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Subject: Trading with Lu Fan rss

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Charles Tabony
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When taking the "trade rice" action after recruiting Lu Fan, if you have 3 gold (or rice+gold=3 since the distinction no longer matters), can you trade 3 gold for 4 rice, then activate Lu Fan's ability and exchange 3 of the rice received for gold, and then repeat until you have increased your gold+rice by a total of 3?

Obviously if you have a total of at least 9 gold+rice, then you can trade rice for gold until you have at least 9 gold, and then trade 9 gold for 12 rice, and then trade any rice back to gold that you want. Basically, taking the "trade rice" action after recruiting Lu Fan allows you to increase your gold+rice by a total of 3. But do you need at least 3 gold+rice before taking the action to accomplish that, or at least 9?

I'm surprised I didn't see this question asked already.
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Jean-Yves Moyen
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The rules (at the description of the action, p12) say:
Quote:
Each trade may not exceed 12 rice tokens.

This seems to imply that your are not making up to 3 separate trades, but a single trade. And thus, Lu Fan cannot triggers between each trades, since there's only one trade.
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Keng Leong Yeo
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Logitude wrote:
When taking the "trade rice" action after recruiting Lu Fan, if you have 3 gold (or rice+gold=3 since the distinction no longer matters), can you trade 3 gold for 4 rice, then activate Lu Fan's ability and exchange 3 of the rice received for gold, and then repeat until you have increased your gold+rice by a total of 3?

Obviously if you have a total of at least 9 gold+rice, then you can trade rice for gold until you have at least 9 gold, and then trade 9 gold for 12 rice, and then trade any rice back to gold that you want. Basically, taking the "trade rice" action after recruiting Lu Fan allows you to increase your gold+rice by a total of 3. But do you need at least 3 gold+rice before taking the action to accomplish that, or at least 9?

I'm surprised I didn't see this question asked already.

Your example contains three trades between gold and rice. When a player takes the trade rice and/or weapons action, only one trade between gold and rice is allowed.

In other words, to be able to increase the gold and rice total by 3, the Wu player must have 9 gold/rice on hand, before using Lu Fan to convert them into 9 gold, then carrying one trade to convert the 9 gold into 12 rice.

The relevant rules is on the bottom right of page 12 of the rule book, under 3) Take Actions, Trade Rice and/or Weapons:

Trade rice: Trade gold tokens for rice tokens, or vice versa, but not both ways, at the following rates:

o Buy every 4 rice tokens for 3 gold tokens.
o Sell every 4 rice tokens for 5 gold tokens.

Each trade may not exceed 12 rice tokens.
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Hugues Richard
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I think the choice of words and layout in the rulebook with "Player can carry out one or both of the following actions" and "at the following rates" is crystal clear but the iconography on the board and the words "at any time" on Lu Fan may induce confusion. Just looking at it, one could think that you can do this action multiple times instead of being a multiplier of quantities for a single action. I remember the difficulty during beta to show a relevant iconography for this action space that wouldn't cover the art completely, fit the space and still be understood as intended. With 0 gold/rice, 6 weapons and 4 stationed armies, thank God Cheng Yu isn't net gaining 20 gold/rice.
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