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Subject: Duration of Play? rss

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Sidney S
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Hello there,

I've been looking at this game for awhile now but have always been concerned about length of game. If we were playing with 4 and 2 are AP-prone, what would be the expectation of game duration??


Thanks in advance!
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Philip R
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salsaking wrote:
Hello there,

I've been looking at this game for awhile now but have always been concerned about length of game. If we were playing with 4 and 2 are AP-prone, what would be the expectation of game duration??


Thanks in advance!


AP prone can mean anything so any estimation I give will have huge error bars.

I would guess 3 hours +/-1 hour for 4 players. I have 5 player games that range from 2 to 3 hours and some of us are lightly AP prone. This kind of game you should occasionally have a 2-10 minute turn but should otherwise most of your moves should be obvious.

The sequential card playing nature tends to guide you along a direction of play which helps reduce AP. That said, there are a couple of times in each game where you will reevaluate the direction you want to take your play.
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Carthoris Pyramidos
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My estimate is 30 minutes per experienced player, 45 per noob. "AP-prone" noobs? Maybe 60?

If all four players are new to the game, I'd make sure you have three and a half hours to be able to finish comforatably.
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FWIW my 3P game last night with one noob and one AP noob took around 2 hours.
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Derry Salewski
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Carthoris wrote:
My estimate is 30 minutes per experienced player, 45 per noob. "AP-prone" noobs? Maybe 60?

If all four players are new to the game, I'd make sure you have three and a half hours to be able to finish comforatably.


That
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Dylan Maillard
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With 4 players, 2 hours, max 2,5h with AP players.
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Sidney S
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Thanks everyone, these responses have been extremely helpful - it feels like it'll be 3 hours for 4 players within my community.

Might need shorter games considering available time......

Thanks again!
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Doug Stewart
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Data point for reference: I taught 4 medium-experience gamers and then played a full 5 player game in roughly 2:15. It can be done, though no one was truly AP prone.
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Andrea Bampi
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I'm surprised nobody asked how much (...if?) the involved players know the game... I assume it would be the first time for all (?) and this would HUGELY change duration... trivial? cool
 
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Russ Williams
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RickNash wrote:
I'm surprised nobody asked how much (...if?) the involved players know the game... I assume it would be the first time for all (?) and this would HUGELY change duration... trivial? cool

It seemed obvious from the OP that we are talking about new players who are thinking about trying the game. Otherwise why would Sidney even ask the question? Experienced players would already know how long they take!

(But in any case various answers have specified whether they are giving estimates for newbies or for experienced players.)
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Andrea Bampi
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russ wrote:
RickNash wrote:
I'm surprised nobody asked how much (...if?) the involved players know the game... I assume it would be the first time for all (?) and this would HUGELY change duration... trivial? cool

It seemed obvious from the OP that we are talking about new players who are thinking about trying the game. Otherwise why would Sidney even ask the question? Experienced players would already know how long they take!

(But in any case various answers have specified whether they are giving estimates for newbies or for experienced players.)


Well, "experienced player" sounds ambiguous. Some people here meant "experienced with Concordia", others clearly meant "experienced in gaming (general)".
More: Dylan Maillard a couple of posts above answers "2 hours", pretty much impossible IMHO if ALL 4 are new to Concordia (unless they play completely random).
That's why I was puzzled. Anyway I agree with Philip R, but the duration of the VERY FIRST game is definitely higher (usually), since people will much probably need to discuss some rules, eventually checking the rulebook etc.
My 2 cents.
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Russ Williams
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RickNash wrote:
Well, "experienced player" sounds ambiguous. Some people here meant "experienced with Concordia", others clearly meant "experienced in gaming (general)".


Ah, OK, fair enough!
 
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Doug Stewart
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RickNash wrote:
russ wrote:
RickNash wrote:
I'm surprised nobody asked how much (...if?) the involved players know the game... I assume it would be the first time for all (?) and this would HUGELY change duration... trivial? cool

It seemed obvious from the OP that we are talking about new players who are thinking about trying the game. Otherwise why would Sidney even ask the question? Experienced players would already know how long they take!

(But in any case various answers have specified whether they are giving estimates for newbies or for experienced players.)


Well, "experienced player" sounds ambiguous. Some people here meant "experienced with Concordia", others clearly meant "experienced in gaming (general)".
More: Dylan Maillard a couple of posts above answers "2 hours", pretty much impossible IMHO if ALL 4 are new to Concordia (unless they play completely random).
That's why I was puzzled. Anyway I agree with Philip R, but the duration of the VERY FIRST game is definitely higher (usually), since people will much probably need to discuss some rules, eventually checking the rulebook etc.
My 2 cents.


As I said above, I managed to teach it to 4 other gamers and play a 5 player game, all under 2.5 hours. Your mileage may vary, but 2 hours for 4 folks is definitely doable.
 
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Eric Matthews
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Ya I find it to be around 2 hours; less if everyone has played recently and are not AP; make it 2.5 if it's new to most folks or you have AP people.

And as with most games add extra time if there isn't a teacher who already knows it from either playing or at least reading the rules/solo playtest or watching a how to play AHEAD OF TIME.
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Sidney S
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I would say my typical gaming friends lean towards inexperienced gamers - only maybe 1 is truly experienced.

We tend to experience AP on Puerto Rico often if that is any indication.

I think 3 hours for 4 people is a fair estimate given there will probably always be at least 1 player learning.



Thanks again!
 
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Andrea Bampi
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zamoose wrote:

As I said above, I managed to teach it to 4 other gamers and play a 5 player game, all under 2.5 hours. Your mileage may vary, but 2 hours for 4 folks is definitely doable.


I surely believe you cool ...but we have a "4 newbies" scenario here. Much different story.
 
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Philip R
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salsaking wrote:
We tend to experience AP on Puerto Rico often if that is any indication.

I think 3 hours for 4 people is a fair estimate given there will probably always be at least 1 player learning.


Puerto Rico is definitely an AP type of game, I think there is a lot more thinking per move than Concordia.

But Puerto Rico can provide some data points!

My group (all experienced players) does a 4P Puerto Rico in about an hour. That said, our first PR game was 5 hours

4P Concordia for my group is about 1.5-2 hours, so roughly double the time. Your first game will definitely be well into 3-4 hours between teaching and learning while playing.

The one nice thing about Concordia I find is it a little lighter to teach compared to Puerto Rico.
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Sidney S
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pipperoni wrote:
salsaking wrote:
We tend to experience AP on Puerto Rico often if that is any indication.

I think 3 hours for 4 people is a fair estimate given there will probably always be at least 1 player learning.


Puerto Rico is definitely an AP type of game, I think there is a lot more thinking per move than Concordia.

But Puerto Rico can provide some data points!

My group (all experienced players) does a 4P Puerto Rico in about an hour. That said, our first PR game was 5 hours

4P Concordia for my group is about 1.5-2 hours, so roughly double the time. Your first game will definitely be well into 3-4 hours between teaching and learning while playing.

The one nice thing about Concordia I find is it a little lighter to teach compared to Puerto Rico.



HAHA, that is a good data point - Puerto Rico takes us, for 4 players, 2 hours and 15 minutes for mostly players that have played before. Yes, some SLOW players in our group......

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kos blaat
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Personally I feel AP is an issue only if there is nothing to do when it's not your turn. In Concordia, time flies by because as players use action cards you can make plans, same when regions get counted: all those ideas tha t grow in your mind, plus you see the world evolve.. There are games when I watch the clock in boredom but never in Concordia.
That said, I would suggest to try to find people that are not AP.
Imagine playing Kingdomino with AP fanatics

Puerto Rico overall feels heavier, and with AP players it would become very annoying, they can drag the game even when it's NOT their turn! Hmm, shall I ship maize, or indigo? Wait, if I do coffee first, my neighbor cant sell his tobacco 3 rounds after... This, every time. And you just wait and wait..

Yeah.

Ftr, c took 2 hours, pr always around 90 minutes. Setup time is about 5 minutes for both, given that you don't change player counts next time you start PR. Tear down time also around 5 minutes, if everyone cooperates.

Final point is that PR is more shelf friendly than the ridiculously large Concordia box.
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Philip R
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salsaking wrote:
HAHA, that is a good data point - Puerto Rico takes us, for 4 players, 2 hours and 15 minutes for mostly players that have played before. Yes, some SLOW players in our group......


Ouch! At that duration people start to get bored and start taking up other activities such as smart phones, chatting, going to get food/drink, etc, additional things that only draw out the game longer!
 
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Andrea Bampi
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pipperoni wrote:
salsaking wrote:
HAHA, that is a good data point - Puerto Rico takes us, for 4 players, 2 hours and 15 minutes for mostly players that have played before. Yes, some SLOW players in our group......


Ouch! At that duration people start to get bored and start taking up other activities such as smart phones, chatting, going to get food/drink, etc, additional things that only draw out the game longer!


Well, it really depends on the kind of group you are in. We played dozens of games with 4-5 people (sometimes 6 with the unofficial exp), we NEVER made it in less than 2 hours, never chat with our phones, but we talk, drink, eat, occasionally experience some AP (insulting the culprit) and, much more importantly, enjoy every minute.
Never understood the "hurry on!" approach in gaming!
 
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Sidney S
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RickNash wrote:
pipperoni wrote:
salsaking wrote:
HAHA, that is a good data point - Puerto Rico takes us, for 4 players, 2 hours and 15 minutes for mostly players that have played before. Yes, some SLOW players in our group......


Ouch! At that duration people start to get bored and start taking up other activities such as smart phones, chatting, going to get food/drink, etc, additional things that only draw out the game longer!


Well, it really depends on the kind of group you are in. We played dozens of games with 4-5 people (sometimes 6 with the unofficial exp), we NEVER made it in less than 2 hours, never chat with our phones, but we talk, drink, eat, occasionally experience some AP (insulting the culprit) and, much more importantly, enjoy every minute.
Never understood the "hurry on!" approach in gaming!


That sounds like my group! But maybe a few more occasions of AP. =P
 
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