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Subject: [Poll] Best/worst minion (Obvious spoiler) rss

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Keena Grégoire
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Poll
It's sure that context (number of player, building available, etc.) have a big impact on the efficacity of minions, but in general, what is your opinion on best/worst minion?
1. What is the most efficient minion?
Golem
Robot
Ghost
Chef
Butler
Cat
2. What is the least efficient minion?
Golem
Robot
Ghost
Chef
Butler
Cat
      179 answers
Poll created by keena


It's sure that context (number of player, building available, etc.) have a big impact on the efficacity of minions, but in general, what is your opinion on best/worst minion?
 
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Travis Geery
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In relation to the bonus advancement cards? or with personas? too many variables to really comment without these factors because a minion is a minion otherwise.
For example I feel like the robot's advancement card granting more advancement cards with placement is ridiculously overpowered especially in early games. The ghost and chef got little to no usage in our games.
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James C
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Our first campaign my wife unlocked the robot fairly early and it made so many of the buildings useless. Why go to a building just for a Guest or a Friend when you can place a robot on a build to gain a resource and get any card you want from the face up advancement cards?

In our second campaign that didn't happen and I felt it was a much more enjoyable way to play.
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Jeff S
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I feel like Golem is most efficient, because you can always use an extra resource of any type. But we just unlocked Chef on game 7, and it is super valuable to be able to get influence tokens back -- I run out of them way too fast.

Ghost I only use once or twice a game, because with two players, reputation is not a big thing; it's not worth spending more than one or two tokens on for the whole game.
 
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Jeff Lozito
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We've found in our 6 or so plays that the Robot is a baller. The person who unlocked them would just spam guest cards when they came available and get a ton of stuff every income. And would supplement that with guests and item cards for other abilities and points.

The Golem is also really good as resources are pretty much useful just about everywhere. I don't think it's quite as powerful as getting a guest for free, but still really good.

The more I play, the more I like the Chef because getting influence tokens back can be really nice to not have to worry about taking better actions that cause you to spend them.

The Butler seems in theory to me better than in practice. While coins are harder to come by than, say, resources ... they seem less useful overall. And so I don't really find myself in need of coins quite as much.

Being able to get 1 pt for placing a Cat again seems good in theory (pts are after all how you win), but you only get a single point for it ... and it just feels nowhere near on par with some of the others.

Finally, we come to the Ghost ... I just not a fan of this one. In our world, there are already a bunch of ways of getting reputation. Beyond that, the track will often fill up quickly, so it becomes useless outside of an additional thing to place at a building.
 
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Darin Bolyard
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No surprise to see the robot leading the poll. Anyone whose played understands that this single minion, when placed or played upon by opponents, grants an action that takes no less than 2 actions to complete otherwise (acquire the needed resource + acquire the card). Furthermore, at least one persona's bonus is triggered upon gaining a particular type of advancement card (though only when you place it).

I only voted the butler last because we haven't yet had the opportunity to use it. It was force-unlocked after game 9. And we won't get to use any minions in game 10 yuk. I probably should have voted the ghost as worst since it becomes a terribly weak worker once the reputation track is filled. Unfortunately, ghosts are the key to triggering one of my persona's bonuses. Needless to say, I haven't yet used that persona. Not sure the points gained at the end of the campaign are worth forgoing the use of one of a few other far more lucrative personas in my chest.

I am very surprised to see the cat so low on the poll. It only gives you 1 point by itself, sure. But consider that each charter has a friend card which awards you an additional VP any time you gain VP in that charter. That makes placing the cat a minimum of +2 VP every time you place it, and still +1 whenever someone else plays on its building (the latter of which is admittedly rare). I nabbed that particular friend that matches my charter as soon as I could and it has paid off in spades. And thanks to cats, playing in my own charter is very lucrative, as long as there are actions in my charter that I want to take (which there always have been).
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Benj Davis
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I'm not at all surprised to see ghosts at the back. Giving up an influence is a costly thing, and I'm still feeling like every time I put one on the rep track, I was costing myself more points than it gave me.
 
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Greg S
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I unlocked the Chef first, so I had a permanent one early. In the next game the Robot and Ghost were unlocked. I quickly got a permanent robot, since they totally rock. I also filled up the minion glory row as my first row (and no one else even started theirs yet), so now I get to choose one of the two remaining non-permanent robots at the start of every game. Two robots and a chef totally triple rock!

A cat can be killer when you have a building that everyone wants to go on all the time, like
Spoiler (click to reveal)
the perfumery.
 
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Chad Ingram
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Robots are undoubtably the best, but I don't think its a no contest just the same. Most other minions are nearly as good and a couple are (a little) less situational. Unfortunately ghost us a clear worst. Even more unfortunate is the fact I'm running grey 😑
 
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Darren Nakamura
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Golem > Robot > Chef > Cat > Butler > Ghost
 
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shlomi ben-naim
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Jacksonville
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i am playing as the black player, i see in this group people are saying that the Ghost is not a useful minion, should i bother opening the create to unlock the ghost?

also what # crate is the ghost?
 
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Israel Waldrom
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shlomi wrote:
i am playing as the black player, i see in this group people are saying that the Ghost is not a useful minion, should i bother opening the create to unlock the ghost?

also what # crate is the ghost?


The ghost isn't a bad minion, just not the most useful/powerful of them.
If there are only a few minions out then it will be better than if all of them are out, but it will still have its uses. IMHO it is still worth getting them.

There is no foreknowledge of which crate houses any of the minions (unless you have played the game before) - discovery is part of the games fun.

Spoiler (click to reveal)
There is a pattern however, and each colour has 2 tech trees. Minions are down 1 path, while advancement cards etc are down the other. The buildings off the first crate can be split into two types, and one type leads down the minion path, while the other type leads the other way.
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shlomi ben-naim
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what is the power of the ghost?
we finished game 4 and i have no buildings in hand, all of my buildings are now part of the market (i think about 4 buildings) is it worth it for me to get my buildings back and build them and then open some more creates that belong to me?
 
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Israel Waldrom
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shlomi wrote:
what is the power of the ghost?
we finished game 4 and i have no buildings in hand, all of my buildings are now part of the market (i think about 4 buildings) is it worth it for me to get my buildings back and build them and then open some more creates that belong to me?


Spoiler (click to reveal)
The following knowledge will spoil some of the game for you.
Spoiler (click to reveal)
The Ghost allows you to place an influence token on the reputation track. As for the other path:
Spoiler (click to reveal)
Treasures are unlock in the other direction, and while some of the buildings associated with them are average, the cards themselves are really good.
Most of the top tier buildings in any tech branch are also really nice, and while they may not appear so at first glance there can often be more to them than you think.


As for should you get some of those cards back? It's entirely up to you. Buildings don't actually belong to a specific charter, they just happen to come from certain tech branches. Discovery is a fun part of this game. Explore, experiment, and enjoy the journey.

And if you think another minion is awesome, nab one for yourself once the building gets built, or you fill up the minion glory bonus.

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Chad Ingram
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I would say Robot > Golem > (maybe equal) Baker > Butler = Cat > > > Ghost.
Ghost is a lot farther behind the rest than robot is ahead of them but its not useless. I have kept mine from game to game. It makes getting reputation seamless. Its not as potent as the others but its certainly still useful.
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Benj Davis
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I think it really speaks to the broader issue: Reputation just isn't good enough.
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John Bertolini
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I agree that Ghost is the worst and also that much of the reason for that is because Reputation is also not good.

I hold out a small sliver of hope that it might end up being balanced (since I haven't completed all 12 games of the scenario yet) but currently, I believe it's a glaring weakness in the design of the game.

Love the game otherwise, of course, just bummed that there seems to exist both a dominant and a deficient strategy to winning.
 
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shlomi ben-naim
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A lot of you are saying that the Ghost is the weakest minion because of the reward of placing your token on the reputation track.
so are you saying that focusing on the reputation track is not a good focus strategy? should I bother going to places that lets you put a marker on the reputation track or should I focus more on buying buildings, opening crates, getting minions, friends, etc.
 
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Corsaire
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The value of the reputation track probably swings based on player counter. I've only played three player.

With three players, assuming everyone is on the track, then there is a net 6 points swing available. Each influence beyond the first has diminishing returns. If two people battle for lead, the third player wins by having better opportunities with their influence elsewhere. It also can accelerate the game depressing everyone's overall points.
 
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Darin Bolyard
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There's nothing at all wrong with the reputation track. The problem is that the ghost becomes impotent once the reputation track is full, or even once you gain a clear indisputable majority on the track. It's the only minion that becomes so. And it has happened in every game of ours since the ghost was unlocked. Until that does happen, it is definitely useful as a means of gaining reputation.
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Eric Hogue
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dbolyard wrote:
There's nothing at all wrong with the reputation track. The problem is that the ghost becomes impotent once the reputation track is full, or even once you gain a clear indisputable majority on the track. It's the only minion that becomes so. And it has happened in every game of ours since the ghost was unlocked. Until that does happen, it is definitely useful as a means of gaining reputation.


The chef has more limited utility at the start of a game, and the robot is weaker (although not useless) toward the end of a game. The cat seems to be good throughout the game.
 
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Corsaire
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Early game robots can grab guests. In three player, those guest generate a bunch of resources. Robot end game grabs items to cash out the excess resources.
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Benj Davis
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dbolyard wrote:
There's nothing at all wrong with the reputation track. The problem is that the ghost becomes impotent once the reputation track is full, or even once you gain a clear indisputable majority on the track. It's the only minion that becomes so. And it has happened in every game of ours since the ghost was unlocked. Until that does happen, it is definitely useful as a means of gaining reputation.


No, the problem is with Reputation, because these issues are just as true for every other effect that lets you put influence on it.
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Darin Bolyard
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Jlerpy wrote:
dbolyard wrote:
There's nothing at all wrong with the reputation track. The problem is that the ghost becomes impotent once the reputation track is full, or even once you gain a clear indisputable majority on the track. It's the only minion that becomes so. And it has happened in every game of ours since the ghost was unlocked. Until that does happen, it is definitely useful as a means of gaining reputation.


No, the problem is with Reputation, because these issues are just as true for every other effect that lets you put influence on it.

For me the issue lies primarily with the ghost, as I am playing the gray charter. When I finally unlocked ghosts, all other minions had been unlocked except for the butler. And I saw other players get a free golem, chef, robot, and cat, which are all good, every game, from start to finish. Moreover, we all have personas which benefit from playing heavy with the particular minion which goes with our charter. It's easy to put resources into acquiring two golems, two robots, two cats. Those investments will pay off every time. Moreover, you'll continually reap the reward of pulling them off the board with the matching personas. My "gain 2 VP when you retrieve 2 ghosts from the board" persona remains unplayed inside my charter chest. It's all but worthless in comparison to my other personas, since I've got at least 3 other personas which will each easily haul in 3-4 times as much VP in a single game, leading me toward more glory at the end of the game. And so far doing this has proven the better play, as the glory gained doing so has outweighed the end-of-campaign point bonus I'd gain from using that one persona. Every time I've considered pulling that persona out, I've had to weigh whether I want to waste precious turns and resources just to mark that persona. I'll be lucky to get those two points before the reputation track fills up anyway, rendering those 2 ghosts all but worthless afterward in any case. I can say with confidence that pulling other personas from my charter chest instead has guaranteed at least 1 more glory star than I would have otherwise received.
 
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Chad Ingram
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dbolyard wrote:
For me the issue lies primarily with the ghost, as I am playing the gray charter... My "gain 2 VP when you retrieve 2 ghosts from the board" persona remains unplayed inside my charter chest.


Same. It's a good indication that the Ghost is weakest. There has been more than one game (Ghosts were the first minion unlocked in our Campaign) where I was thankful the ability said "you may", even when I wasn't winning on the reputation track (bloody Automas ) and had influence tokens left. I can't imagine anyone ever wanting to choose no for any other minion... "an extra VP you say Kitty Cat? No thanks - not this time."
 
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