adjacent to a phasing-player unit?


And, what rule exactly say that a alone white combat unit cannot receive a CB marker (except in a involuntary counterblow)?


And, what happen if white combat unit is not alone and its hex receive a CB marker and it's attacked?, no participate in combat?, but suffer results?


thanks
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Tim K
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arubioe wrote:

Rules say 13.0: "the Non-Phasing player declares additional Target Hexes that must also be attacked by the Phasing player if adjacent at the start of this combat phase..."

OK, it seems CB marker must be place in a non-phasing player unit adjacent to a phasing-player unit, not?


The wording of the NRNA rules could be better. Carl has admitted as much.

You're reading too much into that section. That is one requirement for CB placement, not the only requirement.

arubioe wrote:

But, what rule exactly say that mechanized units can receive a CB marker without being adjacent to a phasing-player unit?


Two paragraphs later on the same page under Mechanized Response Move.

arubioe wrote:

And, what rule exactly say that a alone white combat unit cannot receive a CB marker (except in a involuntary counterblow)?


Second bullet point at end of same page under Counterblow Effects implies this.

arubioe wrote:

And, what happen if white combat unit is not alone and its hex receive a CB marker and it's attacked?, no participate in combat?, but suffer results?


I think this is correct.
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arubioe arubioe
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Sorry, but What are those requirements for place a CB?

Sorry, but under Mechanized Response Move there is nothing about if you can o not place a CB marker in a unit nor adjacent to enemey units



sorry, but Second bullet point at end of same page under Counterblow Effects no say nothing very clear about that you can not put a CB marker in a hex with white-units
 
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Carl Paradis
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Ok it seems I have to intervene here.

arubioe wrote:

Rules say 13.0: "the Non-Phasing player declares additional Target Hexes that must also be attacked by the Phasing player if adjacent at the start of this combat phase..."


Yes, this is obviously correct.

arubioe wrote:

OK, it seems CB marker must be place in a non-phasing player unit adjacent to a phasing-player unit, not?


Nope, there is no obligation stated to that effect in the rules. IF you want to force adjacent phasing player units (attackers) to attack this hex you do this; otherwise you can place the marker on any other of your units.

arubioe wrote:

But, what rule exactly say that mechanized units can receive a CB marker without being adjacent to a phasing-player unit?


The Mechanized Response Move Rule implies this. Granted it does not specify that any units can get the marker even if not adjacent to an enemy unit, but it doe snot forbid it either. In retrospect I should have not said "not in an enemy ZOC" but instead "Not adjacent to an enemy unit" to avoid confusion.

Plus the last sentence of the rules states: "They lose their Counterblow marker if not ending their move adjacent to an enemy unit"

Also, note that the "Declaring All Battles" counterblow rule does not say that you MUST place a Counterblow adjacent to an enemy unit either. It only states that if enemy units are adjacent to a counterblow marker they must attack it.


I will answer the rest later today I must go out. meeple
 
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Carl Paradis
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arubioe wrote:

And, what rule exactly say that a alone white combat unit cannot receive a CB marker (except in a involuntary counterblow)


No rule stops you from putting a Counterblow marker on a hex with a white unit all alone, but this bullet point in the counterblow effects rule, page 14, says:

Units of the Non-Phasing Player with a white—or white-outlined—Combat Strength in the Target Hex cannot participate in the Counterblow (they cannot “move onto the enemy”), whereas units with a black Combat Strength stacked with them must participate.

So if you put a counterblow counter on a white unit alone, since the White and White-Outlined units (minefields) cannot participate in the CB, the Counterblow marker has no effect since there are no other units (black) left to be attacked. You just wasted a Counterblow marker... devil

arubioe wrote:

And, what happen if white combat unit is not alone and its hex receive a CB marker and it's attacked?, no participate in combat?, but suffer results?


Note that the only White and white-outlined units in the game are static fortifications (mines and Forts).

It does not participate in the Combat, they stay there and do not "really" suffer the combat results, as they are not involved at all in the combat results; BUT they might still be eliminated if there is an advance after combat in the hex. Read read this rule, page 19,



Advance After Combat:

Procedure

AAC is not movement per se, and does not consume MPs; you just count hexes. Enemy Zones of Control have no effect on AAC. When AAC is allowed (see above), attack- ing units up to the stacking limit (see 12.2.4) may always advance into the defender’s just-vacated Target Hex. Any Box or Minefield unit there is removed to the the Stock at the end of that advance segment, and any Leader marker there is placed on the next Game Turn on the Game Turn Track as a Reinforcement, except for O’Connor who has a white dot ( ) on his counter and is thus eliminated. Also see Port Capture (11.2).


Plus the blue box right after it:

Remember, any Minefield or Box markers left in the defending hex are “overrun” and eliminated if the Attackers advance into the hex after combat.

Is everything I explained clarify things for you? meeple
 
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Tim K
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licinius wrote:
Note that the only White and white-outlined units in the game are static fortifications (mines and Forts).


Carl means mines and boxes. Forts are units in another of his games (NRIF and perhaps others).
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Carl Paradis
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htjester wrote:
licinius wrote:
Note that the only White and white-outlined units in the game are static fortifications (mines and Forts).


Carl means mines and boxes. Forts are units in another of his games (NRIF and perhaps others).


Ooops right, mines and boxes, sorry... blush
 
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Christian van Someren
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Just to clarify:

licinius wrote:

Plus the last sentence of the rules states: "They lose their Counterblow marker if not ending their move adjacent to an enemy unit"
 
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Carl Paradis
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Christianv wrote:
Just to clarify:

licinius wrote:

Plus the last sentence of the rules states: "They lose their Counterblow marker if not ending their move adjacent to an enemy unit"


Yes, my bad. I did not do a "cut-and-paste" on that sentence and mistyped. Darn. cry
 
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arubioe arubioe
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many thanks people
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