Recommend
4 
 Thumb up
 Hide
62 Posts
1 , 2 , 3  Next »   | 

BoardGameGeek» Forums » Gaming Related » General Gaming

Subject: Inexplicably Bad Components rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: 'cause_we_don't_gripe_enough [+] [View All]
DB
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Component quality is always a hot topic around here. Unless they move to new publishers, there will always be complaints about the tiles and mats in Castles of Burgundy, the money in Power Grid, or pretty much everything in Vegas Showdown. But recently I came across a component that just plain baffled me w/r/t its crappiness.

Last week Miniature Market had their winter sale and I picked up a steeply discounted copy of Eminent Domain, which I've been interested in for awhile, with an expansion bundled. Inside the box I found some nice, thick chipboard for chits, player references, and the small central board. There were decent wooden tokens and a baggie of the generic plastic ships I recognize from Eclipse. Even the box is quite sturdy and well-made.

The cards looked nice enough...then I unwrapped them. Ye gods.

The last time I handled cards that badly made, I was playing a copy of Nile my sister picked up for $5. The stock is quite thin and the finish is somehow dry yet sticky, and a lot of the cards needed separating. And the cards -- which need to be sorted for play -- were jumbled in the pack.

Keep in mind this is a deckbuilder that even the instructions tell you takes several plays to get the hang of the game. The cards in that copy of Nile started to go bad on the third play, and by 8 or 9 plays both sides of the cards were starting to rub off. I've never been much of a sleever, but Eminent Domain is the first game I've ever thought absolutely requires sleeves.

If the rest of the presentation was as chintzy, if the chipboard had come thin and warped or the little spaceships were bent, it'd make more sense. But I'm having trouble wrapping my brain around publishing a card game where the cards are the worst component in the box. The only explanation I can think of is some kind of backroom payoff from Ultra-Pro.

So what other games have such poor crucial components, inexplicable in the context of each game's overall production and price point? How do you make sense of them?
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alex Norris
United States
Blacksburg
Virginia
flag msg tools
badge
If you manage to click exactly on my avatar's eye, you will win a special prize! Be careful though, as the penalty for missing it is severe.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Just to second this, after ~5-8 plays I had to email TMG and tell them about the bad card quality. Thankfully they send me a second set, that I ended up sleeping so they don’t disintegrate.

It’s nice to hear that someone else had the problem, and I wasn’t just being too picky.

Another game that comes to mind is sushi go party. These cards are thinner than sushi go, which aren’t great cards. These cards are even THINNER than eminent domain. I am honestly scared to play the game until I get sleeves.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
No One
United States
Burien
Washington
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
dpbush wrote:
Component quality is always a hot topic around here. Unless they move to new publishers, there will always be complaints about the tiles and mats in Castles of Burgundy, the money in Power Grid, or pretty much everything in Vegas Showdown. But recently I came across a component that just plain baffled me w/r/t its crappiness.

Last week Miniature Market had their winter sale and I picked up a steeply discounted copy of Eminent Domain, which I've been interested in for awhile, with an expansion bundled. Inside the box I found some nice, thick chipboard for chits, player references, and the small central board. There were decent wooden tokens and a baggie of the generic plastic ships I recognize from Eclipse. Even the box is quite sturdy and well-made.

The cards looked nice enough...then I unwrapped them. Ye gods.

The last time I handled cards that badly made, I was playing a copy of Nile my sister picked up for $5. The stock is so thin you can bend each card a good 30 degrees without creasing it. The finish is somehow dry yet sticky, and a lot of the cards needed separating. And the cards -- which need to be sorted for play -- were jumbled in the pack.

Keep in mind this is a deckbuilder that even the instructions tell you takes several plays to get the hang of the game. The cards in that copy of Nile started to go bad on the third play, and by 8 or 9 plays both sides of the cards were starting to rub off. I've never been much of a sleever, but Eminent Domain is the first game I've ever thought absolutely requires sleeves.

If the rest of the presentation was as chintzy, if the chipboard had come thin and warped or the little spaceships were bent, it'd make more sense. But I'm having trouble wrapping my brain around publishing a card game where the cards are the worst component in the box. The only explanation I can think of is some kind of backroom payoff from Ultra-Pro.

So what other games have such poor crucial components, inexplicable in the context of each game's overall production and price point? How do you make sense of them?


How about turning your disappointment in ED cards into a discussion about games with surprisingly good components? There's already been a fair amount of negative threads this week, it'd be nice to have some positive discussions for the end of the week.



~V
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Leo Zappa
United States
Aliquippa
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
dpbush wrote:
Component quality is always a hot topic around here. Unless they move to new publishers, there will always be complaints about the tiles and mats in Castles of Burgundy, the money in Power Grid, or pretty much everything in Vegas Showdown. But recently I came across a component that just plain baffled me w/r/t its crappiness.

Last week Miniature Market had their winter sale and I picked up a steeply discounted copy of Eminent Domain, which I've been interested in for awhile, with an expansion bundled. Inside the box I found some nice, thick chipboard for chits, player references, and the small central board. There were decent wooden tokens and a baggie of the generic plastic ships I recognize from Eclipse. Even the box is quite sturdy and well-made.

The cards looked nice enough...then I unwrapped them. Ye gods.

The last time I handled cards that badly made, I was playing a copy of Nile my sister picked up for $5. The stock is so thin you can bend each card a good 30 degrees without creasing it. The finish is somehow dry yet sticky, and a lot of the cards needed separating. And the cards -- which need to be sorted for play -- were jumbled in the pack.

Keep in mind this is a deckbuilder that even the instructions tell you takes several plays to get the hang of the game. The cards in that copy of Nile started to go bad on the third play, and by 8 or 9 plays both sides of the cards were starting to rub off. I've never been much of a sleever, but Eminent Domain is the first game I've ever thought absolutely requires sleeves.

If the rest of the presentation was as chintzy, if the chipboard had come thin and warped or the little spaceships were bent, it'd make more sense. But I'm having trouble wrapping my brain around publishing a card game where the cards are the worst component in the box. The only explanation I can think of is some kind of backroom payoff from Ultra-Pro.

So what other games have such poor crucial components, inexplicable in the context of each game's overall production and price point? How do you make sense of them?


Maybe it’s a pirated copy! Lots of talk of that subject of late. Would explain the cheap price and bad components.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
DB
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Veero wrote:
How about turning your disappointment in ED cards into a discussion about games with surprisingly good components? There's already been a fair amount of negative threads this week, it'd be nice to have some positive discussions for the end of the week.

Go ahead and start the thread, and I'll think on it.
8 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
No One
United States
Burien
Washington
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
desertfox2004 wrote:
Maybe it’s a pirated copy! Lots of talk of that subject of late. Would explain the cheap price and bad components.


MM buys from reputable distributors (and publishers), reputable distributors buy from publishers. I don't see where there's room for the pirated copies to infiltrate.

~V
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
DB
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
desertfox2004 wrote:
Maybe it’s a pirated copy! Lots of talk of that subject of late. Would explain the cheap price and bad components.

The print quality itself is clear on everything, the other stuff is too good to be pirated. I got a deal because this was a clearance sale directly from a reputable seller.

Now if I'd bought it Fulfilled by Amazon™ from TotallyLegitMerchandise69...
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
John Smith
msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I'll have to check my Eminent Domain copy. I don't recall it being awful, but I do sleeve all cards.

Very poor in my view was the Harry Potter: Hogwarts Battle expansion. Cardstock itself was good, but dozens of the three different sizes of cards were bent, warped, creased, across all four game boxes!

I have no idea why the cards were in this shape, I have never seen anything like it. A few other folks have reported creased cards.

The match up of the card backs was also an epic failure:



Edit: I dug out my copy of Eminent Domain. They definitely aren't as solid feeling as my Fleet cards (which I regard as good quality, as usual with Eagle Gryphon in my experience). I'm happy enough with them, I like that they have a glossy linen finish.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
C&H Schmidt
Germany
Heidelberg
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Alextnorris wrote:
Another game that comes to mind is sushi go party. These cards are thinner than sushi go, which aren’t great cards. These cards are even THINNER than eminent domain. I am honestly scared to play the game until I get sleeves.
Really?

I gifted Sushi Go Party to a friend and the cards still look like new after 10+ plays, unsleeved.
In spite of the shuffling, none of the backs have become noticeably marked.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bryan Thunkd
United States
Florence
MA
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Veero wrote:
How about turning your disappointment in ED cards into a discussion about games with surprisingly good components? There's already been a fair amount of negative threads this week, it'd be nice to have some positive discussions for the end of the week.
I'm generally not fond of the scenario where one person tries to silence someone with a legitimate complaint because those complaints are a downer and make you feel bad.

I'm sorry that hearing about bad things happening makes you feel bad, but the people who these bad things happen to also feel bad... You don't get to insist that they suffer in silence and not try to fix the issue just because you're uncomfortable with the reality that the world is a place where a lot of bad things happen.

Admittedly, complaining about the components in a board game isn't the biggest issue in the world, but I see the same type of thing happen with much bigger and more important issues, and the general principle is the same.

41 
 Thumb up
3.50
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sithrak - The god who hates you unconditionally
Germany
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've gone to sleeving almost all my games, because I'm very rarely happy with the quality of cards that most publishers choose.

Most cases when I see a KS announcing something like "replace cardboard markers with plastic pieces!" as a stretch goal, I internally sigh and think "Look guys, that's nice and all, but can we please upgrade the cards first?"

The thing is... Cards are pretty much always critical to games that include them, usually become useless when they're marked, can't be proxied or replaced without replacing the whole deck or getting another original, are often some of the most handled components and at the same time the least sturdy unless the finish is absolutely top notch...

I've been lucky so far, but the thought that one little accident can break a favorite OOP game is a constant annoyance.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pete
United States
Northbrook
Illinois
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Alextnorris wrote:
...that I ended up sleeping so they don’t disintegrate.


Pete (supposes that's one way to preserve your games)
22 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
No One
United States
Burien
Washington
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Thunkd wrote:
Veero wrote:
How about turning your disappointment in ED cards into a discussion about games with surprisingly good components? There's already been a fair amount of negative threads this week, it'd be nice to have some positive discussions for the end of the week.
I'm generally not fond of the scenario where one person tries to silence someone with a legitimate complaint because those complaints are a downer and make you feel bad.

I'm sorry that hearing about bad things happening makes you feel bad, but the people who these bad things happen to also feel bad... You don't get to insist that they suffer in silence and not try to fix the issue just because you're uncomfortable with the reality that the world is a place where a lot of bad things happen.

Admittedly, complaining about the components in a board game isn't the biggest issue in the world, but I see the same type of thing happen with much bigger and more important issues, and the general principle is the same.


Sorry you feel I was trying to silence the OP. Getting a game with bad components sucks, and I don't dispute that. The OP's thread isn't about their legitimate complaint about them getting a game with bad components, it's about inviting the forums to highlight (and ultimately dump on) other games with bad components. No silencing of the OP's legitimate complaint happened. I pointed to a lemonade recipe, so please retract your accusation.

~V
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pete
United States
Northbrook
Illinois
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I have Eminent Domain, The Castles of Burgundy, Vegas Showdown, and Power Grid. I've never found the components to limit gameplay.

Pete (does treat his games gently, though)
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Keith R
United States
Lewis Center
Ohio
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmb
Alextnorris wrote:
Just to second this, after ~5-8 plays I had to email TMG and tell them about the bad card quality. Thankfully they send me a second set, that I ended up sleeping so they don’t disintegrate.

It’s nice to hear that someone else had the problem, and I wasn’t just being too picky.

Another game that comes to mind is sushi go party. These cards are thinner than sushi go, which aren’t great cards. These cards are even THINNER than eminent domain. I am honestly scared to play the game until I get sleeves.


In regards to sushi go party - just out of curiosity, how old is your copy of the game? I thought I had read somewhere the initial print off the game the cards were pretty bad, but either later out in an updated printing the quality was improved. I am not swearing to this though.

Having said that, I bought Sushi go partu about a year ago, and the cards seem fine to me. I like sleeves for cards usually anyway, but I have not on my copy of this game and they have been fine. We are gentle to games but still there is a lot of shuffling in this game and no issues yet
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
DB
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Veero wrote:
The OP's thread isn't about their legitimate complaint about them getting a game with bad components, it's about inviting the forums to highlight (and ultimately dump on) other games with bad components.

To be clear, I'm not interested in bad components in general, but rather games with one or two key components that for whatever reason seem to be much lower quality than everything else in the box. I've certainly opened games that didn't impress me with their production, but opening that pack of cards was a level of dissonance in quality I'd never really seen in a game.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
BG.EXE
United States
flag msg tools
I favor Euros, but I like pretty much all games.
badge
Don't forget to have fun!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Veero wrote:
How about turning your disappointment in ED cards into a discussion about games with surprisingly good components? There's already been a fair amount of negative threads this week, it'd be nice to have some positive discussions for the end of the week.



~V

EVERY Vital Lacerda game.
Dude is the god of making amazing Euros with top end components. The cardboard must be like 3mm thick. It's fantastic.

In terms of bad components I've only had one notably negative experience - Patchwork. My copy came with ALL curved tiles that would not fit together. They replaced my tiles for me though, and the second set was great.

Funny enough, as mentioned, the first copy may have been a counterfeit. Or simply a manufacturing error; maybe the cutting die was worn out. Who knows.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jerry Martin
United States
Loveland
Colorado
flag msg tools
badge
1 Million Shogoths Killed and Counting.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I have Eminent Domain and have played it a good amount without significant wear I haven't noticed them to be overly bad.

Your comment on 30 degree bend and it doesn't crease confuses me. Are you expect it to crease? I find good quality cards to bend as much as you want without issue. Are you saying they are creasing?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bryan Thunkd
United States
Florence
MA
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Veero wrote:
Getting a game with bad components sucks, and I don't dispute that. The OP's thread isn't about their legitimate complaint about them getting a game with bad components, it's about inviting the forums to highlight (and ultimately dump on) other games with bad components. No silencing of the OP's legitimate complaint happened.
I see the bigger point of "Let's talk about games that have bad components" as a goal of spotlighting and shaming these games and thus to hopefully push publishers to stop making games with bad components.

When you say "Hey, let's just talk about games with good components" you're derailing the attempt to highlight that bad components are an issue in the industry. And by trying to squelch the discussion of bad components, you're preventing a discussion which might lead to change.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
DB
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Syvanis wrote:
Your comment on 30 degree bend and it doesn't crease confuses me. Are you expect it to crease? I find good quality cards to bend as much as you want without issue. Are you saying they are creasing?

It's a rough estimate...the point is that the cards weren't particularly sturdy and seemed to bend much more easily than those in other games. They handle a lot like the cards in Nile I mentioned, even the particular linen finish seems familiar.

It could well be that this copy is from a late production run where something changed in China and the card quality dropped, I'd have to see one of the KS or early retail copies to be sure.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pete
United States
Northbrook
Illinois
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thunkd wrote:
Veero wrote:
Getting a game with bad components sucks, and I don't dispute that. The OP's thread isn't about their legitimate complaint about them getting a game with bad components, it's about inviting the forums to highlight (and ultimately dump on) other games with bad components. No silencing of the OP's legitimate complaint happened.
I see the bigger point of "Let's talk about games that have bad components" as a goal of spotlighting and shaming these games and thus to hopefully push publishers to stop making games with bad components.
Except, of course, that there's a propensity for such threads to devolve into the familiar "Hey come here and bitch about that game you hate again" thread.

Pete (has seen that thread a thousand times)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bryan Thunkd
United States
Florence
MA
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
plezercruz wrote:
Pete (has seen that thread a thousand times)
Yeah, but how many threads on BGG haven't you seen a thousand times already. This topic is hardly unique that way.
10 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
No One
United States
Burien
Washington
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Thunkd wrote:
Veero wrote:
Getting a game with bad components sucks, and I don't dispute that. The OP's thread isn't about their legitimate complaint about them getting a game with bad components, it's about inviting the forums to highlight (and ultimately dump on) other games with bad components. No silencing of the OP's legitimate complaint happened.


I see the bigger point of "Let's talk about games that have bad components" as a goal of spotlighting and shaming these games and thus to hopefully push publishers to stop making games with bad components.


Your bigger point is not what you accused me of silencing, you accused me of silencing the OP's complaint about their ED components. That's what I have issue with here.

If you want to spend your time shaming people, please go ahead and do so without me. shake

Thunkd wrote:
When you say "Hey, let's just talk about games with good components" you're derailing the attempt to highlight that bad components are an issue in the industry. And by trying to squelch the discussion of bad components, you're preventing a discussion which might lead to change.


The larger subject is a-typical component quality, talking about the positives can elicit just as much change as talking about the negatives, nothing is being prevented. And, again, nothing is being silenced except your attempt to silence a suggestion of making lemonade. That doesn't negate the existence, qualities, or discussion of the lemons themselves.

Also, I never said, "let's just talk about games with good components." You're putting words in my mouth (so to speak). I don't appreciate that either... if you're going to quote me, then please quote me, and don't paraphrase me so you can make your point. By paraphrasing like that you make it seem as though I'm demanding a change in the discussion, which would be silencing... but I did not demand anything, and thus am not attempting to silence anything.

If you wish to discuss this further, then geekmail me. Because at this point we're both guilty of derailment by having this discussion here.

~V
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gregg Saruwatari
United States
Arroyo Grande
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
dpbush wrote:
Syvanis wrote:
Your comment on 30 degree bend and it doesn't crease confuses me. Are you expect it to crease? I find good quality cards to bend as much as you want without issue. Are you saying they are creasing?

It's a rough estimate...the point is that the cards weren't particularly sturdy and seemed to bend much more easily than those in other games. They handle a lot like the cards in Nile I mentioned, even the particular linen finish seems familiar.

It could well be that this copy is from a late production run where something changed in China and the card quality dropped, I'd have to see one of the KS or early retail copies to be sure.


The early runs had high quality linen finish cards and solid chipboard. Only the obvious-eclipse-reject ships bothered me. And it wasn't the quality; it was how different in size and shape they were- but were still only supposed to count as 1 ship no matter how big or small.

Unless more information comes out about later print runs, I am going to assume pirated copy as someone already mentioned.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dave Lartigue
United States
Springfield
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
this entire site is a practically non stop barrage of "ALL GAMES ARE GREAT AND GAME COMPANIES ARE GREAT AND BUYING GAMES IS GREAT" and I don't think a couple threads pointing out times where components fell short is going to hurt anyone
31 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2 , 3  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.