Elia - "Rainbow Hippie" Acca
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A friend of mine has recently acquired a copy of Sushi Go Party. None of us had ever played Sushi Go, and we all enjoyed it a lot.

After a few games (about 15, I guess) we notices that some of the dishes seem a bit too powerful. The main offender was Temaki, but also Pudding seemed like a no-brainer way too often.
These are the cards that award some points to the player having the most and take away some points to the player having the fewest.

Since points are not split in case of a tie, having zero of these is guaranteed to give you respectively -4 or -6 points. People tend to rush these, and as a consequence most people end up with 0-2 Temaki, with many ties (I'll talk about Temaki because it's mechanically simpler than Pudding, but Pudding is worse because it's scarcer and worth more). This gives an average value per card of 4-8 points, which is amazing.
So the game often boils down to who is dealt Temaki in the starting hand.
I've considered that this might be an issue of groupthink, but what single card play can you make that can offset a 4-8 points disadvantage?
Wasabi-3p Nigiri gives 4.5 points/card, and it's pretty much the best you can do, and you need to be lucky.
So, we started avoiding those cards. I'm open to being convinced that they are not dominant, but have trouble seeing how I could win without grabbing them ASAP.

I came to BGG to see if somebody else felt the same, and found out that the rules for dealing with ties have changed between Sushi Go and SG Party: Sushi Go used to split the points, while Sushi Go Party awards all the tied players the full points.

I suspect this is what broke Temaki and Pudding, and I'm going to try using the old rules for a while.

Does anybody feel the same?
 
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Molokov (AU)
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Given that Sushi Go was only 2-5 players, and Sushi Go Party goes up to 8, perhaps when you house-rule splitting the ties should only be used with fewer players?

Although getting negative points never feels good, I sometimes just ignore those types of cards (Temaki, Pudding) and decide I'll wear the negative points and focus on getting higher point totals from my other cards (such as Wasabi + Squid Nigiri = 9 points from 2 cards). Not always, though.

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Johny D
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In the original game Pudding was perfectly balanced. Basically, You try to avoid the penalty while acquiring a incrementals of 1 card. If you invested in it for the points, you would always lose the game.

In Sushi go party desert cards are handled a little bit different. The changes make Pudding a little bit problematic (more scarce) because it has a decreased marginal utility. At +6/-6 this seems to be an almost gamebreaking card, But I think the the logic stated above still applies. On the other hand, Temaki at +4/-4 doesn't have such an impact and you are better most often to avoid it.
 
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Laszlo Korossy
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rulezfin wrote:
In the original game Pudding was perfectly balanced. Basically, You try to avoid the penalty while acquiring a incrementals of 1 card. If you invested in it for the points, you would always lose the game.

In Sushi go party desert cards are handled a little bit different. The changes make Pudding a little bit problematic (since its a roll and therefore more scarce) because it has a decreased marginal utility. At +6/-6 this seems to be an almost gamebreaking card, But I think the the logic stated above still applies. On the other hand, Temaki at +4/-4 doesn't have such an impact and you are better most often to avoid it.


What do you mean that Pudding is a "roll?" Desserts are distinct from rolls.

Both you and the original poster seem to be saying that Pudding is more powerful than Temaki. Is it possible that you are both scoring pudding (+6/-6) after every hand, rather than only at the end of the entire game? Temaki is worth +4/-4 EACH HAND (after three hands, then, giving a total of between 12 and minus 12 points) while Pudding only gives between six and minus six points within the same period.
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Elia - "Rainbow Hippie" Acca
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korossyl wrote:
rulezfin wrote:
In the original game Pudding was perfectly balanced. Basically, You try to avoid the penalty while acquiring a incrementals of 1 card. If you invested in it for the points, you would always lose the game.

In Sushi go party desert cards are handled a little bit different. The changes make Pudding a little bit problematic (since its a roll and therefore more scarce) because it has a decreased marginal utility. At +6/-6 this seems to be an almost gamebreaking card, But I think the the logic stated above still applies. On the other hand, Temaki at +4/-4 doesn't have such an impact and you are better most often to avoid it.


What do you mean that Pudding is a "roll?" Desserts are distinct from rolls.

Both you and the original poster seem to be saying that Pudding is more powerful than Temaki. Is it possible that you are both scoring pudding (+6/-6) after every hand, rather than only at the end of the entire game? Temaki is worth +4/-4 EACH HAND (after three hands, then, giving a total of between 12 and minus 12 points) while Pudding only gives between six and minus six points within the same period.


I am positive that I'm playing pudding correctly, scoring only at the end of the game and stashing puddings till then. Just like any other dessert. But yes, Temaki is just as problematic, if not more, but I haven't played a lot with it as written in the rules.

In different news, we are playing with the old rules and it's been working great. Much more balanced.
 
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Elia - "Rainbow Hippie" Acca
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Molokov wrote:
Given that Sushi Go was only 2-5 players, and Sushi Go Party goes up to 8, perhaps when you house-rule splitting the ties should only be used with fewer players?

Although getting negative points never feels good, I sometimes just ignore those types of cards (Temaki, Pudding) and decide I'll wear the negative points and focus on getting higher point totals from my other cards (such as Wasabi + Squid Nigiri = 9 points from 2 cards). Not always, though.



I just realized that I never replied to this, sorry!
Yeah, most of our games are with 3-5 players, we are not interested on playing with more, so our "houserule" is only tested for 3-5.

Anyway, I'm familiar with the concept of calculated loss, but in a 4 players game the combination of 2 puddings is generally worth 12, and it's much easier to connect them.
The first pudding is always worth at least 6, because to catch up, all your opponents must play one pudding. The value of the other puddings is a bit more varied, but there is generally at least one player for whom it would be worth 6, so you often snatch one just as a denial strategy, depending on your relative positions, the round number, and so on.
This is crazily out of proportion compared to the 4.5/card value of a very hard-to-connect combo which used to have the primate of best points/cards ratio in the old edition.
 
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Laszlo Korossy
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I have wondered why they made this change. My group plays with pudding pretty regularly, but it's rarely been decisive; personally, I usually find that it's more worth it to take the hit and to play different cards instead. That you (and many others!) have such drastically different experiences reinforces for me what a great game this is. I'm glad the houserule (which is really just the original rule) is working out for you, and I'm going to keep that in mind in case we ever run into the same problem.
 
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