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Gloomhaven» Forums » General

Subject: A few gloomhaven things on my mind. rss

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1. My wife plays Mindthief. She seems to be getting 2x 3x more exp than me (Brute) every scenario. MT seems tailored to level fast; is this an accurate assumption?

2. Her person goal includes exhausting X amount of times. Last night, we had one enemy left. I had a comfortable amount of cards left I knew I could solo him. Wife on the other hand was down to four cards. I ran back to the corner of the room for one turn to get a chest; while we decided she should just waste lost cards and get that exhaustion goal in for her. Next turn she wastes two lost cards again; thus exhausting herself.. while I went and solod the last guy.

It’s nice to work on her goal, but it felt rather a cheap thing to do. I mean.... is it okay that we did this? Or is inherently cheating the system?

Edit: ugh. Apologies for all my typos in the entirety of this thread. On mobile.
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Garret Boivie
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There isn't anything wrong with what you did. Frequently people will draw out the last few rounds to get more loot or chests or that sort of thing. If you don't like how it feel thematically then don't do it going forward but there aren't any rules against it.
 
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Daniel King
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Can't really speak much to your firs point. My wife played the mindthief while I played the brute coincidentally enough and I feel like we leveled at around the same pace. Hard to tell though, since I ended up playing some solo and passing her up.

As for your second point I don't think you are "gaming the system" I think that you are just "gaming". The point of the personal quests is to create a story. In a true RPG this would be part of your background, but here it takes place in how it causes your character to play differently. If your wife hadn't have had that quest you probably would have just finished the scenario without any interesting points, but now you have a small story to tell.
 
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Billy McBoatface
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Aren't personal goals supposed to be secret? Or is that only the mission goals?
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Michael Vannoy
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I've played somewhere around 15 scenarios and my wife has done 12. I am playing the brute and she is playing the spellweaver. Playing 3 less scenarios we are almost tied in experience
 
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michele c
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El3mentGamer wrote:
1. My wife plays Mindthief. She seems to be getting 2x 3x more exp than me (Brute) every scenario. MT seems tailored to level fast; is this an accurate assumption?

2. Her person goal includes exhausting X amount of times. Last night, we had one enemy left. I had a comfortable amount of cards left I knew I could solo him. Wife on the other hand was down to four cards. I ran back to the corner of the room for one turn to get a chest; while we decided she should just waste lost cards and get that exhaustion goal in for her. Next turn she wastes two lost cards again; thus exhausting herself.. while I went and solod the last guy.

It’s nice to work on her goal, but it felt rather a cheap thing to do. I mean.... is it okay that we did this? Or is inherently cheating the system?


I don't know about MT and Brute specifically, but I can say with certainty that some classes are designed to gain more XP than others.

As for exhausting, I think you are doing it right. If you play optimally it is very rare to exhaust, give the player has some skill/experience. I would say "cheating the system" is the only way to get that goal done in a reasonable amount of time.

Leaving the last monster standing while you loot is a common strategy, why not use it also for battle/career goals? I once spent the last 3 rounds walking over a single patch of hazardous terrain to fulfill my battlegoal.
 
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wmshub wrote:
Aren't personal goals supposed to be secret? Or is that only the mission goals?


They are supposed to be per the rules I guess lol. We share all that good info; so really I guess technically we’re playing wrong anyways.

More reason to keep at how we’ve been playing.

Edit: oops I was wrong?
 
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wmshub wrote:
Aren't personal goals supposed to be secret? Or is that only the mission goals?


They are not supposed to be secret. The battle goals are, though.
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wkufan89 wrote:
Can't really speak much to your firs point. My wife played the mindthief while I played the brute coincidentally enough and I feel like we leveled at around the same pace. Hard to tell though, since I ended up playing some solo and passing her up.

As for your second point I don't think you are "gaming the system" I think that you are just "gaming". The point of the personal quests is to create a story. In a true RPG this would be part of your background, but here it takes place in how it causes your character to play differently. If your wife hadn't have had that quest you probably would have just finished the scenario without any interesting points, but now you have a small story to tell.


Well freaking said! Basically the Mindthief could pull through the last room, but the Brute was able to conquer!
 
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mhl7 wrote:
wmshub wrote:
Aren't personal goals supposed to be secret? Or is that only the mission goals?


They are not supposed to be secret. The battle goals are, though.

Personal quest secrecy is optional. For some, they find that more interesting. But, for us, thematically, since we are a party together, we assume we'd learn about each other's personal motivations eventually.
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XP is all based on how you play your character and team composition.

In our group, it's going:
Cragheart by a wide margin
Tinkerer
Scoundrel/Spellweaver pulling up the rear

I played the brute at a friends house for a bunch of 2 player missions, and I think the brute was staying slightly ahead of the tinkerer for XP, but not by much.

At the end of the scenario, your wife was almost out of cards, while you had a bunch left. That hints to me that you're less willing to use 1 off "Lost Card" abilities than she is. Generally speaking, those are how you get XP.

Try burning a few more cards in scenario, that might close the gap.

EDIT: As for the personal goal thing, we have a teamate with the 'watch your allies get exhausted X times' goal. So if we know we have a mission beat, we'll suicide to help him out. One mission ended with:
First 2 players killing the last bad guys, 3rd/4th player running over hexes that cause damage until we exhausted ourselves. Clearly that's gaming the system, but if we didn't start suiciding, he'd be a solid 6 exhaustions behind where he is now.
 
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Scott Wheelock
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I ran a Mindthief/Brute/Scoundrel combo when I started, and I did find that the Mindthief got XP a lot faster. I think she has a few cards that you like to use as much as possible and that have 1 XP on them, as opposed to the Brute, who seems to have XP mainly on loss cards. (I could be misremembering, as I'm not at home to check.)

Edit: The reply below seems to have more accurate information.

The Brute has a couple of cards that use the 'every time X happens, do Y'. Those can be great for getting XP. If you're not using them, definitely start. I wouldn't even worry about saving cards, since if you fail the scenario, you'll be furthering your wife's retirement goal! Win-win.

As for prioritizing personal quests (or battle goals) over scenario success, it's part of the game, and a part that can be fun in a nail-biting kind of way. It sounds like she thought you could handle the final enemy, so it wasn't even that questionable a move.
 
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Cris Bohde
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El3mentGamer wrote:
1. My wife plays Mindthief. She seems to be getting 2x 3x more exp than me (Brute) every scenario. MT seems tailored to level fast; is this an accurate assumption?



Yes, some character types are inherently better at getting XP and/or Gold. Spellweaver is pretty good at XP, but Scoundrel is more geared towards looting.

I just retired my Brute last night, and I was easily getting 15+ XP (before scenario completion rewards) per scenario. He's actually good at getting XP due to the amount of decent non-loss attack cards he has, even at 1/x level cards. And I always put Warding Strength out before first rest to net the full 3XP when all charges are used, then put Juggernaut (Level 2 card) into play before the last room or two to use the full 3 charges there for 3XP.
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squegeeboo wrote:
At the end of the scenario, your wife was almost out of cards, while you had a bunch left. That hints to me that you're less willing to use 1 off "Lost Card" abilities than she is. Generally speaking, those are how you get XP.

Try burning a few more cards in scenario, that might close the gap.


Very accurate observation. And I agree with it. I am very stingy about playing lost cards Nothing irks me more than exhausting at the end of the scenario cause I ran out of cards to use.

I'll try being *slightly* less stingy.
 
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El3mentGamer wrote:

2. Her person goal includes exhausting X amount of times...

Next turn she wastes two lost cards again; thus exhausting herself..


Honestly, with this particular goal if you don't do things like that she'll never retire. That's one of the harder ones in the game.

El3mentGamer wrote:
is [this] inherently cheating the system?


The system doesn't care. The real question is are you cheating yourself out of some experience you paid for when you bought the game. I personally don't think so but who cares about my opinion. The only opinion that really matters here is your wife's.
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Gabriel Rockman
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I don't think that the Mindthief should be that far ahead of a brute in XP. She's not claiming 1XP from the augment every time she does a melee attack, right?

How much XP per scenario (not including the scenario bonus) are each of you getting? A normal amount would be about 9-15 I think.
 
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gabrielrockman1 wrote:
I don't think that the Mindthief should be that far ahead of a brute in XP. She's not claiming 1XP from the augment every time she does a melee attack, right?

How much XP per scenario (not including the scenario bonus) are each of you getting? A normal amount would be about 9-15 I think.


I usually get in the lower side of 5-15 (before scenario bonus); she seems to be milking at least 15-20 per game.

Also, no I know she’s not getting augment xp every time, she’s got that down; but I don’t always watch her, and not that i need to cause we’re just having fun; but I just thought about it... maybe she’s doing it wrong? Lol. I might just keep an eye on her next time (not worrying about it) and see if she’s really just that good at getting xp. Lmao. Not a big deal though I suppose as she’s on a good way to retiring.
 
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I play both MT / Brute characters solo. After 10 scenarios, they both level at similar paces but MT 10% higher than Brute. Brute has me working harder in planning ahead so the cards fall appropriately.

MT pulls it off with ease (esp. if you discard Augments before rest to ensure an even no. of cards, then replace with new Augment next turn earning +1 XP). MT boasts a noticeably higher kill ratio and has also resulted in a better outcome on 2 event cards.

Although MT was only an afterthought to compliment first-choice Brute, I find MT is more useful for its versatility. I regret choosing Brute which
has turned out to be a one-trick pony (TANK).
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During the beginning of my campaign our initial trio was Spellweaver/Tinkerer/Brute. The Spellweaver was gaining exp much faster than the other two. He would gain about 12-20 exp per scenario (before the bonus), the Brute was getting 8-15, and the Tinkerer was frequently getting less than that. Our Tinkerer started out being very stingy with loss cards and ending scenarios with many cards in their hand. She was getting the Brute's cards back before his first long rest every scenario so he also had a decent amount. The spellweaver was ending with 0-4 cards left after rebuying everything back with Reviving Ether.
 
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Bohde8781 wrote:
El3mentGamer wrote:
1. My wife plays Mindthief. She seems to be getting 2x 3x more exp than me (Brute) every scenario. MT seems tailored to level fast; is this an accurate assumption?



Yes, some character types are inherently better at getting XP and/or Gold. Spellweaver is pretty good at XP, but Scoundrel is more geared towards looting.


And this is where it's all about how you play your characters. Our spellweaver isn't great at XP, because they play super conservative to be the last one standing as needed, and our scoundrel(me) sucks at looting, because I'm all about helping the party win instead of looting.

Meanwhile, our tinkerer just kind of follows along, always ending on a coin and then doing ranged heal or damage attacks.
 
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schoaff wrote:

The only opinion that really matters here is your wife's.


I'm affraid it always comes to this in the end

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Michael Rotchell
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To be fair my kid is playing a Brute and always seems to get more XP than my wife with a Spellweaver and me with a Scoundrel!
 
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Brent Keeler
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SilverSam wrote:
I play both MT / Brute characters solo. After 10 scenarios, they both level at similar paces but MT 10% higher than Brute. Brute has me working harder in planning ahead so the cards fall appropriately.

MT pulls it off with ease (esp. if you discard Augments before rest to ensure an even no. of cards, then replace with new Augment next turn earning +1 XP). MT boasts a noticeably higher kill ratio and has also resulted in a better outcome on 2 event cards.

Although MT was only an afterthought to compliment first-choice Brute, I find MT is more useful for its versatility. I regret choosing Brute which
has turned out to be a one-trick pony (TANK).


I disagree with the assessment that the Brute is a one trick pony. While the easiest way to build/play him is Tank, I found that I could build a fun long distance moving, single enemy damager. It was basically me and the Scoundrel running far ahead of the party destroying things.

Also on the point of the discussions. When I was playing the Brute, I was one of the tops for XP on our team (Brute, Spellweaver, Tink, Scoundrel). It was a back and forth between me and the Spellweaver, and I hit lvl 9 first. Using the lvl 1 card (cant remember the name right now) that does Retaliate 2, gain 1 XP per hit (heal on the bottom) was great for XP early on. I was also averaging 15-20 XP per dungeon (not including scenario completion XP).
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El3mentGamer wrote:
...
2. Her person goal includes exhausting X amount of times. Last night, we had one enemy left. I had a comfortable amount of cards left I knew I could solo him. Wife on the other hand was down to four cards. I ran back to the corner of the room for one turn to get a chest; while we decided she should just waste lost cards and get that exhaustion goal in for her. Next turn she wastes two lost cards again; thus exhausting herself.. while I went and solod the last guy.


I did something similar on Sunday. My battle goal was to have 3 or fewer cards in hand or discard. I had seven. The last 4 rounds I took short rests just to get rid of cards. I have also done the short rests at the end of a scenario to get the battle quest to finish with 2 or fewer hit points. Just short ret take the hit and dras another card to discard. We see nothing wrong with it as it is achieving a goal.
 
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There was a scenario with a bunch of hazardous terrain around where my last turn was "spend all my movement moving through hazardous terrain, each time losing cards to prevent damage"
 
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