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Subject: On the fence rss

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Gridash
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Like many of you, I started out playing HeroQuest when I was a small boy. I think this game comes the closest to reliving that experience again.

I'm really on the fence with getting more expansions for this game. I currently have the base game and the Warlord of Galahir (because I love orcs!). I'm currently in the process of painting everything and haven't actually played the game yet, but I have seen online videos of its actual gameplay.

I noticed however that there is also a lot of negativity towards this game, I guess most of it is because of the Adventurer's Companion expansion.

I'm wondering about the following things:
- What is the balance of the game in the prewritten quests of the expansions? Are there any expansions to avoid for being notoriously broken?
- The AC offers rules for using different characters in the prewritten campaigns. Is that part of the AC also broken? I would like to give the heroes more options in terms of hero selection. I assume you can't just take a hero from an expansion and insert it into a different prewritten campaign without breaking something.
- Does the AC offer any rules of random looting in the prewritten campaigns? Instead of having to use the prewritten loot found in every chest? I assume I can't just make up a big pile of item cards from all the expansions and draw randomly when the quest guide states to give a specific item card, hehe...
- Does the AC offer any rules to carry over items from 1 quest to the other? Perhaps with a limit?
- Can the various items from expansions be combined in a common item deck? Perhaps through the AC? I know in Descent it was nice to expand on the options with every new expansion coming out.

If it's really "eeehhhh" I'll just stick to the prewritten quests without the AC, but it would be a shame. I have no interest in the Uncharted Dungeons or Invisible Overlord from the AC.

Thank you so much in advance!
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john doe
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Gridash wrote:
Like many of you, I started out playing HeroQuest when I was a small boy. I think this game comes the closest to reliving that experience again.

I'm really on the fence with getting more expansions for this game. I currently have the base game and the Warlord of Galahir (because I love orcs!). I'm currently in the process of painting everything and haven't actually played the game yet, but I have seen online videos of its actual gameplay.

I noticed however that there is also a lot of negativity towards this game, I guess most of it is because of the Adventurer's Companion expansion.

I'm wondering about the following things:
- What is the balance of the game in the prewritten quests of the expansions? Are there any expansions to avoid for being notoriously broken?
- The AC offers rules for using different characters in the prewritten campaigns. Is that part of the AC also broken? I would like to give the heroes more options in terms of hero selection. I assume you can't just take a hero from an expansion and insert it into a different prewritten campaign without breaking something.
- Does the AC offer any rules of random looting in the prewritten campaigns? Instead of having to use the prewritten loot found in every chest? I assume I can't just make up a big pile of item cards from all the expansions and draw randomly when the quest guide states to give a specific item card, hehe...
- Does the AC offer any rules to carry over items from 1 quest to the other? Perhaps with a limit?
- Can the various items from expansions be combined in a common item deck? Perhaps through the AC? I know in Descent it was nice to expand on the options with every new expansion coming out.

If it's really "eeehhhh" I'll just stick to the prewritten quests without the AC, but it would be a shame. I have no interest in the Uncharted Dungeons or Invisible Overlord from the AC.

Thank you so much in advance!


The pre-written quests are all pretty good to be honest. Green Rage and Black Fortress are a little short but alright for the price and the Dungeon Journal is filled with mistakes that Mantic don't seem to care about fixing. The newest expansion has loads that were all good, but you need the Infernal Crypts to use it. So if demons are your thing, pick those 2 up.

The AC as a whole is more of a light RPG. You can use made heroes in pre-written adventure,s but doesn't really tell you much how to use them. Some race/class options are totally broken.

It doesn't offer rules for looting in pre-written games.

The AC's focus is on writing your own stories, were you can gain items and armour and carry them over. But again, you need a GM to write everything up and test it before hand. It doesn't really give you a structre on how to design your own. Just "come up with an idea, and test it"

You can add items from other expansions into your own made campaigns, so items you get in Warlord of Galahir can be used in your won.

It all depends if you have a player who's prepared to write up a story and a set of adventures. Sadly, Mantic have made no attempt to FAQ or Errata anything.

The pre-written expansions are all worth a buy, even the digital download ones.

My only issue is it seems like a dead range. Mantic make no effort to do anything with it, so I doubt you'll see any more products any time soon. That being said, there's still a lot of pre-made stuff out there if you want to invest in it.
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Gridash
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Thanks for the reply, I don't think I'll be getting the AC then.

I might experiment with just putting the heroes together in a big hero pool for hero players to choose from (as long as there is 1 wizard). In terms of items, where an item is given in the campaign, I'll let hero players just randomly draw an item card from all the combined items of the expansions (there might be exceptions), which will carry over in the next quest. If they didn't loot the quest item, just randomly draw one for the next quest.

I feel like as long as the amount of items carrying over is the same, it -should- be alright.

I know it might upset balance a bit, but as long as it isn't extremely unbalancing, it should be alright. I rather have something more random (and replayable) than fixed and not so replayable.

Any objections to this variant, do you think it would greatly upset the gameplay?
 
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Gridash
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I don't know anything about the power level of certain items. If the rule of thumb is that found items in the predetermined quests become more powerful, following the progression of the campaign, tiers of items can be made. Then it is only matter of determining which expansion items belong to which tiers and create a loot deck that way that consists of a subset of all the possible items found.

As an additional idea, perhaps killing monsters will give a random amount of gold (1d6?). What gold allows inbetween quests is determining how many shops items are available where you can exchange an item for another (still sticking to the item limit that you would normally have in the predetermined quest). That way you can still cycle the item deck if you end up with something silly. That or give the option to exchange with the item that you would have normally started the next quest with.

Again this last block might be unnecessary, I'm just thinking out loud here.
 
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Michael
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I think the adventurers companion is a fine, and even great, expansion to get.

It's primary issues are that it is not what the kick starter claimed it would be. Some of the material is the companion are sort of guidelines for making characters in running campaigns and these are looser and less thorough that would be ideal.

Where I see this expansion Big really great is it the invisible overlord rules, and the uncharted Dungeons rules and options. Please let the heroes play against an artificial intelligence overlord, and they really work well enough to have a lot of fun, there are ambiguities, but the system does work and I enjoy playing against it. This expansion has the primary invisible overlord deck, but each other expansion as expansion specific invisible overlord cards that are compatible for interpolating that expansion in with the invisible overlord rules.

The same is true for the uncharted dungeon, navigating a randomly generated dungeon. This too does have some ambiguity is in terms of how it works in detail, but again there's still enough here to really play with it and have a lot of fun. It would just like the invisible overlord rules each expansion includes uncharted dungeon cards that work along with the uncharted dungeon rules and components in the adventurers companion.

For what the adventurers companion gives you, I can understand that you're dollars may be better spent elsewhere. For me the adventures companion opens up a lot that I enjoy and I am happy to have to augment my dungeon saga experience. I do in fact feel like this expansion more or less completes the game.
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Gridash
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Good to hear. Perhaps when a little bit of balancing on the AC, it could still be usable.

Also, in the meantime I took a closer look at the questbook of the base game, and noticed to rather uneven distribution of items (Most items come at the last quests). I guess my initial idea might not be the best after all. whistle
 
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gary gee
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to me,this is one of the best and most underrated dungeon crawlers in recent year!..yes it isn't perfect [show me one that is?].but its got a great set of game mechanics that are very easy to get into.and each expansion is very themeatic.
the AC does have some problems but is still a must buy as it has rules for solo play etc.and gives many ideas for your own adventures!.
theres lots of stuff out there for it.and the forum is still very lively.which says a lot about the game.my group still love the game...and heres one example: we got Sword and Sorcery on Kickstater.waited for it to come.all of us were super hyped up for it.but when it finally arrived after a couple of plays which we all found just too fiddly for a DC.one of the guys said "lets get DS out".and we had yet another great night.
if interested I would say go for it.you cant go wrong
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Kevin Riddle

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a fun game IMO
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Gridash
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Just got the Return of Valandor. Looks promising!

More undead to paint. cool

This game is the closest to HeroQuest so far for me.
 
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Gridash
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This was also very handy:
https://twilight40k.blogspot.be/2015/11/dungeon-saga-adventu...

It gave me onsight on the custom heroes, loot, leveling and the problems associated with it. You people have been following this for a longer time, so probably are already familiar with all this.
 
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Gridash
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In the meantime, I'm sold on the AC. I can just use the standard prewritten characters described there (are they different from the normal campaign heroes? Currently at work) and offer those to my players. I assume those will be balanced.

In terms of leveling, I'll stick to the levels of a certain prewritten campaign. In terms of treasure, I'll have to come up with a houserule or preselect the treasure found, since the base game treasure seems to be specifically tailored for the heroes.

This seems to be the most elegant/versatile and fulfills almost all my wishes.
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Andrew DiGregorio
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ive played up thru scenario 5 in the base game, and ive found all of them to be close and down to the wire, except i think for scenario 2, which might have been due to my bad playing as the overlord over anything else.

That said, i have all the expansions, and intend to keep playing thru them.
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