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Subject: Question about Betrayal rss

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Bertrand Kintanar
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I've watched the Dice Tower Rising Sun Demo posted last May of 2017, it says that when betraying, it goes for type for type. So can I replace two figures from different players that are monsters with my monsters?
 
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Sean Badger
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Yes. Shinto can only be replaced by shino, bushi can only be replaced by bushi, and monsters can only be replaced by monsters. It does not matter what type of monster, it just has to be a monster.
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Bertrand Kintanar
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Thanks for the quick response.
 
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Sean K
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Correct, although do remember that a shinto at a shrine cannot be replaced. Only figures on the map.
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Bertrand Kintanar
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It says replace 2 figures with your own, does that mean replace 2 with 1? or 2 with 2 of your own figures?
 
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Casey Smith
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bkintanar wrote:
It says replace 2 figures with your own, does that mean replace 2 with 1? or 2 with 2 of your own figures?


Replace 2 figures, but each one needs to belong to a different clan. So replace 1 from the Koi Clan, and another from the Fox Clan, total 2 different figures.
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Ryan Wolfe
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With Betrayal do you break the alliance first, or do you swap the figures first. It's one way on the reference card and (less clearly) the other way in the rule book.
 
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Mr. Octavius
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0 hr wrote:


With Betrayal do you break the alliance first, or do you swap the figures first. It's one way on the reference card and (less clearly) the other way in the rule book.


Is there a scenerio in which it makes a difference?
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Rick Mullaney

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Yes, because another card may block or protect anyone with high honor then you. So timing absolutely matters. Just not clear which comes first. The card reads breaking alliance in second paragraph but the instructions seem to read the other way around.
 
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Niall Smyth
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Schlitz2604 wrote:
Yes, because another card may block or protect anyone with high honor then you. So timing absolutely matters. Just not clear which comes first. The card reads breaking alliance in second paragraph but the instructions seem to read the other way around.


I think he meant which cards exactly, but I can think of some. Oni Of Hate, for example.

The book is pretty clear. You immediately break the alliance and lose honour. Then you replace.

The boards are secondary to the book, and anyway the book is very clear about ‘immediately’.
 
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Ryan Wolfe
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Well, not all THAT clear, but I agree that the rulebook should take precedence over the reference card. Just wanted to check.

As a new player (and not the game owner) I only had the reference card and I could not understand why people were saying lose honor first when it is 100% clear on the reference card that it is the last thing you do. It made a difference of 2 points depending on which way it was read. It didn't matter in the long run but it did cause a needless argument.

After falling for that temple card that says "gain a point or a stronghold" but actually MEANS "gain 1 point per stronghold", I should have been more suspicious of the editing. At least the minis are cool



 
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Casey Smith
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0 hr wrote:


Well, not all THAT clear, but I agree that the rulebook should take precedence over the reference card. Just wanted to check.

As a new player (and not the game owner) I only had the reference card and I could not understand why people were saying lose honor first when it is 100% clear on the reference card that it is the last thing you do. It made a difference of 2 points depending on which way it was read. It didn't matter in the long run but it did cause a needless argument.

After falling for that temple card that says "gain a point or a stronghold" but actually MEANS "gain 1 point per stronghold", I should have been more suspicious of the editing. At least the minis are cool





Your post doesnt make much sense, which card are you talking about? Form of the Kitsune is the only that I know of where you get vp per stronghold and its a winter upgrade. Honor doesn't effect its scoring at all.
 
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Casey Smith
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Schlitz2604 wrote:
Yes, because another card may block or protect anyone with high honor then you. So timing absolutely matters. Just not clear which comes first. The card reads breaking alliance in second paragraph but the instructions seem to read the other way around.


I can't think of any cards that come into play during a betrayal mandate. Can you give a better example than an abstract one?

Edit, Okay I found one Betrayal card and all it lets you do is swap an additional unit, even worshipping shinto. Honor still doesn't matter. The card is Path of the Unrighteous.
 
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Mr. Octavius
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SwissQueso wrote:
0 hr wrote:


Well, not all THAT clear, but I agree that the rulebook should take precedence over the reference card. Just wanted to check.

As a new player (and not the game owner) I only had the reference card and I could not understand why people were saying lose honor first when it is 100% clear on the reference card that it is the last thing you do. It made a difference of 2 points depending on which way it was read. It didn't matter in the long run but it did cause a needless argument.

After falling for that temple card that says "gain a point or a stronghold" but actually MEANS "gain 1 point per stronghold", I should have been more suspicious of the editing. At least the minis are cool





Your post doesnt make much sense, which card are you talking about? Form of the Kitsune is the only that I know of where you get vp per stronghold and its a winter upgrade. Honor doesn't effect its scoring at all.


One of the Kami has an ability of "1vp/Stronghold", in this case the "/" means per, not or.
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Ryan Wolfe
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I'm sorry that you don't understand. I did mention that I do not own the game and, as I did not memorize the names of the cards during play, I cannot be of further assistance. Luckily my questions has already been answered.
 
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Mr. Octavius
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SwissQueso wrote:
Schlitz2604 wrote:
Yes, because another card may block or protect anyone with high honor then you. So timing absolutely matters. Just not clear which comes first. The card reads breaking alliance in second paragraph but the instructions seem to read the other way around.


I can't think of any cards that come into play during a betrayal mandate. Can you give a better example than an abstract one?

Edit, Okay I found one Betrayal card and all it lets you do is swap an additional unit, even worshipping shinto. Honor still doesn't matter. The card is Path of the Unrighteous.


Oni of Hate kills figures with higher honor than you if it enters a province for any reason. So if Betray places Oni of Hate in a province it can make a difference if the honor loss is before or after. Oni of Spite is similar but steals points.
This is a rare scenario, as they are both Autumn cards so they would need to be removed from the board with a betray first, but it can happen.
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Casey Smith
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Maebon wrote:
SwissQueso wrote:
Schlitz2604 wrote:
Yes, because another card may block or protect anyone with high honor then you. So timing absolutely matters. Just not clear which comes first. The card reads breaking alliance in second paragraph but the instructions seem to read the other way around.


I can't think of any cards that come into play during a betrayal mandate. Can you give a better example than an abstract one?

Edit, Okay I found one Betrayal card and all it lets you do is swap an additional unit, even worshipping shinto. Honor still doesn't matter. The card is Path of the Unrighteous.


Oni of Hate kills figures with higher honor than you if it enters a province for any reason. So if Betray places Oni of Hate in a province it can make a difference if the honor loss is before or after. Oni of Spite is similar but steals points.
This is a rare scenario, as they are both Autumn cards so they would need to be removed from the board with a betray first, but it can happen.
.

In the rulebook it actually says you immediately lose honor before it explains replacing units, so I would think it would happen before replacing units.

Also thanks for clarifying for me.
 
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Dariusz Kaminski
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Hi Guys

another question about Betrayal mandate.

When I use Betrayal do I always have to break alliance and lose honor ?

Even if I dont replace any figure of my Ally ?
 
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Casey Smith
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Kamieniak wrote:
Hi Guys

another question about Betrayal mandate.

When I use Betrayal do I always have to break alliance and lose honor ?

Even if I dont replace any figure of my Ally ?


Yes.
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