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Combat Commander: Europe» Forums » Rules

Subject: Suppressed or broken? rss

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Chris Birchall
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Widnes
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Hi, I'm quite new to wargaming and I've only played a few (up front, CC:E, fighting formations and memoir 44).I really enjoy them all but I think CC:E just takes the crown (even though I've only played it twice).

In one of our games of CC:E a leader was activated to cascade a move order to the surrounding squads. One of the squads moved into a new hex and was fired on using opp fire with an action Card to use spray fire to target the adjacent hex.
The adjacent hex contained one of the units activated to move (but not moved yet). The defence roll was equal to the attack roll.
Is the unit suppressed or broken?
We ended up suppressing them as the unit had not yet moved.
I hope this makes sense.
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HEEREN Xavier
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Moss1p wrote:
Hi, I'm quite new to wargaming and I've only played a few (up front, CC:E, fighting formations and memoir 44).I really enjoy them all but I think CC:E just takes the crown (even though I've only played it twice).

In one of our games of CC:E a leader was activated to cascade a move order to the surrounding squads. One of the squads moved into a new hex and was fired on using opp fire with an action Card to use spray fire to target the adjacent hex.
The adjacent hex contained one of the units activated to move (but not moved yet). The defence roll was equal to the attack roll.
Is the unit suppressed or broken?
We ended up suppressing them as the unit had not yet moved.
I hope this makes sense.


broken


The unit is ACTIVATED to move, anyway if he was moved or ll be moved...
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Confusion Under Fire
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Welcome to CC.
The unit only has to be activated to move, which is why it is important to state which units are activated.
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Chris Birchall
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Widnes
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Thanks for the quick responses. Much appreciated
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Russ Williams
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Rule reference:
O20.3.4 Fire Defense Roll wrote:
If the Defense Total is equal to the Attack Total, the unit becomes Suppressed [13] unless it is currently activated to Move [O21]—in which case it breaks instead of Suppressing.
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Kevin L. Kitchens
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russ wrote:
Rule reference:
O20.3.4 Fire Defense Roll wrote:
If the Defense Total is equal to the Attack Total, the unit becomes Suppressed [13] unless it is currently activated to Move [O21]—in which case it breaks instead of Suppressing.


And I repeat for effect, not to be nasty...

Rulebook v1.1 p3 wrote:
IMPORTANT: In Combat Commander, the motto “a rule means exactly what it says” should be the order of the day. In other words, as quoted from another fine game, Totaler Krieg!: “Do not infer or imagine more to a rule than is stated in it. When in doubt, interpret strictly”.


CC:E has the absolute BEST rulebook ever created for a game (except maybe tic-tac-toe )...
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Russ Williams
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I agree the rules are unusally great, clear and carefully precise (as are Chad Jensen's rules for Fighting Formations) compared to almost all games of similar complexity.

But in fairness, on this subject of activation, I'd say that it's not particularly clear at what moment an activated unit becomes unactivated. (I was just looking through the rules for that, because of this thread.) So one might plausibly think (incorrectly) that after you finish moving a unit, it becomes unactivated even if the Move order as a whole continues with other activated units. Or even that these units remain "activated" for the rest of your turn (including during later orders in your same turn).

If anyone can find a clear place in the rules saying that all units activated for a given order become unactivated exactly at the end of that same order, please point it out. I hope it's somewhere, but I couldn't find it in my search earlier today...
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Kevin L. Kitchens
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russ wrote:
I agree the rules are unusally great, clear and carefully precise (as are Chad Jensen's rules for Fighting Formations) compared to almost all games of similar complexity.

But in fairness, on this subject of activation, I'd say that it's not particularly clear at what moment an activated unit becomes unactivated. (I was just looking through the rules for that, because of this thread.) So one might plausibly think (incorrectly) that after you finish moving a unit, it becomes unactivated even if the Move order as a whole continues with other activated units. Or even that these units remain "activated" for the rest of your turn (including during later orders in your same turn).

If anyone can find a clear place in the rules saying that all units activated for a given order become unactivated exactly at the end of that same order, please point it out. I hope it's somewhere, but I couldn't find it in my search earlier today...


I'd defer to the golden rule.

You play an order.
Declare the units activated for the order.
Since nothing says they are deactivated prior to the order or remain activated after the order, the golden rule would be that they are activated for the duration of the order.

Anything else is assumption or carryover from other wargames and rulesets.

Quote:
Activate—A unit or player may normally only be “activated” for one Order per Turn.


Quote:
All units to be activated for an Order must be identified before the Order is carried out.


Even if a unit is activated for an order and not used for the order (i.e. you decide not to fire or move), that unit has been activated for the turn as well.

It seems pretty clear (though I guess not obvious if that's possible).... a unit is activated for the duration of the order. From declaration to resolution. since nothing says otherwise specifically.

Without assuming anything.

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Tom Duensing
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Welcome to war gaming. CC and Up Front are great choices. They are two of the best war games out there.
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Fernando Robert Yu
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LibertyToad wrote:
Welcome to war gaming. CC and Up Front are great choices. They are two of the best war games out there.


Agree!
 
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