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Subject: Rising Sun Season cards (and thus Monsters) semi-official FAQ rss

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If you have a question regarding a card or mechanic, I urge you to look at the official FAQ first, which can be found here: https://cmon-files.s3.amazonaws.com/pdf/assets_item/resource...

Note that as of yet some answers to the questions in this post are the result of reasoning from the community. I've updated this FAQ since the first and second official FAQ dropped (and deleted many cards and questions that were answered in it) and will try to keep it up to date with new questions and best (and official) answers in the comments and on the forums.

~ General ~


Q: How to add the extra Monsters from the Daimyo Box and Monster Pack?
A: You (randomly) choose 1 or 2 extra Monsters per Season and add them to the Season Deck, which means you can have up to 6 extra Monsters per game.

Q: When two or more abilities trigger at the same time, which goes first?
A: As said on page 7 of the rulebook: If there’s ever a conflict in the timing of the execution of an ability, the involved player with higher Honor decides whether to go first or last.

Example: Let’s say players A, B and C all need to do something at the same time. B has the highest honor and decides to go last. Now A and C remain. A has higher honor than C, so he decides to go last as well. The order will be: C, A, B.

Q: Does 'At the start of (this) Battle' in a Season card's description mean before or after bidding?
A: Before.

Q: Can you get the same upgrade twice?
A: Yes, as said on page 16 of the rulebook: 'A player may acquire more than 1 copy of the same Season card, across subsequent Trainings. In these cases, their abilities stack together.'

Q: How many Season cards are there?
A: 117 in total. 66 in the Core Box (21 Base Set, 15 Teapot Set, 15 Horseman Set, 15 Archway Set), 15 in Kami Unbound (Mountain Set), 22 in Dynasty Invasion (15 Ship Set, 7 Lucky Gods), 4 in the Monster Pack and 10 in the Daimyo Box. On top of those 117 Season cards, there are 7 Kami cards (Kami Unbound), which are tarot size (70 x 120 mm) instead of standard size (57 x 89 mm).

~ Season cards ~

Spring

Jinmenju (Monster Pack) - 'During a Recruit Mandate, you may Summon a figure in the Province and lose Honor.'

Q: (1) When a Recruit Mandate is selected, during your Summoning, or after everyone has finished Summoning? (2) Does Jinmenju count as a Stronghold?
A: (1) During your own Summoning. (2) No, it is a Monster.

Jorogumo (Monster Pack) - 'At the start of this Battle, take control of 1 local Bushi or Shinto until the end of the Battle.'

Q: (1) Can the controlling clan take the controlled figure hostage? (2) Can the original clan take the controlled figure hostage?
A: (1) No, it counts as their figure, and thus can't be taken hostage. (2) Yes, it would just return to their reserve without gaining them a Coin at the start of next Season.

Jurojin (Lucky God) - 'Counts as a Virtue card. Gain COIN COIN COIN after you acquire another Virtue card.'

Q: (1) For the purpose of counting as a (different) Virtue card, does Jurojin have to be on the map? (2) What about the gaining Coins part?
A: (1) No, the Player must simply own it. (2) Probably.

Oni of Skulls (Base Set) - '3 Force in any Province where you have the lowest Honor.'

Q: Does his power affect all the provinces where the owner has any power or just the province he is in?
Official CMON answer: Just the Province he is in.

Path of the Ninja (Horseman Set) - 'After you Summon, you may kill any 1 Bushi on the Map and lose Honor.'

Q: Can Path of the Ninja be used to trigger Mercy (Horseman Set) - When you would kill 1 or more of your opponents' figures, you may let them all live and gain VP VP.?
A: Yes, this would result in a net result of losing an Honor and gaining 2 VP.

Summer

Fire Dragon (Monster Pack) - 'Counts as 3 Force. At the start of this Battle, kill another local figure from each player (including you).'

Q: (1) When the Fire Dragon is the only figure the owner has in the province, does the Fire Dragon kill itself? (2) Does the owner of the Fire Dragon choose which figures are destroyed? (3) If the Fire Dragon is in the same Province as Jorogumo and both belong to the same Player, can the controlling Player choose to kill the Bushi or Shinto they have taken over to fulfill the '(including you)'-part of the Fire Dragon's ability?
A: (1) No, it says 'another'. (2) Yes, they can choose all except Daimyo figures. (3) Yes, in this case the controlling Player chooses the order in which conflicting abilities activate, so this is possible.

Sincerity (Mountain Set) - 'Gain Honor and an additional VP whenever you take a Hostage.'

Q: (1) Does the additional VP also subtracted from the owner of the figure you take hostage? (2) How does this card work in conjunction with Respect? (3) How does this card work in conjunction with Sunakake-Baba?
Official CMON answers: (1) No, Sincerity provides a bonus, not an extra stolen VP (2 & 3) This card triggers on any instance of taking hostages.

Sunakake-Baba (Daimyo Box) - 'At start of War. You may take hostage a Bushi or Shinto from this Province.'

Q: (1) Does the card refer to 'At start of the War Phase', or does it mean at start of her Battle? (2) Does taking a hostage trigger the same Victory Point swap as gaining the 'Take Hostage' battle advantage? [/i]? (3) How does this Monster work in conjunction with Sincerity (Mountain Set)?
A: (1) At the start of the War Phase. (2, Offical CMON answer) Yes, always steal 1 VP when you take a hostage. (3, official CMON answer) Sincerity triggers on any instance of taking hostages.

Yurei (Base set) - 'Counts as a Daimyo with 2 Force.'

Q: (1) Do Daimyo Upgrades apply to Yurei? (2) During Betray Mandate, can Yurei be replaced by a Monster?
A: (1) Yes (2) No, it cannot be targeted during a Betray Mandate, as a Daimyo figure cannot be affected by Betrayal.

Autumn

Daikaiju (Daimyo Box) - 'Counts as 5 Force. Summon this in the ocean. At the Start of the War Phase, place this in any Province and destroy all enemy Strongholds there.'

Q: Can Daikaiju destroy Turtle Fortresses?
A: Yes.

Oni of Plagues (Monster Pack) - 'Players with higher Honor than you cannot Move figures into this Province.'
Q: Does this Monster block Players from Summoning figures in this Province as well?
Official answer from CMON: No, it only prevents Moving figures into its Province.


Oni of Spite (Archway, Horseman, Mountain and Ship Set) - 'When this enters a province (for any reason), steal VP VP from each higher Honor player with any Force there.'

Q: When in an Alliance, playing Betray and replacing one of the Monsters on the board with the Oni of Spite from your reserve, do you lose Honor before or after placing the Oni of Spite?
A: Probably before, since the Betray rules first cover the breaking of the Alliance and losing Honor, before covering the replacing part of the Mandate.
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Oden Dee
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
Path of the Monkey (Horseman set) - 'After you Summon, you may take $ from the richest opponent(s) and lose Honor.'
Q: When two players are tied for richest opponent, and you choose to take a coin from both of them, do you lose Honor twice?
A: No, once. It would say each if was for each. Plural is for the rare situations where there is a tie in richest players.

Path of the Serpent (Base set) - 'You may charge other players $ in order to cross each different Shipping Route with their figures.'
Q: Charge per Shipping Route? Per Move? Per Season?
A: Per Shipping Route like it says.
 
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
Warlock00 wrote:
Path of the Serpent (Base set) - 'You may charge other players $ in order to cross each different Shipping Route with their figures.'
Q: Charge per Shipping Route? Per Move? Per Season?
A: Per Shipping Route like it says.


Just to be clear; does this mean the owner of Path of the Serpent can ask up to 6 Coins per player per game, since there are 6 Shipping Routes? And does it mean that once a Player has payed for a Shipping Route, they no longer have to pay or broker a deal about this Shipping Route for the rest of the game?
 
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
LordBartholomeus wrote:

Just to be clear; does this mean the owner of Path of the Serpent can ask up to 6 Coins per player per game, since there are 6 Shipping Routes? And does it mean that once a Player has payed for a Shipping Route, they no longer have to pay or broker a deal about this Shipping Route for the rest of the game?


The way I read it, it means you can charge them each time they use a shipping route per mandate/kami phase. So if they want to move two figures along one shipping route (same or opposite directions), you can charge them 1$. Two figures across two different routes, you can charge them 2$, etc. Each toll they pay only gives them access for that phase though.
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
Earth Dragon (Daimyo Box) - 'Counts as 3 Force. At start of Battle, you may Move 1 figure from each other player out of this province.'

Q: (1) How does this Monster work in conjunction with Path of the Serpent? When the Earth Dragon is, for example, in Provinces that only connect to other Provinces via Shipping Routes.
Q: (2) How does this Monster work in conjunction with the Oni of Plagues, does it block Moving figures to its Province? What if the Earth Dragon is in Nagato and the Oni of Plagues in Kansai?

A: (1) ?
A: (2) Oni of Plagues would block entry. No use of ability for the Nagato scenario. A Susanoo in Nagato could also block exit.

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Kenny Kang
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but what exactly are the different "sets"? Are they just combination suggestions of what to use in each season? And so then the conflicts that lead to some of the questions in this FAQ are results of getting more creative with combinations?
 
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
gk255 wrote:
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but what exactly are the different "sets"? Are they just combination suggestions of what to use in each season? And so then the conflicts that lead to some of the questions in this FAQ are results of getting more creative with combinations?


Each season you play with the 7 core cards and 5 cards from the set you are using. Each set is 15 cards (5 for each season). The Core game includes archway, horsemen and Teapot sets. Kami Unbound includes the Mountain set. Dynasty Invasion includes the Ship set.
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
FearLord wrote:
gk255 wrote:
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but what exactly are the different "sets"? Are they just combination suggestions of what to use in each season? And so then the conflicts that lead to some of the questions in this FAQ are results of getting more creative with combinations?


Each season you play with the 7 core cards and 5 cards from the set you are using. Each set is 15 cards (5 for each season). The Core game includes archway, horsemen and Teapot sets. Kami Unbound includes the Mountain set. Dynasty Invasion includes the Ship set.


Yes, Base Set cards are in each game, and then you add 5 cards per Season from either Archway, Horseman, Teapot, Mountain or Ship. You can then optionally add 2 additional monsters per Season from the Daimyo Box or Monster Pack.

The conflicts in the questions in this FAQ are all possible in a 'legit' game. By which I mean there are no questions about for example Spring Season Cards from the Teapot Set conflicting with Summer Season Cards from the Horseman Set.
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
LordBartholomeus wrote:
Warlock00 wrote:
Path of the Serpent (Base set) - 'You may charge other players $ in order to cross each different Shipping Route with their figures.'
Q: Charge per Shipping Route? Per Move? Per Season?
A: Per Shipping Route like it says.


Just to be clear; does this mean the owner of Path of the Serpent can ask up to 6 Coins per player per game, since there are 6 Shipping Routes? And does it mean that once a Player has payed for a Shipping Route, they no longer have to pay or broker a deal about this Shipping Route for the rest of the game?


It is my understanding that this card activates for the Marshall mandate (or an action that causes characters to move like the Raijin's Kami ability or Monster abilities) as one move activation, similar to grouping the Summon or Harvest abilities as one activation. It states 'for each shipping route', so each player would have to pay 1 coin to use that route for travel (any number of units back and forth) during the current activation. This can add up if multiple opponents use multiple routes, but I'm guessing the intent is to clamp on shipping route travel and get players to travel by land unless absolutely necessary to avoid giving the Path of the Serpent player a huge advantage. At least that's the way I understood it.

Nure-onna's ability specifically states that she uses shipping routes, so she'd have to pay 1 coin to the Path of the Serpent player (each time she activates her ability, not once per war season). This is hilarious because it's a serpent tax on a serpent, but there you go.

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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
LordBartholomeus wrote:


Earth Dragon (Daimyo Box) - 'Counts as 3 Force. At start of Battle, you may Move 1 figure from each other player out of this province.'

Q: (1) How does this Monster work in conjunction with Path of the Serpent? When the Earth Dragon is, for example, in Provinces that only connect to other Provinces via Shipping Routes. (2) How does this Monster work in conjunction with the Oni of Plagues, does it block Moving figures to its Province? What if the Earth Dragon is in Nagato and the Oni of Plagues in Kansai?
A: (1) ? (2) Oni of Plagues would block entry. No use of ability for the Nagato scenario. Susanoo (Kami Unbound) in Nagato could also block exit.


I don't know about 1 (It would be a mean way to tax players if they have to pay without choice on taking the route), but for 2&3 I think if two abilities conflict, the person with the highest Honor gets to choose which one takes precedence. Similar to how they get to choose activation order.
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Larry Bogucki
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
LordBartholomeus wrote:

Earth Dragon (Daimyo Box) - 'Counts as 3 Force. At start of Battle, you may Move 1 figure from each other player out of this province.'

Q: (1) How does this Monster work in conjunction with Path of the Serpent? When the Earth Dragon is, for example, in Provinces that only connect to other Provinces via Shipping Routes.


I would love to know how this works. Can a player essentially force someone to pay them a coin if they own both. This came up in our game tonight.
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
Jtwayne wrote:
LordBartholomeus wrote:


Earth Dragon (Daimyo Box) - 'Counts as 3 Force. At start of Battle, you may Move 1 figure from each other player out of this province.'

Q: (1) How does this Monster work in conjunction with Path of the Serpent? When the Earth Dragon is, for example, in Provinces that only connect to other Provinces via Shipping Routes. (2) How does this Monster work in conjunction with the Oni of Plagues, does it block Moving figures to its Province? What if the Earth Dragon is in Nagato and the Oni of Plagues in Kansai?
A: (1) ? (2) Oni of Plagues would block entry. No use of ability for the Nagato scenario. Susanoo (Kami Unbound) in Nagato could also block exit.


I don't know about 1 (It would be a mean way to tax players if they have to pay without choice on taking the route), but for 2&3 I think if two abilities conflict, the person with the highest Honor gets to choose which one takes precedence. Similar to how they get to choose activation order.


I think you are right about the 'meanness' of 1, and as of now I'd play that a player can't be forced to pay for the Shipping Route if it is forced by the Earth Dragon. Oni of Plagues is a passive ability, so I don't think activation order applies here, yet I would very much like an official answer on these combinations.
 
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
LordBartholomeus wrote:


Oni of Plagues is a passive ability, so I don't think activation order applies here, yet I would very much like an official answer on these combinations.


I was expanding upon the activation order being decided by highest honor by saying direct card conflicts also being decided by the highest honor. I haven't read that anywhere in the rules, but the activation order statement seems tangential to this idea and an easy thing to resolve at the table whenever it comes up.

Of course, official answer would be awesome too. I expect a FAQ to drop within a month after they get these all shipped out and the designers review the online conversation.

 
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
Question on setup... if you choose to randomize which set gets added per season (e.g. randomly selected teapot for spring, archway for summer, etc), do you keep it hidden until the season starts (limiting future planning) or just reveal and let everyone know ahead of time what cards will show up in the future. Or would this just be personal preference.

 
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
burgundy90 wrote:
Question on setup... if you choose to randomize which set gets added per season (e.g. randomly selected teapot for spring, archway for summer, etc), do you keep it hidden until the season starts (limiting future planning) or just reveal and let everyone know ahead of time what cards will show up in the future. Or would this just be personal preference.



You randomly select a set at the start of the game, then use the same set for the rest of the seasons.
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
burgundy90 wrote:
Question on setup... if you choose to randomize which set gets added per season (e.g. randomly selected teapot for spring, archway for summer, etc), do you keep it hidden until the season starts (limiting future planning) or just reveal and let everyone know ahead of time what cards will show up in the future. Or would this just be personal preference.



It would be personal preference
 
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Jack McNamee
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
When a card gives you 3 victory points "For each monster you have" - what does this mean? Do you "Have" a monster if you've bought it and it's in your reserves, or only if it's on the map? I would have thought the former, but there's a card which says "3VP for each stronghold you have" which must be the latter, right?
 
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
Fandango wrote:
When a card gives you 3 victory points "For each monster you have" - what does this mean? Do you "Have" a monster if you've bought it and it's in your reserves, or only if it's on the map? I would have thought the former, but there's a card which says "3VP for each stronghold you have" which must be the latter, right?


You only ‘have’ strongholds once you buy them and put them on the map. Monsters have been bought by you even if they aren’t currently on the map, so I would say you get 3vps for each monster card you’ve purchased.
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Re: Rising Sun Season Cards FAQ
There's some good Qs in the following thread that you might want to add to this FAQ
Nuances of the terms Place, Summon, and Recruit
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Re: Rising Sun Season cards FAQ
Warlock00 wrote:
There's some good Qs in the following thread that you might want to add to this FAQ
Nuances of the terms Place, Summon, and Recruit


Diddly done
 
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Re: Rising Sun Season cards FAQ
Cool.

Path of the Builder (Mountain Set) - 'When any player plays a Marshal Mandate, you may build a Stronghold (paying its cost).'
Q: When you or your ally play the Marshal Mandate, do you get to build two strongholds?
A: So it would seem. I doubt that is this card's intention. I would assume it's intended to allow you to build when a non-ally/not-you plays Marshal. A nice card to benefit a player not in an alliance.
A: No.
If you play Mandate then you already "may". A "may" on top of a "may" doesn't mean extra.
It could be extra if you are allowed to do it out of turn. But I believe you do it on your own turn.
Card wording is hard to decipher, answer could go either way. Just giving another interpretation. This is why this Q deserves to be in this FAQ.
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Re: Rising Sun Season cards FAQ
FearLord wrote:
You only ‘have’ strongholds once you buy them and put them on the map. Monsters have been bought by you even if they aren’t currently on the map, so I would say you get 3vps for each monster card you’ve purchased.


So the word "Have" is intended to have two different meanings on the two cards? Under this interpretation, the monster VP card far outranks the stronghold VP card for a few reasons:

1. Most monsters are cheaper than strongholds (3 coins for a stronghold, VS 0+ coins for monsters).

2. Monsters are easier to get. To get a stronghold, you need to make sure you or your ally play the Marshall mandate. You can get a monster no matter who played the Train mandate.

3. Strongholds can be destroyed by Daikaiju. If monsters in your reserve count, then they are guaranteed victory points that cannot be destroyed by any source in the game.

4. You are limited to a maximum of 4 strongholds. There is no limit to the number of monsters you can gain, and it's completely possible to have 6 or more.

I think the card may be intended to give you VP for the monsters you have kept alive and on the map through the last battle phase. I hope the designers didn't intend to give the word "Have" two different meanings - that would be sloppy.
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Re: Rising Sun Season cards (and thus Monsters) unofficial FAQ
Fandango wrote:
FearLord wrote:
You only ‘have’ strongholds once you buy them and put them on the map. Monsters have been bought by you even if they aren’t currently on the map, so I would say you get 3vps for each monster card you’ve purchased.


So the word "Have" is intended to have two different meanings on the two cards? Under this interpretation, the monster VP card far outranks the stronghold VP card for a few reasons:

1. Most monsters are cheaper than strongholds (3 coins for a stronghold, VS 0+ coins for monsters).

2. Monsters are easier to get. To get a stronghold, you need to make sure you or your ally play the Marshall mandate. You can get a monster no matter who played the Train mandate.

3. Strongholds can be destroyed by Daikaiju. If monsters in your reserve count, then they are guaranteed victory points that cannot be destroyed by any source in the game.

4. You are limited to a maximum of 4 strongholds. There is no limit to the number of monsters you can gain, and it's completely possible to have 6 or more.

I think the card may be intended to give you VP for the monsters you have kept alive and on the map through the last battle phase. I hope the designers didn't intend to give the word "Have" two different meanings - that would be sloppy.


Since the wording hasn't been clear on a number of cards so far, and it would thus be possible for 'have' to have two different meanings, the ambiguity of this specific card is driving me crazy. I added your interpretation to the FAQ and hope it gets an official answer.

Still, as of now, for the ability of Form of the Beast, I'd probably personally hang on to counting Monsters in reserve as well. Because, to follow up on your arguments:

1. This card comes with the retail version, which has 8 monsters whose base cost is not that much less than a Stronghold; 3 of them cost 2 coins and 5 of them cost 3 coins.

2. Maybe monsters are indeed easier to get, especially if you play with extra ones. Yet everyone can grab these, denying you getting them if you aren't quick enough/don't have the money. On top of that, if you are grabbing as much Monsters as you can just to get extra points via Form of the Beast, I think you are not playing the game properly.

3. Sure, Strongholds can be destroyed by Daikaiju, but this is a kickstarter exclusive monster, and even those in posession of it probably won't have it in most of their games. About the 'guaranteed victory points that cannot be destroyed'; there are lots of those situations. To name an example most similar to this situation: Form of the Phoenix (Base Set (!)) - End of the Game. Gain VP VP VP for each different Virtue that you have. These virtues are even easier to grab than the Monsters since they are cheaper and there are multiple copies. And they too can't be destroyed.

4. Yes, you are limited to a maximum of 4 stronghold, but the big difference with any Season cards is that there are always 4 Strongholds available to you, no matter what your opponents do or buy.
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Keith Pishnery
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Re: Rising Sun Season cards (and thus Monsters) unofficial FAQ
The way I think about this entire issue of "having" stuff is:

The cards reward you playing the game and accomplishing things. Like putting a stronghold on the board or acquiring a monster. They don't reward you for just ending the game with whatever you started with (strongholds in your reserve). It makes zero sense to give you victory points for stuff you just have next to you without doing anything with them.
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Re: Rising Sun Season cards (and thus Monsters) unofficial FAQ
Fandango wrote:
FearLord wrote:
You only ‘have’ strongholds once you buy them and put them on the map. Monsters have been bought by you even if they aren’t currently on the map, so I would say you get 3vps for each monster card you’ve purchased.


So the word "Have" is intended to have two different meanings on the two cards? Under this interpretation, the monster VP card far outranks the stronghold VP card for a few reasons:

1. Most monsters are cheaper than strongholds (3 coins for a stronghold, VS 0+ coins for monsters).

2. Monsters are easier to get. To get a stronghold, you need to make sure you or your ally play the Marshall mandate. You can get a monster no matter who played the Train mandate.

3. Strongholds can be destroyed by Daikaiju. If monsters in your reserve count, then they are guaranteed victory points that cannot be destroyed by any source in the game.

4. You are limited to a maximum of 4 strongholds. There is no limit to the number of monsters you can gain, and it's completely possible to have 6 or more.

I think the card may be intended to give you VP for the monsters you have kept alive and on the map through the last battle phase. I hope the designers didn't intend to give the word "Have" two different meanings - that would be sloppy.


At this point, I think it is realistic to expect sloppy rules from CMON. To say nothing of their research methods...Kotahi! (gesundheit)

I say this as a backer of Rising Sun and a fan of many of their games, but I fully expect this game to have at least a 5-6 page FAQ considering the number of rule breaking cards/special powers and the loose wording on those cards.

And a big thanks to the OP for putting this list together, I expect to encounter at least one of these questions during my first play so it will be nice to at least have something to point at when those questions come up.
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