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Subject: Fourth player always loses rss

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jonky jonkerson
United States
California
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I have played this game several times and the person who is last in the turn order always loses.
I understand that 4th player is suppose to be offset with books, but its never worked in my game plays. Players 1-3 always get extra dice and sometimes the 4th player never gets more books to maintain that advantage.
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Rustan Håkansson
Sweden
Norrköping
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Both during testing and after I have both seen in my games and got reports from testeras where the fourth player won. I do not have enough data to know for sure (would require extreme amounts of games due to the variable nature of the game) but my belief is that although the fourth player is at a slight disadvantage it is absolutely possible to win. Giving the fourth player one more extra book made fourth place extremely powerful, so the decision was to either make it slightly weaker or significantly stronger. I chose to make it slightly worse. Group play style affects this though, and different groups reported quite different preference for various strategies, and also with the expansion preference for different nation boards.

If you have not seen fourth player win yet and no one wants to take that position, I recommend you give it one more book to start with. If you experience that now fourth player always wins you can take away the bonus book again.
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Vadim Golembo
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Player 4 has book advantage which is ok but not a win condition on it's own. They need to buy red dice to try to jocky back up to a better position and at the same time achieving points during the war phase.

I've seen 4th win but not by staying 4th.

Another strategy is to go for a green tile victory, they don't require gold to buy.
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Michael Reitz
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Mayen
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Wouldn't it be a good idea to give the 4th player a sword-chit as a starting bonus (maybe lowering the book bonus at the same time)?
This would give the 4th player an advantage to get to a better playing order position after the first round.

Michael
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Max Jansson
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Trollhättan
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Our games show the opposite, 4th player has won more than 25% of the game she's been playing. It's become something of a running gag with us at this point.
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fortheloveofdice
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Toronto
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Granted the majority of my games weren't 4 player, but I am pretty sure I have played well over 100 games, and I was never overly concerned with being last player even in a 4P game.
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