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Subject: Ok which Michael Schacht Game should I get rss

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Tim Freerksen
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Some of these are OOP but I'm pretty sure there's not a high demand for these. I was thinking of London Markets, Valdora (with the 2p expansion) and Felinia.

I am a huge fan of his etto series but I'm ready for a next step. Are any of these three good or am I missing some of his older stuff?
 
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L B
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I seem to recall Zee Garcia of Dice Tower naming Felinia in the "Bad Games by Great Designers" list, so I'd personally skip that one.
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Adrian Iordache
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China
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T. Nomad
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C Bazler
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Africana is a sadly overlooked and underrated game: it's light, fast, but super tense, as players compete for cards/scoring goals.

Edit: I also see a couple of copies on the Geek Market for $15!
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Steve Valladolid
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China is very good. I also recently picked up Mogul and it is a fantastic filler.
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Bill Cook
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Elankat wrote:
I seem to recall Zee Garcia of Dice Tower naming Felinia in the "Bad Games by Great Designers" list, so I'd personally skip that one.


Zee's biggest problem with Felinia was that it that the art shows cat-people. Otherwise, it's just your standard trading in the Med game Dice Tower folks like to pick on. But they really pick on this, because cats.
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Tim Freerksen
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EMBison wrote:
Elankat wrote:
I seem to recall Zee Garcia of Dice Tower naming Felinia in the "Bad Games by Great Designers" list, so I'd personally skip that one.


Zee's biggest problem with Felinia was that it that the art shows cat-people. Otherwise, it's just your standard trading in the Med game Dice Tower folks like to pick on. But they really pick on this, because cats.


Just rewatched that video and he said it was basically every Euro ever created. So there was that apart from just... cats
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Tim Park
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China is one of the best game-per-length ration games I've seen, and I've had luck teaching it to non-gamers as well.
It has the additional benefit of all the additional maps Schacht made a few years ago, most of which are available to print... from his website if not here on the 'Geek.
Han Is the current edition, and Web of Power a previous iteration. Three different titles to look for that will scratch the same itch.


Mogul is great. +1.
 
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Rick Granger
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Maarten D. de Jong
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Valdora sucks monkey balls compared to its predecessor Hansa.

The fast area majority games Web of Power, China, and Han all work on a similar principle. I've only played the first two, and prefer the oldest iteration (WoP).

Very underrated is Coney Island. The game can end in four different ways, and players must be acutely aware of what kind of ending someone is aiming for, and adjust their strategies accordingly. For some reason it never took off... although if I were to hazard two guesses then a) you're building a theme park but of course it's all abstract cube pushing and tile laying; and b) inadequate recognition of how the various strategies interlock leading to somewhat lopsided outcomes.

I thought Dschunke was a load of hot air, and so would avoid its successor London Markets; the only good bit in Dschunke was the cargo tile stacking, and that has been cast into the small but cute Rat Hot. That's for two players only, I'm afraid.

If you like auctions you may want to give Industria / Industry a closer look. It's about constructing a tech tree. I found the game annoyingly repetitive and artificially constrained because of continued money shortages, but YMMV.
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Brad Miller
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L B
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EMBison wrote:
Elankat wrote:
I seem to recall Zee Garcia of Dice Tower naming Felinia in the "Bad Games by Great Designers" list, so I'd personally skip that one.


Zee's biggest problem with Felinia was that it that the art shows cat-people. Otherwise, it's just your standard trading in the Med game Dice Tower folks like to pick on. But they really pick on this, because cats.


And that it was a boring cube pusher with not much of note other than the cats stuck in there.
 
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Tim Freerksen
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cymric wrote:
Valdora sucks monkey balls compared to its predecessor Hansa.


hehe that's pretty harsh and yet I'm glad you're telling me that

Quote:
The fast area majority games Web of Power, China, and Han all work on a similar principle. I've only played the first two, and prefer the oldest iteration (WoP).


Does anybody have the rule differences? Or is it just the maps that are different

Quote:
Very underrated is Coney Island. The game can end in four different ways, and players must be acutely aware of what kind of ending someone is aiming for, and adjust their strategies accordingly. For some reason it never took off... although if I were to hazard two guesses then a) you're building a theme park but of course it's all abstract cube pushing and tile laying; and b) inadequate recognition of how the various strategies interlock leading to somewhat lopsided outcomes.


I like that concept. I don't like how certain people have different victory conditions ala Werewolf, other deduction games have this as well. But this seems interesting. After being burned way too often by thematic games I can handle some abstraction.

Quote:
I thought Dschunke was a load of hot air, and so would avoid its successor London Markets; the only good bit in Dschunke was the cargo tile stacking, and that has been cast into the small but cute Rat Hot. That's for two players only, I'm afraid.


Small, cute and 2 player Rat Hot sounds fun, I keep forgetting I have Dschunke, I don't find it bad but not worth getting London Markets so thanks

Quote:
If you like auctions you may want to give Industria / Industry a closer look. It's about constructing a tech tree. I found the game annoyingly repetitive and artificially constrained because of continued money shortages, but YMMV.


I'll look into that.
 
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Tim Freerksen
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Aardvark wrote:


Kontor


Interested now the real question is. Are the expansions worth it?
 
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Who Am I?
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I don't think any of the other gamers in my group enjoyed it as much as I did... but Mogul struck me as being absolutely fascinating. The rules are very simple, but the decisions are interesting and there is a lot of room for different strategies to come into play. Player interaction is very strong.

There are two potential problems:

(1) The game can punish you for making bad choices. (More specifically, one player spent/lost all of their bidding tokens and then refused to pass when the chip pool was small - leading to a situation where they spent a couple of turns with essentially no bidding power.) The easy solution to this, in my mind, is to give a warning that running out of chips is very bad and then playing the game a couple of times and letting people learn from their mistakes.

(2) The game doesn't really change much from round to round. Even though the value of cards you are bidding for will change, based on which stocks are owned and how many opportunities remain to sell off shares, the bidding process stays the same. For some people, the game might last slightly too long?
 
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Maarten D. de Jong
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copcopps wrote:
Does anybody have the rule differences? Or is it just the maps that are different

No, there are rules differences. The games' forums will provide you with the information you request. But playing the games is the only way to tell for sure how you like the various variations.

Quote:
I like that concept. I don't like how certain people have different victory conditions ala Werewolf, other deduction games have this as well. But this seems interesting. After being burned way too often by thematic games I can handle some abstraction.

Do be advised that there is no pre-determined way in which the game can end. It's up to the players to 'decide' (push for / let it happen / oppose / ...) while en route to the finish.
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Chris Puram
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Golden... As in Oldie! I'm new to the Portland area and looking for gamers to game with and new gaming groups to join! I'm 50+ and like most games but do have a special affinity for dry, cube pushing euros!
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+1 China (or Web of Power, Han) One of my favorite "super fillers"
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Tim Freerksen
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cymric wrote:
[q="copcopps"]

Quote:
I like that concept. I don't like how certain people have different victory conditions ala Werewolf, other deduction games have this as well. But this seems interesting. After being burned way too often by thematic games I can handle some abstraction.

Do be advised that there is no pre-determined way in which the game can end. It's up to the players to 'decide' (push for / let it happen / oppose / ...) while en route to the finish.


Yeah that's why I actually like it. I like that in a game where everybody can push for or let some an ending happen. Not a specific person that's what I meant
 
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Bill Cook
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copcopps wrote:
cymric wrote:
Valdora sucks monkey balls compared to its predecessor Hansa.


hehe that's pretty harsh and yet I'm glad you're telling me that


Are you sure that was meant as an insult?
 
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Bill Eldard
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goldengamer wrote:
+1 China (or Web of Power, Han) One of my favorite "super fillers"

I concur. If you can't get that, I recommend California or Coloretto.
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Hobie
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So...why do they have these overtext things anyway?
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Elankat wrote:
I seem to recall Zee Garcia of Dice Tower naming Felinia in the "Bad Games by Great Designers" list, so I'd personally skip that one.


Just the opposite. If the Dice Tower thinks a game is bad, it will probably end up on my wishlist.
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Gláucio Reis
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copcopps wrote:
I was thinking of London Markets, Valdora (with the 2p expansion) and Felinia.

I haven't played London Markets, but I own the other two. Valdora is a somewhat standard pick-up-and-delivery game, fulfilling contracts and such, except for the book flipping mechanic. But Africana uses the same mechanic and I find it better, albeit not as pleasing to the eye. Felinia is excellent, but, commercially speaking, apparently the (quite irrelevant) cat theme backfired. It has a similar mechanic to The Speicherstadt, but it's much better developed, and the exploration part really adds to the game. It's my favorite from Schacht, followed by China.
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Tomello Visello
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I see China (Web of Power) mentioned. I almost never think of that game alone because I think it has commonality with Patrician in that both games require an oblique approach to reach your objective, and I favor them both.


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L B
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beardandglasses wrote:
Elankat wrote:
I seem to recall Zee Garcia of Dice Tower naming Felinia in the "Bad Games by Great Designers" list, so I'd personally skip that one.


Just the opposite. If the Dice Tower thinks a game is bad, it will probably end up on my wishlist.


And yet a lot of your top rated games are in their top 100. Obviously, the multiple reviewers on DT have their preferences for games, as do other reviewers, and those may not align with you own. However, there is generally overlap among a great number of reviewers on games that are bad or mediocre and games that are better. There are always outliers and opinions that don't agree. I look forward to seeing your rating on Felinia.
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