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Do I have to wait one turn to use the workers I've just activated? I'm asking because of this fragment from the Supply and Force workers descriptions:
Quote:
(1), then move all of your Workers from the tired column to the active column (2) (ready to be used in later Action rounds of the same Era)


Is building 408 somehow different in this regard?
 
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Re: Supply and force workers actions -- do I have to wait one turn to use the workers I've just activated? What about building 408?
If it's a Free Action to activate them, you can use the Workers this same turn. If it's not, then you wait till your next turn.

Building 408 is not a Free Action. So yes, you wait till your next turn.
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Re: Supply and force workers actions -- do I have to wait one turn to use the workers I've just activated? What about building 408?

An Era is a Game Turn (not a player turn). Each Era consists of phases.. one in particular which is the "Action Rounds Phase". During this phase, players take turns completing actions. So for your turn, you activated your tired workers. But you still have as many turns remaining as you can take until you pass. What that excerpt is telling you is that those workers are free to use for all the remaining turns of that same Era!

 
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Re: Supply and force workers actions -- do I have to wait one turn to use the workers I've just activated? What about building 408?
But isn't the word "later" here excluding the current "action round"?
 
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Re: Supply and force workers actions -- do I have to wait one turn to use the workers I've just activated? What about building 408?
j_tarb wrote:
But isn't the word "later" here excluding the current "action round"?


Again, it depends on whether it's a Free Action or not. The "later Action rounds of the same Era" part is a bit misleading and should've just been worded to say that these Workers can be used in the same Era, in the same action round they are activated in or later.
 
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Re: Supply and force workers actions -- do I have to wait one turn to use the workers I've just activated? What about building 408?
EPratt wrote:
j_tarb wrote:
But isn't the word "later" here excluding the current "action round"?


Again, it depends on whether it's a Free Action or not. The "later Action rounds of the same Era" part is a bit misleading and should've just been worded to say that these Workers can be used in the same Era, in the same action round they are activated in or later.


I understand the difference between a Free Action and an Action. The fact that the "later Action rounds of the same Era" fragment is also present in the description of "Force workers" (which is a Free Action) only adds to confusion IMHO. Your wording is definitely much clearer.

So my group wasn't playing correctly after all...

BTW, I wonder whether one could even interpret the part "of the same Era" so that the player won't be able to use previously activated workers (left in the Active column) in the next Era (the one that comes after "the same Era").

 
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Don't interpret it that way. There'd be no good way to keep track of this, and it's not thematically logical and certainly not the designers' intent. It's just poor wording again, which the second printing was supposed to take care of, but because this question hasn't been asked before, I guess this rewording opportunity was missed. : /

Maybe there will be another rulebook revision...? Or perhaps David can simply add this to the FAQ.

Have fun with your next game! With so much going on, we missed stuff, too, in our first few games, but the rules and iconography become quite intuitive with repeat plays.
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The game has up to 7 Eras. In each era there are a bunch of action rounds. What this rule "means" to say is that you activate them on action round X, and you get to use the reactivated workers immediately from action round X+1 (hence a later round, as opposed to the next Era).

But of course what the rulebook is forgetting that there are at least 2 ways of reactivating the workers without spending your action (force or dominance's supply), in which case the "clarification" is actually getting the rule wrong as it implies you can't use them on the action round when you reactivated them.

That's silly. Of course you can use them right away.
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I wish all publishers could just settle on the same use of "round" and "turn"… shake
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SpecularRain wrote:
I wish all publishers could just settle on the same use of "round" and "turn"… shake


Yes it's a thing Viktor and I routinely disagree on
I call Round the big thing and Turn the small one, he does it the other way , consistently

This really hit me as I was writing the Trickerion expansion's rulebook, but Anachrony has the same difference with "Action Rounds"

But luckily this is our biggest disagreement, so life is really good
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I'm with you, David. A "round" consists of every player taking their "turn."

If someone hasn't noticed that they should make their move, you say, "Hey, it's your turn."

But we're starting to digress from the original topic of the thread.
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EPratt wrote:
But we're starting to digress from the original topic of the thread.

Oh look, the weather is surprisingly nice today!
 
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Literally everyone I have ever met has considered a "round" the big one.

In most games each person takes one turn until everyone around the table. Once everyone has gone, you have rounded the table.

Maybe different countries/cultures think of it differently?

I also have never heard anyone complete their action, turn to the next player and say "your round." It's most often "your turn."
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Brandizzle wrote:
Literally everyone I have ever met has considered a "round" the big one.

In most games each person takes one turn until everyone around the table. Once everyone has gone, you have rounded the table.

Maybe different countries/cultures think of it differently?

I also have never heard anyone complete their action, turn to the next player and say "your round." It's most often "your turn."


We would say 'your go', not 'your turn'... and being old school D&D players, there are 10 rounds to a turn...
 
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TDaver wrote:
SpecularRain wrote:
I wish all publishers could just settle on the same use of "round" and "turn"… shake


Yes it's a thing Viktor and I routinely disagree on
I call Round the big thing and Turn the small one, he does it the other way , consistently

This really hit me as I was writing the Trickerion expansion's rulebook, but Anachrony has the same difference with "Action Rounds"

But luckily this is our biggest disagreement, so life is really good


Based solely on my experience from these forums, I'm guessing the majority thinks a round is bigger than a turn, but it could be down to confirmation bias as well.

I'd call an Era a round in Anachrony, and in Trickerion, one round is everything that happens between moving the Trickerion Stone one step (base game is 5 rounds, full game is 7 rounds).

It would be pretty nice if we could convince Viktor he's wrong
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Kelanen wrote:
Brandizzle wrote:
Literally everyone I have ever met has considered a "round" the big one.

In most games each person takes one turn until everyone around the table. Once everyone has gone, you have rounded the table.

Maybe different countries/cultures think of it differently?

I also have never heard anyone complete their action, turn to the next player and say "your round." It's most often "your turn."


We would say 'your go', not 'your turn'...

Yes, but isn't that just shorthand for go take your turn, not take your round.

I've never heard any discussion around what you can do on your round, or hurry up and take your round, or whose round is it...
 
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Relax wrote:

Yes, but isn't that just shorthand for go take your turn, not take your round.

I've never heard any discussion around what you can do on your round, or hurry up and take your round, or whose round is it...


Not really. To me a Round is a sub-component of a Turn.
 
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Well, to me, a Turn is a sub-component of a Round!

But it's understandable that you hold the opposite opinion... after all, you Brits do drive on the wrong side of the road!


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Driving on the left has been the standard for about 2500 years! And driving on the right only happened to be deliberately different.
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Wasn’t going to jump in, but you’ve piqued my sense of nationalism. Obviously, I can’t offer up any stats, but I’d say it’s far more common over here to think of rounds consisting of players taking a turn each, not the other way around. Bugged the hell out of me reading the Archipelago rule book. Thought it was maybe some weird French thing.
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TDaver wrote:
The game has up to 7 Eras. In each era there are a bunch of action rounds. What this rule "means" to say is that you activate them on action round X, and you get to use the reactivated workers immediately from action round X+1 (hence a later round, as opposed to the next Era).

But of course what the rulebook is forgetting that there are at least 2 ways of reactivating the workers without spending your action (force or dominance's supply), in which case the "clarification" is actually getting the rule wrong as it implies you can't use them on the action round when you reactivated them.

That's silly. Of course you can use them right away.


I have to say that this whole discussion of rounds vs turns has confused me and I still don't know if after i immediately force the workers awake i still can use one of them (or do anything else for that matter) besides allowing my opponent to do his move first.

Lets assume that a turn is when we can activate 1 exosuit or do an action on the player board, and a round is all the players having 1 turn, and an era is the collection of all the rounds in that era.

Now on my turn is preforming a free action 'taking up' my ability to do anything else?

the rules say:
Quote:
This is the main phase of the game. Play goes in rounds
in clockwise order starting from the First Player. On their
turn, a player may perform any number of Free Actions,
then do one of the following:
1. Place one Worker...


and then they say:
Quote:
IMPORTANT : Free Actions
Free Actions may each be performed once per
Era, during any of the player’s turns. When used,
cover the Free Action spot with a Path marker as a
reminder that it has already been performed. Using
a Free Action doesn’t end the player’s turn – he may
also place a Worker (or pass) in that same turn. If a
player runs out of Path markers, he may not take any
more Free Actions during that Era.


I infer from this that free actions don't take up my move, I can preform each type of free action one per era, and as many as I have different ones (or tokens?) in a single turn and THEN use a worker to do something additional (or pass).
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jooice wrote:
TDaver wrote:
The game has up to 7 Eras. In each era there are a bunch of action rounds. What this rule "means" to say is that you activate them on action round X, and you get to use the reactivated workers immediately from action round X+1 (hence a later round, as opposed to the next Era).

But of course what the rulebook is forgetting that there are at least 2 ways of reactivating the workers without spending your action (force or dominance's supply), in which case the "clarification" is actually getting the rule wrong as it implies you can't use them on the action round when you reactivated them.

That's silly. Of course you can use them right away.


I have to say that this whole discussion of rounds vs turns has confused me and I still don't know if after i immediately force the workers awake i still can use one of them (or do anything else for that matter) besides allowing my opponent to do his move first.

Lets assume that a turn is when we can activate 1 exosuit or do an action on the player board, and a round is all the players having 1 turn, and an era is the collection of all the rounds in that era.

Now on my turn is preforming a free action 'taking up' my ability to do anything else?

the rules say:
Quote:
This is the main phase of the game. Play goes in rounds
in clockwise order starting from the First Player. On their
turn, a player may perform any number of Free Actions,
then do one of the following:
1. Place one Worker...


and then they say:
Quote:
IMPORTANT : Free Actions
Free Actions may each be performed once per
Era, during any of the player’s turns. When used,
cover the Free Action spot with a Path marker as a
reminder that it has already been performed. Using
a Free Action doesn’t end the player’s turn – he may
also place a Worker (or pass) in that same turn. If a
player runs out of Path markers, he may not take any
more Free Actions during that Era.


I infer from this that free actions don't take up my move, I can preform each type of free action one per era, and as many as I have different ones (or tokens?) in a single turn and THEN use a worker to do something additional (or pass).


Your last statement (bolded by me) is correct.

Taking a "free action" does not take up your ability to do something else. That's what's "free" about it. You can do as many "free actions" as you like (and have path markers for), before doing your regular action.
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jooice wrote:


I have to say that this whole discussion of rounds vs turns has confused me and I still don't know if after i immediately force the workers awake i still can use one of them (or do anything else for that matter) besides allowing my opponent to do his move first.


Round = 1 turn for each player
Turn = 1 action and as many free actions as you can take

If you wake your workers with a free action, you still have a regular action available that turn and can use them right away.

If you wake your workers by using a worker, you cannot use them right away as you have already used your action this turn, but you can still do free actions using your tokens.
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Thanks guys.

How about:

Quote:
Patron Valerian: Exosuit AI
(Free Action): When he places a
powered-up Exosuit during this
Action round, he may do so without placing a Worker in
it. When taking an Action, treat this Exosuit as though a
Scientist was placed in it.


Does this mean the player using Valerian can send an empty exosuit to do 1 action and then another exosuit with a worker to do a separate action all on the same turn?
 
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jooice wrote:
Thanks guys.

How about:

Quote:
Patron Valerian: Exosuit AI
(Free Action): When he places a
powered-up Exosuit during this
Action round, he may do so without placing a Worker in
it. When taking an Action, treat this Exosuit as though a
Scientist was placed in it.


Does this mean the player using Valerian can send an empty exosuit to do 1 (free) action and then another exosuit with a worker to do a separate action all on the same turn?


Yes, on your turn you get to do one regular action and any number of free actions.

Since the one you quoted is a free action, you can still do your regular action as well.


I was wrong, see below. Apologies.

 
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