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Subject: 3rd Edition? rss

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J Lo
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Anyone know of any rumors or the chances of FFG making a third edition? I know there's Arkham Horror: LCG, but these are different games. I suppose in a way, Eldritch Horror was the successor and could be considered the new version, but the eighth expansion is about to be released. If EH follows in AH's footsteps, it could be the last expansion, but it's hard to know for sure.
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Joe Pilkus
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Rumors have come and gone on this one, but there's absolutely nothing definitive about a 3rd edition. THis title has become an evergreen game for FF and they'll continue to pump out this game...not necessarily in large numbers, but certainly to accommodate the new players coming into our hobby every year.

Cheers,
Joe
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Bryce K. Nielsen
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Most people consider EH to be version 3 of AH, and I like to think Mansions of Madness: Second Edition as the newest version of AH

-shnar
 
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shnar wrote:
Most people consider EH to be version 3 of AH, and I like to think Mansions of Madness: Second Edition as the newest version of AH

-shnar


I'm not one of those people. Any player I personally know who's able to compare them (and the AH card game) wouldn't consider it that way, either.
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MC Crispy
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shnar wrote:
Most people consider EH to be version 3 of AH, and I like to think Mansions of Madness: Second Edition as the newest version of AH

-shnar
I guess that if you assert that "most people" believe something to be so, then it must be so and not merely your opinion.
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Yep, I just discovered AH last year and I’m still buying the expansions and other added bits. It’s a real hit in my home. We are still playing it every three weeks or so with variations on the expansions.

I just wish they’d re print all the figures!
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Bryce K. Nielsen
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Popularculture wrote:
I just wish they’d re print all the figures!

Consider getting Mansions of Madness then. All the figures are usable in all of FFG's Cthulu games, and MoM is a great game, so double win.

As for EH being the third edition, ask that same question over on the EH forums and you'll see "most people" do indeed feel that way. But my comment wasn't meant to say that EH *is* 3rd Ed, but rather since EH is out, FFG has no reason to create a 3rd Ed of AH. Just keep working on EH (and I personally prefer AH to EH, like the more personal feel of tromping through a town).

-shnar
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MC Crispy
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shnar wrote:
As for EH being the third edition, ask that same question over on the EH forums and you'll see "most people" do indeed feel that way. But my comment wasn't meant to say that EH *is* 3rd Ed, but rather since EH is out, FFG has no reason to create a 3rd Ed of AH. Just keep working on EH (and I personally prefer AH to EH, like the more personal feel of tromping through a town).
I don't think that "most people on the EH forums", is the equivalent of "most people".
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A bit of a maybe irrelevant observation, but the fact that the upcoming "Eldritch Horror" expansion includes the last 7 investigators (revealed so far), which in itself is a weird number compared to how they have released them so far, seems to hint that maybe this is the last one.

Assuming that this is so, I'm wondering if, from FFG's standpoint, the more profitable way to proceed, going forward, would be to concentrate their efforts on the card game (and Mansions, and Elder Sign) while keeping AH and EH in print?

Just thinking out loud.
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MC Crispy
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They have a model: stop development, but keep the game in print while it's profitable to do so, then produce a new game in the family, or a v.next of the game, to rekindle interest. They did this with TI, AH, Fury of Dracula, and I'm sure there were/are others. So the question is, are they "done with" EH (seems like) and if they are, is the next iteration on the Arhkham Horror Files going to be EH v2, a hybrid AH/EH as a "new game", AH v3, or something else entirely? The model of AH v3 as demonstrated with TI4 has some appeal (to me), but that was a special case and not necessarily something called for by the market.
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Eric P
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SO I'm sure this has been discussed *many* times before, if they went the TI4 route and decided to create a new edition, absorbing some expansion ideas in the base game and revising other stuff - what changes would you want to see?

My preferences:
1) Injury and Madness cards as the standard
2) Epic Battle Cards included with the base game
3) A little more variance in the base Ancient Ones - the ones that have special mechanics like rubble tokens and the Dust deck feel *VERY* different rather than just a few modifiers changing.
4) Minis for the investigators, plastic bases for monster tokens and gates. Mainly so I could have the distinction of "plastic pieces are us, standing cardboard bits are what we have to defeat, tokens are things we collect."
5) This is the controversial one - make encounter and Mythos cards an app (and sell the physical ones as an option on their site, like the extra Scythe Automa decks.) This would make the "choose and roll before seeing the result" variant official, automate monster movement and gate placement, and *greatly* reduce the table footprint.

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MC Shudde M'ell
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Eric the GM wrote:
5) This is the controversial one - make encounter and Mythos cards an app (and sell the physical ones as an option on their site, like the extra Scythe Automa decks.) This would make the "choose and roll before seeing the result" variant official, automate monster movement and gate placement, and *greatly* reduce the table footprint.


I recognize that lots of people like MoM2, and I can appreciate how much better this would be for many people and how much potential it has, but this would be a deal breaker for me. I love computers and smartphones and video games in their place, but devices do not come to my table, and I am disinclined to visit any table where players are staring at a screen while playing.
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Eric the GM wrote:
This is the controversial one - make encounter and Mythos cards an app (and sell the physical ones as an option on their site, like the extra Scythe Automa decks.)
This would be a deal-breaker for me. While it's great for the solo crowd, I don't play solo. If there was a new "Arkham Companion" available on multiple platforms as an optional additional purchase (or free) that's cool, but if the cards were an additional cost, I'd be out. Not everyone has a suitable device for this sort of thing.
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This would make the "choose and roll before seeing the result" variant official, automate monster movement and gate placement, and *greatly* reduce the table footprint.
Nope, hate this Variant. Reading the consequences before rolling is closer to one's real world experience (I can weigh the likelihood of being able to jump the ravine vs. my chances at fighting a wolf [zero in both cases, but you get my point]) plus it's part of the tactical decision space of the game. I don't think that I would enjoy being forced to blind guess the outcome (putting myself at the mercy of the designers being reasonable and properly signalling risks - something that I think would be hard for them to get right). I really like EH's "Complex Encounter" system, with the way that it allows the player to characterise the narrative of the encounter, that would be a better option IMO (not practical for all AH encounters as it massively increases the content that has to be created).
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Bryce K. Nielsen
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Esgaldil wrote:
Eric the GM wrote:
5) This is the controversial one - make encounter and Mythos cards an app (and sell the physical ones as an option on their site, like the extra Scythe Automa decks.) This would make the "choose and roll before seeing the result" variant official, automate monster movement and gate placement, and *greatly* reduce the table footprint.


I recognize that lots of people like MoM2, and I can appreciate how much better this would be for many people and how much potential it has, but this would be a deal breaker for me. I love computers and smartphones and video games in their place, but devices do not come to my table, and I am disinclined to visit any table where players are staring at a screen while playing.

I honestly used to feel the same way, but I have to say, don't knock it until you've tried it. MoM2 is one of the best mixes of board+computer out there, and frankly AH would play a lot better with a computer assistant. At the very least, set and teardown time would shrink to minutes.

-shnar
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MC Shudde M'ell
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shnar wrote:
Esgaldil wrote:
Eric the GM wrote:
5) This is the controversial one - make encounter and Mythos cards an app (and sell the physical ones as an option on their site, like the extra Scythe Automa decks.) This would make the "choose and roll before seeing the result" variant official, automate monster movement and gate placement, and *greatly* reduce the table footprint.


I recognize that lots of people like MoM2, and I can appreciate how much better this would be for many people and how much potential it has, but this would be a deal breaker for me. I love computers and smartphones and video games in their place, but devices do not come to my table, and I am disinclined to visit any table where players are staring at a screen while playing.

I honestly used to feel the same way, but I have to say, don't knock it until you've tried it. MoM2 is one of the best mixes of board+computer out there, and frankly AH would play a lot better with a computer assistant. At the very least, set and teardown time would shrink to minutes.

-shnar


Fair. It may just be that I've had too many terrible experiences (at tables where I'm not in charge) with people bringing laptops and phones to play D&D.
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shnar wrote:

I honestly used to feel the same way, but I have to say, don't knock it until you've tried it. MoM2 is one of the best mixes of board+computer out there, and frankly AH would play a lot better with a computer assistant. At the very least, set and teardown time would shrink to minutes.

-shnar


I'm okay with using apps for games. It feels like the easiest way to tame some beasts *cough* Gloomhaven *cough*

I don't like the approach of making it mandatory, though.

Quote:
It may just be that I've had too many terrible experiences (at tables where I'm not in charge) with people bringing laptops and phones to play D&D.


Oh, I hear you. We've banned the devices from our game groups in most cases. Only our Secret Agent / Superhero group has them expressly allowed, since our players are usually simultaneously documenting, cross-referencing and updating their wiki to keep track of all the conspiracies and theories.
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Bryce K. Nielsen
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Esgaldil wrote:
shnar wrote:
Esgaldil wrote:
Eric the GM wrote:
5) This is the controversial one - make encounter and Mythos cards an app (and sell the physical ones as an option on their site, like the extra Scythe Automa decks.) This would make the "choose and roll before seeing the result" variant official, automate monster movement and gate placement, and *greatly* reduce the table footprint.


I recognize that lots of people like MoM2, and I can appreciate how much better this would be for many people and how much potential it has, but this would be a deal breaker for me. I love computers and smartphones and video games in their place, but devices do not come to my table, and I am disinclined to visit any table where players are staring at a screen while playing.

I honestly used to feel the same way, but I have to say, don't knock it until you've tried it. MoM2 is one of the best mixes of board+computer out there, and frankly AH would play a lot better with a computer assistant. At the very least, set and teardown time would shrink to minutes.

-shnar


Fair. It may just be that I've had too many terrible experiences (at tables where I'm not in charge) with people bringing laptops and phones to play D&D.

Oh I hear you there! People stop role playing and just watch youtube or facebook. Super annoying. But I've not gotten that yet from FFG's "assisted" games. I think that's because there's just one machine and the game takes the full screen, so there are no "distractions". Descent, Imperial Assault, MoM2, all three of these games played very smoothly.

-shnar
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The other part of it, I think, is that I genuinely enjoyed adding numbers up by hand when I was in school and don't do much of it these days - my partner does the taxes and balances the checkbook, my job is behind a wheel, not at a desk, so I am more eager than most people to do basic accounting and bookkeeping as a leisure time activity, and I don't want a machine to take that away.
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Eric P
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I wouldn’t want the app to do the math, although it could track monster movement a la MOM2. I want it more to handle your encounters.

“While searching the graveyard you find a strange epitaph - do you attempt to decipher it? (Lore).

<yes> Attempt a lore -2 check.
<success> The epitaph is a strange cipher depicting celestial positions which you recognize in tonight’s sky. Gain 2 clues.
<failure> You spend a restless night scribbling possible translations, but discover nothing of value. You are delayed.

<no> You ignore the epitaph. The strange symbols are probably just decorative. Nothing happens.

EDIT to clarify: the app would hide the exact difficulty of the check until you click your choice, and you would choose success or fail after a manual dice roll.
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Eric the GM wrote:
SO I'm sure this has been discussed *many* times before, if they went the TI4 route and decided to create a new edition, absorbing some expansion ideas in the base game and revising other stuff - what changes would you want to see?

My preferences:
1) Injury and Madness cards as the standard
2) Epic Battle Cards included with the base game
3) A little more variance in the base Ancient Ones - the ones that have special mechanics like rubble tokens and the Dust deck feel *VERY* different rather than just a few modifiers changing.
4) Minis for the investigators, plastic bases for monster tokens and gates. Mainly so I could have the distinction of "plastic pieces are us, standing cardboard bits are what we have to defeat, tokens are things we collect."
5) This is the controversial one - make encounter and Mythos cards an app (and sell the physical ones as an option on their site, like the extra Scythe Automa decks.) This would make the "choose and roll before seeing the result" variant official, automate monster movement and gate placement, and *greatly* reduce the table footprint.


I like your list, amd would definitely agree on 1-3. Stuff I would like to see:

1 Consolidated and streamlined rules (incorporating FAQs), possibly using iconography similar to Elditch for things like investigators, gate trophies, monster trophies
2 New game boards, possibly with ways to track things like the monster limit, gate limit, outskirts limits embedded. Possibly add the iconography similar to Eldritch for things like monster trophy and gate trophy spends.
3 Keep all the cards, but possibly streamline text. Add in a way for a decision that must be made prior to making skill checks (something people houserule now).
4 Take a look at the best houserules out there and consider adding them to the base game or as modular/optional rules if they are very popular.
5 Two sided spell cards, but with different effects than Eldritch
6 Alternate victory conditions for each AO. Gate close and seals are always still viable, but add a unique way to defeat the AO that perhaps involves performing unique requirements
7 Look at ways to better balance the game based on number of investigators.
8 This one is a bit controversial, but finding a way to link an Arkham Horror Game to an Eldritch Horror campaign -- we'll see how Masks plays out, but it would be interesting to have Arkham County linked if players choose.
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Wolfpack48 wrote:

6 Alternate victory conditions for each AO. Gate close and seals are always still viable, but add a unique way to defeat the AO that perhaps involves performing unique requirements


Ohhhh, I love that idea! Time to work up a new house variant.
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Esgaldil wrote:
The other part of it, I think, is that I genuinely enjoyed adding numbers up by hand when I was in school and don't do much of it these days - my partner does the taxes and balances the checkbook, my job is behind a wheel, not at a desk, so I am more eager than most people to do basic accounting and bookkeeping as a leisure time activity, and I don't want a machine to take that away.

It's less the math and more the deck management. For example, if there was an app assisting AH, the Mythos Deck, all the Location Decks, the Other World deck would go away. That's like half of the game setup time right there

-shnar
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MC Shudde M'ell
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shnar wrote:
Esgaldil wrote:
The other part of it, I think, is that I genuinely enjoyed adding numbers up by hand when I was in school and don't do much of it these days - my partner does the taxes and balances the checkbook, my job is behind a wheel, not at a desk, so I am more eager than most people to do basic accounting and bookkeeping as a leisure time activity, and I don't want a machine to take that away.

It's less the math and more the deck management. For example, if there was an app assisting AH, the Mythos Deck, all the Location Decks, the Other World deck would go away. That's like half of the game setup time right there

-shnar


I also like shuffling cards and setting up the decks and arranging them around the table. Arkham Horror wants to be curated, like a stamp collection or a model train set, and that means it doesn't come out every week, but when it does all the little details are part of the appeal for me.
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J Lo
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Esgaldil wrote:

I also like shuffling cards and setting up the decks and arranging them around the table. Arkham Horror wants to be curated, like a stamp collection or a model train set, and that means it doesn't come out every week, but when it does all the little details are part of the appeal for me.


I can appreciate this as well. However, I don't mind having means such as an app or perhaps a new edition of AH that condenses some of these aspects, as it would help me get my wife to play. Of course, I will do most of the heavy lifting anyway, but since she's not much of a gamer, I'm all for things that help simplify any aspects of play.
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Esgaldil wrote:
shnar wrote:
Esgaldil wrote:
The other part of it, I think, is that I genuinely enjoyed adding numbers up by hand when I was in school and don't do much of it these days - my partner does the taxes and balances the checkbook, my job is behind a wheel, not at a desk, so I am more eager than most people to do basic accounting and bookkeeping as a leisure time activity, and I don't want a machine to take that away.

It's less the math and more the deck management. For example, if there was an app assisting AH, the Mythos Deck, all the Location Decks, the Other World deck would go away. That's like half of the game setup time right there

-shnar


I also like shuffling cards and setting up the decks and arranging them around the table. Arkham Horror wants to be curated, like a stamp collection or a model train set, and that means it doesn't come out every week, but when it does all the little details are part of the appeal for me.
now that I can very much get behind! I very much enjoy spending an hour or so prepping for an upcoming game/scenario or sorting out after a game. I make myself a coffee, line up my podcast playlist and grab myself some chill.
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