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Subject: Coop or Solo Mode? rss

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Heath Hillstead
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After doing board game Kickstarters for a year, the number one question I have seen asked repeatedly is "Solo mode?" I then dismiss them because I only play with my friends (Played solo with Eldritch Horror to learn the rules and hated it). But Solo rules usually work best with coop rules (you just take over the other players turns).

So knowing that the question is going to come up do you think it will be a possibility?

P.S. I tried playing Descent 2nd Ed with the Overlord rules and hated it, that was after playing through all the coop expansions, now the app has made me fall in love with the game all over again.
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Dave J
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Rockey2010 wrote:
After doing board game Kickstarters for a year, the number one question I have seen asked repeatedly is "Solo mode?" I then dismiss them because I only play with my friends (Played solo with Eldritch Horror to learn the rules and hated it). But Solo rules usually work best with coop rules (you just take over the other players turns).

So knowing that the question is going to come up do you think it will be a possibility?

P.S. I tried playing Descent 2nd Ed with the Overlord rules and hated it, that was after playing through all the coop expansions, now the app has made me fall in love with the game all over again.


They have said not at this time. However they did leave open a slight possibility that sometime in the future they may look into it.

I'm primarily a solo player but I'm going in on this. Going to test out some of the Solo Systems out there. Worst case, just play both sides. It seems like it would still be a blast with this game.

EDIT: Personally, in theory, 1 vs Many games feel a slight bit easier figure out a homebrew system for automating one side. Even if you automate the Hero side.
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Rick S
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I very rarely play games solo. When I do it’s to learn the rules before presenting the game to others.

Batman is supposed to use the same game engine as Conan.
I have played 20+ games of Conan as the overlord.
90% or the time I am choosing to activate the tile in the #1 slot.

In my opinion, Conan wouldn’t be too bad to play both sides.
“River” tile placement, scenario rules, and setup will take care of most of your decisions.
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Clinton Rice
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Nic

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Doug Herring as some really good videos on youtube of him playing both sides of Conan.
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Heath Hillstead
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Thanks for the ideas, I was looking for someone to convince me on this one and you guys got me a little closer!
 
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John Breckenridge
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An easy way to automate the behavior of the bad guys would be to get a two-headed coin and scratch up one of the sides, and then flip it whenever you need to make a decision.
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David Molina
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This game is begging for a solo/coop mode. Batman being such a "lone wolf" of sorts. He does have Robin, but I think he's had more adventure without one of them at at the end of the day. Its surely not unusual to see "The Bat" alone. I guess though I'm actually happy this doesn't have a solo mode. Saves me a LOT of money, possibly my life if my wife were to find out I backed! lol
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KingJackalope wrote:
This game is begging for a solo/coop mode. Batman being such a "lone wolf" of sorts. He does have Robin, but I think he's had more adventure without one of them at at the end of the day. Its surely not unusual to see "The Bat" alone. I guess though I'm actually happy this doesn't have a solo mode. Saves me a LOT of money, possibly my life if my wife were to find out I backed! lol


I (partially) understand why they don’t do a solo mode but it’s kind of a bad commercial move these days.
The solo board gamers FB Group I’m subscribed to has more than 12000 members and they are quite sensitive to the hype.
When a game is worth it and has a solo mode, they tend to massively buy/back it.
I think that ignoring this miche is a mistake nowadays.
I get that creating an official solo mode is not an easy task but, in this case, the engine exists for quite a long time already and even though it has to be adapted to the DC universe, adding the solo feature is not a weird request.
Anyway, it’s a discussion we already had before and it didn’t end well eventually (some stating that solo boargamers weren’t even legitimate as board games have to be social, that kind of dogmatic nonsense...)
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Donn Hardy
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While I personally have never been interested in solo board gaming (I prefer to do my solo gaming in video games), I have no objection to others who want to do so. What tends to baffle me is when people come in demanding a solo mode in a board game that just doesn't support it in any way (haven't played Batman, so I don't know if this is or isn't the case here). A lot of time, they're demanding that an entirely distinct separate game be made using the existing components.

In this case, it does seem like the easiest route is just to solo the hero side and have the bad guys always pay the cheapest cost. My personal opinion is this: if you see a game that was specifically designed to be competitive between 2 or more players, but you really like the concept of the game and want to be able to play it solo, you need to be willing to do some or all of the work to make it happen.

I've backed two games recently where they created a solo version of the game. One created extra AI characters and the other created an entirely new game that used the same mechanics. I have no idea if either were any good though, because both games were horrendously delayed in order to add the design and play-testing of the solo modes.
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Your example is just an example.
I know games with solo modes that are very close to the standard mode and which haven't been delayed.
With that kind of argument, you can pretty much dismiss anything.

There are no facts there.
I mean, you take for granted that:

1) doing a solo mode might imply that it would be a different experience.
Well, not if you do it right.

2) doing a solo mode might imply delays.
Well, not if you do it right.

3) your example is meaningful.
Well, there are many counter-examples too.


And there is no "demand" here. That's a rhetorical bias.
It's just a talk about coop/solo mode.
That's one thread among many others (in fact, it's 2 threads among 116 others).
So, I think we are fine.

Respectfully.
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Olli Juhala
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baylock wrote:
Your example is just an example.
I know games with solo modes that are very close to the standard mode and which haven't been delayed.
With that kind of argument, you can pretty much dismiss anything.

There are no facts there.
I mean, you take for granted that:

1) doing a solo mode might imply that it would be a different experience.
Well, not if you do it right.

2) doing a solo mode might imply delays.
Well, not if you do it right.

3) your example is meaningful.
Well, there are many counter-examples too.


And there is no "demand" here. That's a rhetorical bias.
It's just a talk about coop/solo mode.
That's one thread among many others (in fact, it's 2 threads among 116 others).
So, I think we are fine.

Respectfully.


I assume at this point the delay would be starting from scratch - Monolith doesn't seem to have much experience with solo, they have stated that they've spent lot of resources on the Adventure mode scenarios, and they are pretty likely to have committed to producing the exact number of components - Any SG's are most definitely pre-planned and accounted for on Day 0.

And since this is also dealing with Warner IP, it's possible any deviance at this point would require lengthy approval process and thus delays.

So while solo/co-op is probably possible in any wave 2 kickstarter, right now I think Monolith ought to stick with their plan.
 
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I never said they should start now.
Yes, it's a bit late for that.
I consider, as it is an engine that exists for quite a long time now, that it could have been considered from the very beginning of the Batman project.
That's all.

Anyway, this seams to be one of those issues we can debate about for days with no significant outcome.
The people who were hoping for a solo mode are very disappointed.
Those who weren't are not.
That's not a surprise.
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Donn Hardy
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baylock wrote:
Your example is just an example.
I know games with solo modes that are very close to the standard mode and which haven't been delayed.
With that kind of argument, you can pretty much dismiss anything.

There are no facts there.
I mean, you take for granted that:

1) doing a solo mode might imply that it would be a different experience.
Well, not if you do it right.

2) doing a solo mode might imply delays.
Well, not if you do it right.

3) your example is meaningful.
Well, there are many counter-examples too.


And there is no "demand" here. That's a rhetorical bias.
It's just a talk about coop/solo mode.
That's one thread among many others (in fact, it's 2 threads among 116 others).
So, I think we are fine.

Respectfully.

Sorry. I thought we were just talking about coop/solo mode.

I wasn't trying to provide facts that prove that coop/solo mode is a bad thing, since I don't think it is. I was just providing some examples of when it can go bad due to not being planned out well. You are absolutely right that it can be done well. I would argue, however, that doing it right is not a negligible amount of work. Which is why it can lead to delays when not planned for in the beginning. As is usually the case when people come in and ask for solo mode in games that don't already have one. Very rarely do I see backers asking for solo modes in games that already have them.

As for "demand", I was simply talking about coop/solo modes in general and not specifically this thread for this game. Perhaps demand was too strong of a word. I meant 'request'.

At any rate, I didn't mean to ruffle anyone's feathers. I probably should have been more tactful. I admit that is a failing of mine.
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Roger Bartels
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KingJackalope wrote:
This game is begging for a solo/coop mode. Batman being such a "lone wolf" of sorts. He does have Robin, but I think he's had more adventure without one of them at at the end of the day. Its surely not unusual to see "The Bat" alone. I guess though I'm actually happy this doesn't have a solo mode. Saves me a LOT of money, possibly my life if my wife were to find out I backed! lol


I'm with you...lack of a solo mode just saved me a lot of money here.
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donnbobhardy wrote:
baylock wrote:
Your example is just an example.
I know games with solo modes that are very close to the standard mode and which haven't been delayed.
With that kind of argument, you can pretty much dismiss anything.

There are no facts there.
I mean, you take for granted that:

1) doing a solo mode might imply that it would be a different experience.
Well, not if you do it right.

2) doing a solo mode might imply delays.
Well, not if you do it right.

3) your example is meaningful.
Well, there are many counter-examples too.


And there is no "demand" here. That's a rhetorical bias.
It's just a talk about coop/solo mode.
That's one thread among many others (in fact, it's 2 threads among 116 others).
So, I think we are fine.

Respectfully.

Sorry. I thought we were just talking about coop/solo mode.

I wasn't trying to provide facts that prove that coop/solo mode is a bad thing, since I don't think it is. I was just providing some examples of when it can go bad due to not being planned out well. You are absolutely right that it can be done well. I would argue, however, that doing it right is not a negligible amount of work. Which is why it can lead to delays when not planned for in the beginning. As is usually the case when people come in and ask for solo mode in games that don't already have one. Very rarely do I see backers asking for solo modes in games that already have them.

As for "demand", I was simply talking about coop/solo modes in general and not specifically this thread for this game. Perhaps demand was too strong of a word. I meant 'request'.

At any rate, I didn't mean to ruffle anyone's feathers. I probably should have been more tactful. I admit that is a failing of mine.


No problem :-)
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Anthony T
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Lemonpips wrote:
KingJackalope wrote:
This game is begging for a solo/coop mode. Batman being such a "lone wolf" of sorts. He does have Robin, but I think he's had more adventure without one of them at at the end of the day. Its surely not unusual to see "The Bat" alone. I guess though I'm actually happy this doesn't have a solo mode. Saves me a LOT of money, possibly my life if my wife were to find out I backed! lol


I'm with you...lack of a solo mode just saved me a lot of money here.


+1 to this. No solo mode just saved me a ton of cash. I won't back without solo support. I can't just rely on a possible future promise that they would add it eventually. I can't justify dropping $300+ on a game where I would rarely get to play it with a group so I then have to invent my own way to play solo. Too many other games to back and play that have exactly what I want but good luck to the campaign! It will do just fine because well.....Batman.
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The Redheaded Pharmacist
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I have to admit the first thing I checked when I found the Kickstarter campaign was if there was any indication of a solo mode. It’s a big factor in my personal interest in a particular game.

Having said that I’ve never backed a project to demand the addition of a solo mode. I can remember a couple of times sending a private message to creators asking about the possibility of a solo mode for a project that didn’t already mention any solitaire mode.

I must say creators have been very receptive to the request even when they couldn’t accommodate it. Sometimes a solo mode just doesn’t work for a game.

Sometimes a game relies on competitive or social interactions that just don’t translate well to solo play. Sometimes it just isn’t a priority for a game developer who has a thousand other things on their minds.

As much as I’d like to be upset about a big game like this that doesn’t have some grand solo mode I just can’t. There’s too many fantastic solo capable games to keep me busy.
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Phil Richard
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I did send the creators of Conan an E-mail asking about the possibility of solo play rules. The answer I got was discouraging. I would go all in if there was even just a scenario or two for solo. I play Conan by myself sometimes, but I will pass on Batman without any solo/coop modes. Truth is I am disappointed, I am ready to spend the money, I just cannot justify the purchase when I won't get it to the table with others.
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David Molina
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I ended up backing at all in. Simply to keep up with what’s going on. I’m not going to keep my pledge and figured all in was as good as $1. It really looks cool. If it would have had a solo mode I’d probably be selling a kidney or something reasonable like that. I agree 100%, it’s waaaay to late to be thinking solo play at this stage. IF they had any thoughts of it they’d be better off thinking expansion later on. While solo has become a huge market, thanks to their IP’s they don’t need it to move games.
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Olli Juhala
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vectordream wrote:
Lemonpips wrote:
KingJackalope wrote:
This game is begging for a solo/coop mode. Batman being such a "lone wolf" of sorts. He does have Robin, but I think he's had more adventure without one of them at at the end of the day. Its surely not unusual to see "The Bat" alone. I guess though I'm actually happy this doesn't have a solo mode. Saves me a LOT of money, possibly my life if my wife were to find out I backed! lol


I'm with you...lack of a solo mode just saved me a lot of money here.


+1 to this. No solo mode just saved me a ton of cash. I won't back without solo support. I can't just rely on a possible future promise that they would add it eventually. I can't justify dropping $300+ on a game where I would rarely get to play it with a group so I then have to invent my own way to play solo. Too many other games to back and play that have exactly what I want but good luck to the campaign! It will do just fine because well.....Batman.


The game will be back on Kickstarter in a year anyway or so anyway, so you can get everything then if they manage to develop a solo mode by then.
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Shader10 wrote:
vectordream wrote:
Lemonpips wrote:
KingJackalope wrote:
This game is begging for a solo/coop mode. Batman being such a "lone wolf" of sorts. He does have Robin, but I think he's had more adventure without one of them at at the end of the day. Its surely not unusual to see "The Bat" alone. I guess though I'm actually happy this doesn't have a solo mode. Saves me a LOT of money, possibly my life if my wife were to find out I backed! lol


I'm with you...lack of a solo mode just saved me a lot of money here.


+1 to this. No solo mode just saved me a ton of cash. I won't back without solo support. I can't just rely on a possible future promise that they would add it eventually. I can't justify dropping $300+ on a game where I would rarely get to play it with a group so I then have to invent my own way to play solo. Too many other games to back and play that have exactly what I want but good luck to the campaign! It will do just fine because well.....Batman.


The game will be back on Kickstarter in a year anyway or so anyway, so you can get everything then if they manage to develop a solo mode by then.


Why would you think it would?
I don't see them doing a second KS for Conan anytime soon.

Remember that this is a licensed product and getting a second KS for that raises many problems among which:
1) the licence should still be available.
2) they should trust a 100% the fact that a second batch would still absorb the licence fees. And I know they said it was already a risk. Imagine what it would be, knowing that those who were already interested have pledged the game the first time.

There is little chance they would make a second KS IMHO and if they don't, there is 0 chance to get a solo mode later.
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Kevin John
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baylock wrote:
Why would you think it would?
I don't see them doing a second KS for Conan anytime soon.


I'm curious if Gloomhaven has altered people's expectations. That one had a reprint which may cause some people to think other popular games get reprints. Although the situations are entirely different, GH had a rash of issues with preorders on the first campaign, enough so that there was an obvious demand for a second KS campaign.

Since BGCC is being up front about how it's now or nothing, I agree that it wouldn't be very likely to have a second run.
 
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I think the best bet for a 2nd KS would be just a book of scenarios that may have a solo mode included. Or maybe a small expansion.
 
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Brad B
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baylock wrote:
Shader10 wrote:
vectordream wrote:
Lemonpips wrote:
KingJackalope wrote:
This game is begging for a solo/coop mode. Batman being such a "lone wolf" of sorts. He does have Robin, but I think he's had more adventure without one of them at at the end of the day. Its surely not unusual to see "The Bat" alone. I guess though I'm actually happy this doesn't have a solo mode. Saves me a LOT of money, possibly my life if my wife were to find out I backed! lol


I'm with you...lack of a solo mode just saved me a lot of money here.


+1 to this. No solo mode just saved me a ton of cash. I won't back without solo support. I can't just rely on a possible future promise that they would add it eventually. I can't justify dropping $300+ on a game where I would rarely get to play it with a group so I then have to invent my own way to play solo. Too many other games to back and play that have exactly what I want but good luck to the campaign! It will do just fine because well.....Batman.


The game will be back on Kickstarter in a year anyway or so anyway, so you can get everything then if they manage to develop a solo mode by then.


Why would you think it would?
I don't see them doing a second KS for Conan anytime soon.

Remember that this is a licensed product and getting a second KS for that raises many problems among which:
1) the licence should still be available.
2) they should trust a 100% the fact that a second batch would still absorb the licence fees. And I know they said it was already a risk. Imagine what it would be, knowing that those who were already interested have pledged the game the first time.

There is little chance they would make a second KS IMHO and if they don't, there is 0 chance to get a solo mode later.


https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/806316071/conan/posts/1...

In one of the updates for Conan they state "But that’s not all! We are aiming to start the next Conan campaign in early 2019 which will include the new 2 player Vs system and an exploration into other Hyborian Age territories…"
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