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Cataclysm: A Second World War» Forums » General

Subject: Some questions rss

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Ste M
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Hi. I have found this game thanks to the hotness list.
I have 2 questions:
1 why is tagged as 2018 game since i have seen is around for many years
2 how this compare with a game that i love: triumph and tragedy
Thwnks
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Jason Lindsay
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I can't answer your 2nd question, but the answer to the 1st questions is, It was just published and shipped on May 22nd, 2018.
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Scott Muldoon (silentdibs)
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The game was only just published this month, hence 2018.
Development lasted over seven years, and we were very public about our process, so that's why you've seen us around before.

I'll leave your second question to other parties without a financial interest, but we've covered it before.
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Wendell
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Si non potes reperire Berolini in tabula, ludens essetis non WIF.
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Hey, get your stinking cursor off my face! I got nukes, you know.
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Stefano, I'll compare it to Triumph & Tragedy.

The main similarity is they are both 3-cornered games; as in T&T, in Cat the Soviets are their own side and can end up at war with the Democracies and/or the Axis. And they both take a fairly high-level look at the war.

But significant differences. First, T&T only covers Europe; Cat covers the globe.

Second, T&T uses cards and blocks. None of that in Cat.

And Cataclysm uses chit draw for activation, which mixes things up a lot. Also I find (if playing the '33-end of war campaign) the political game in Cataclysm to be way more interesting than T&T; you have to increase your mobilization, try to form alliances, keep the home front happy, try to bring minor countries to your side diplomatically, etc.

T&T's combat is a little more granular, while Cat's focus is higher - army groups, not armies.

Personally, I much prefer Cataclysm.
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Adam Ruzzo
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I was really excited about T&T when it first came out, and played it a lot. However, on repeated plays we had some issues that don't appear to be fixable. Namely, the 3-way game often results in one player being marginalized and/or playing kingmaker. Despite how much I love the card play in T&T (it's just brilliantly designed), this flaw holds it back from greatness.

So far, in all 4 of my games of Cataclysm, the game hasn't really resulted in that same feeling of "well, I can't win now, but I have a social obligation to keep playing so the other two can figure out who won."

Partly this is due to the construction of the rules. The game ends when the USSR surrenders, or when one side forces to powers to surrender (Ex: Fascists force France & UK to surrender or Democracies for Japan & Italy to surrender). These two end conditions basically end the game early because one side is logically eliminated and that means one side is very likely running away with the game and the result is a foregone conclusion.

It's often hard to make the "end game" conditions line up with the moment when all the players agree the game is over (ex: "yup, it looks like greg is definitely going to win this game").

So far, Cataclysm works very well in this regard. The balance of power allows each side to aid the others if needed. The USA can send aid to the USSR if they are on the ropes. If the USSR is doing fine, the USA has no incentive to send aid and overpower them. In one of our games, Germany got over-run due to a combination of risky strategy and bad lack. The USA/UK alliance wound up declaring war on the USSR right after that because the USSR had a solid lead, but that fight lead to the fascists trying to get VP with Japan in China to ride out the game and hope to come up on top if the USSR collapsed.

All in all, highly recommended!
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Ste M
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Ok, thank you.
I will wait for mounted map
 
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Adam Ruzzo
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Stefano1234 wrote:
Ok, thank you.
I will wait for mounted map


That probably won't be out for another 12-18 months, FYI.
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Scott Muldoon (silentdibs)
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Bridger wrote:
Stefano1234 wrote:
Ok, thank you.
I will wait for mounted map


That probably won't be out for another 12-18 months, FYI.

Assuming it makes the preorder numbers.
 
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Ste M
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Ow i actually never played with paper map. I need to have plexiglass to cover it?
 
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Kevin Bernatz
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Not a "need", no. The paper maps lay fairly flat and play just fine. Some people use poster frames that you can get cheap at places like Michaels, instead ... if you don't want to go the plexi route.

-K
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Wendell
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Hey, get your stinking cursor off my face! I got nukes, you know.
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kbernatz wrote:
Not a "need", no. The paper maps lay fairly flat and play just fine. Some people use poster frames that you can get cheap at places like Michaels, instead ... if you don't want to go the plexi route.

-K


My one play with the published version was without plexi or posters; the maps lay flat. I suspect that's another benefit of '2 small maps' rather than '1 bigger map'...
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