Professor of Pain
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St. Joseph
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Invalid tweet.
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Leo Zappa
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Spot on.
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Daniel Kearns
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Bloomington
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Silence is golden.
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Your sea is so great and my boat is so small.
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That person is devastatingly reasonable.
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Professor of Pain
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St. Joseph
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Nice to see someone acknowledge and use his privilege.
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Lola Granola
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He said it's getting harder to enjoy the day.
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Wendell
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Yellow Springs
Ohio
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Si non potes reperire Berolini in tabula, ludens essetis non WIF.
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Hey, get your stinking cursor off my face! I got nukes, you know.
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He's a curmudgeonly guy in a good way.
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Serious? Lee
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Dale Hansen is a local DFW sportscaster who has impressed me with his commentaries on social issues such as this. He was even profiled in the NY Times last year for the popularity of his opinions. See https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/04/sports/football/dale-hans...
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Ruiner of Things
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Wichita
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Well, once again we find that clowning and anarchy don't mix.
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He unfortunately repeats the false statistic of 18 school shootings. But otherwise it's a good commentary.
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Moshe Callen
Israel
Jerusalem
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ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ/ πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν./...
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μῆνιν ἄειδε θεὰ Πηληϊάδεω Ἀχιλῆος/ οὐλομένην, ἣ μυρί᾽ Ἀχαιοῖς ἄλγε᾽ ἔθηκε,/...
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mistermarino wrote:
He unfortunately repeats the false statistic of 18 school shootings. But otherwise it's a good commentary.

It's only false if you redefine things to make it false.
 
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Andre
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https://www.snopes.com/2018/02/16/how-many-school-shootings-...

We cannot even agree on the definition of "school shooting", and the organization that came out with the 18 shootings stat defines it fairly broadly, but I tend to agree with their definition, anytime a weapon is discharged on school grounds, it can be traumatic for students. Although they are being broad in their definition of "school shooting", they are at least being honest about what they are calling a "school shooting".

I don't think injury count should have anything to do, with the fact that a gun was indeed fired, on school grounds.

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Ruiner of Things
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Well, once again we find that clowning and anarchy don't mix.
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whac3 wrote:
mistermarino wrote:
He unfortunately repeats the false statistic of 18 school shootings. But otherwise it's a good commentary.

It's only false if you redefine things to make it false.


No, it's false because almost all of the school shootings included in the original list of 18 aren't anything like what happened in Parkland and had no potential to be. They are more akin to normal criminal activity, stupidity or accidents.

They shouldn't happen. But they are entirely different sorts of things that require different analysis and solutions.

A third-grader grabbing the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it, is not a "school shooting" in any meaningful way. Neither is a kid killing himself in the bathroom. Or a guy getting shot off-campus after a fight that started in an after-school basketball game.
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Moshe Callen
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Jerusalem
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ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ/ πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν./...
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μῆνιν ἄειδε θεὰ Πηληϊάδεω Ἀχιλῆος/ οὐλομένην, ἣ μυρί᾽ Ἀχαιοῖς ἄλγε᾽ ἔθηκε,/...
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mistermarino wrote:
whac3 wrote:
mistermarino wrote:
He unfortunately repeats the false statistic of 18 school shootings. But otherwise it's a good commentary.

It's only false if you redefine things to make it false.


No, it's false because almost all of the school shootings included in the original list of 18 aren't anything like what happened in Parkland and had no potential to be. They are more akin to normal criminal activity, stupidity or accidents.

They shouldn't happen. But they are entirely different sorts of things that require different analysis and solutions.

A third-grader grabbing the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it, is not a "school shooting" in any meaningful way. Neither is a kid killing himself in the bathroom. Or a guy getting shot off-campus after a fight that started in an after-school basketball game.

No, they're not mass shooting sure but they are people firing a gun on school grounds.
 
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David Dearlove
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Isleworth
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mistermarino wrote:


A third-grader grabbing the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it, is not a "school shooting" in any meaningful way. Neither is a kid killing himself in the bathroom. Or a guy getting shot off-campus after a fight that started in an after-school basketball game.

Any country in which you can talk about these events as if they are so unimportant that they are insignificant is fucked up.
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Ben Foy
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mistermarino wrote:
He unfortunately repeats the false statistic of 18 school shootings. But otherwise it's a good commentary.


How about over 18 people killed with guns on school property. Better?
 
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Andre
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After looking at this video again, and again, I have determined that this guy is so on point, in everything he states.

 
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Ruiner of Things
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Wichita
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DavidDearlove wrote:
mistermarino wrote:


A third-grader grabbing the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it, is not a "school shooting" in any meaningful way. Neither is a kid killing himself in the bathroom. Or a guy getting shot off-campus after a fight that started in an after-school basketball game.

Any country in which you can talk about these events as if they are so unimportant that they are insignificant is fucked up.


That would be fucked up. But of course I didn't say that.

You are bickering over words I didn't use in order to disagree with something I didn't say. What I did say here and elsewhere in RSP very clearly and which I am going to say again very clearly is that the list contains many incidents which are wildly dissimilar and require different types of prevention.

The solution to "disturbed teen arms himself to the teeth and massacres former fellow students" is not the same solution to "third-grader touches the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it" is not the same solution to "depressed kid kills himself in the bathroom with a gun" is not the same solution to "a fight over a basketball game later results in someone getting shot outside the school" is not the same solution to "kid pulls the trigger of a training weapon believing it is not loaded" is not the same solution to "kid brings a gun to school to show it around and it accidentally goes off."

An advocacy group created that list in the wake of a grisly, traumatic, mass shooting at a school and disingenuously made the claim of 18 school shootings in six weeks. They hijacked the emotion and anger of the moment to create the false impression that our schools are a nightmarish, gun-besotted Hellscape where kids are served up as sacrificial lambs on a near daily basis. When, in fact, our schools are one of the safest places our kids can be and safer, even, than their homes.

In any other discussion about any other topic, people here would rush to find nuance, warn against proposing similar solutions to dissimilar problems and point out any comparison of apples to oranges. That's what I am attempting to do, and in return you are making things up about my argument.

Many of the things on that list are not meaningfully "school shootings" in the context of this discussion and the national discussion going on in the wake of the Parkland massacre. Not because they are not meaningful or because they didn't happen in schools or because they weren't shootings, but because they're not really the same sort of things that the national attention is focused on right now.

I don't fucking care if you apologize for flat-out stating that I think some deaths or injuries of children are insignificant or unimportant. But I deserve one.
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Agent J
United States
Coldwater
Michigan
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He's looking real sharp in his 1940's fedora. He's got nerves of steel, an iron will, and several other metal-themed attributes. His fur is water tight and he's always up for a fight.
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He's a semi-aquatic egg-laying mammal of action. He's a furry little flat-foot who'll never flinch from a fray. He's got more than just mad skills, he's got a beaver tail and a bill.
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Can you link Youtube?
 
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Born To Lose, Live To Win
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"Captain, although your abilities intrigue me, you are quite honestly inferior"
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LolaGranola wrote:
He said it's getting harder to enjoy the day.
That's what she said.
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William Boykin
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Texas
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For BJ.....
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DavidDearlove wrote:
mistermarino wrote:


A third-grader grabbing the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it, is not a "school shooting" in any meaningful way. Neither is a kid killing himself in the bathroom. Or a guy getting shot off-campus after a fight that started in an after-school basketball game.

Any country in which you can talk about these events as if they are so unimportant that they are insignificant is fucked up.


You're mistaking despair with apathy; cynicism with a lack of empathy.

I think all Americans care and want to do something such that Parklanbd, Sandy Hook or Columbine never happen again. But there is a lack of consensus on what that should entail, mixed with some huge politically entrenched special interests out to weaponize any comment in the culture on this topic. Cynicism, perhaps, is the only truly rational response- there are no easy fixes here.

Darilian
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David Dearlove
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Isleworth
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mistermarino wrote:
DavidDearlove wrote:
mistermarino wrote:


A third-grader grabbing the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it, is not a "school shooting" in any meaningful way. Neither is a kid killing himself in the bathroom. Or a guy getting shot off-campus after a fight that started in an after-school basketball game.

Any country in which you can talk about these events as if they are so unimportant that they are insignificant is fucked up.


That would be fucked up. But of course I didn't say that.

You are bickering over words I didn't use in order to disagree with something I didn't say. What I did say here and elsewhere in RSP very clearly and which I am going to say again very clearly is that the list contains many incidents which are wildly dissimilar and require different types of prevention.

The solution to "disturbed teen arms himself to the teeth and massacres former fellow students" is not the same solution to "third-grader touches the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it" is not the same solution to "depressed kid kills himself in the bathroom with a gun" is not the same solution to "a fight over a basketball game later results in someone getting shot outside the school" is not the same solution to "kid pulls the trigger of a training weapon believing it is not loaded" is not the same solution to "kid brings a gun to school to show it around and it accidentally goes off."

An advocacy group created that list in the wake of a grisly, traumatic, mass shooting at a school and disingenuously made the claim of 18 school shootings in six weeks. They hijacked the emotion and anger of the moment to create the false impression that our schools are a nightmarish, gun-besotted Hellscape where kids are served up as sacrificial lambs on a near daily basis. When, in fact, our schools are one of the safest places our kids can be and safer, even, than their homes.

In any other discussion about any other topic, people here would rush to find nuance, warn against proposing similar solutions to dissimilar problems and point out any comparison of apples to oranges. That's what I am attempting to do, and in return you are making things up about my argument.

Many of the things on that list are not meaningfully "school shootings" in the context of this discussion and the national discussion going on in the wake of the Parkland massacre. Not because they are not meaningful or because they didn't happen in schools or because they weren't shootings, but because they're not really the same sort of things that the national attention is focused on right now.

I don't fucking care if you apologize for flat-out stating that I think some deaths or injuries of children are insignificant or unimportant. But I deserve one.

I apologise if I gave you offence. "You" in this case in British English is plural and replaced "one" which is now too posh.
However your post (which I did not quote in full"
Describes these events are "They are more akin to normal criminal activity, stupidity or accidents."
This is the point. All these events would be so extreme in the UK that they would make the national news.
Everyone knows school kids are stupid, so we keep them away from guns as much as is possible. A kid killing themselves in a school with a gun would probably lead on the news. The fact that this is a lesser category that you can announce are nor school shootings because you have a more extreme category of school massacres makes my point.
Obviously you are against them I never said you weren't, but you seemed almost dismissive. "normalcriminal activity? WTF.
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Heather K
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I can't understand people who love their guns more than I love my children. soblue
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Born To Lose, Live To Win
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darnheather wrote:
I can't understand people who love their guns more than I love my children. soblue
They don't even need that level of love, they just need to love their guns more than they love your children.
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Eric Tama
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mistermarino wrote:

The solution to "disturbed teen arms himself to the teeth and massacres former fellow students" is not the same solution to "third-grader touches the trigger of an officer's gun, accidentally firing it" is not the same solution to "depressed kid kills himself in the bathroom with a gun" is not the same solution to "a fight over a basketball game later results in someone getting shot outside the school" is not the same solution to "kid pulls the trigger of a training weapon believing it is not loaded" is not the same solution to "kid brings a gun to school to show it around and it accidentally goes off."


The solution to all of those is no guns.
 
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