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Cataclysm: A Second World War» Forums » Rules

Subject: Losses and Voluntary Retreat rss

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David Murray
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Had this situation come up:

2 German tanks invaded Poland which was held by 2 Russian tanks. Germans inflicted two losses. With that in mind:

1) Can a voluntary retreat be used BEFORE taking your first loss by flipping an upgraded unit?
2) Do both losses have to be taken by flipping both tanks to infantry?
3) When you declare a voluntary retreat, do you negate one loss per unit retreated? Or one loss by retreating all applicable units? (Land for land battle)
4) Imagine the Russians had to take 4 losses, could they flip both tanks and retreat both (now infantry) to absorb all 4 losses?
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Adam Ruzzo
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1) It doesn't matter when the voluntary retreat is applied. It's net effect is to reduce losses by 1. If you retreat first and then apply the loss it is no different than applying the loss and then retreating.

That said, we use the retreat to absorb the "final" loss. So if you take 3 losses, we apply 2 and then retreat. Just remember that if you ever take more losses than you have steps retreat is not an option (I.E. you can't use retreat to avoid a disaster). So in your example if 5 losses were incurred on your 4 steps worth of forces, you would not be allowed to retreat.

2) The losses section (10.8) states in priority 2 that "At least one loss must be to flip an upgraded unit if possible." Only one of the tanks need to be flipped to satisfy this rule. So if you took 2 losses with 2 tank units and didn't want to retreat, you could fully destroy one tank army and leave the other tank army intact. Or you could reduce them both by 1 (very rare where this would be something you want to do I think).

3) Voluntary retreats negates one loss total for the combat if you retreat all applicable units. See the Combat Result Sequence at the bottom left of page 32 (10.7).

4) (Edited) No, see #3. Retreating negates a single loss. They could flip both tanks, lose one infantry, and then retreat to absorb the fourth loss.

Long story short:

If losses are less than your # of steps: You may retreat to absorb a single loss or stay to hold the position.

If the losses are equal to your # of steps you may retreat to absorb a loss and save one step (staying isn't an option as you will lose everything if you do).

If the losses are greater than your # of steps then you suffer a disaster, no retreat is allowed.


Hope that helps clear it up
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Kevin Bernatz
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Not quite right on #4, but question #4 is also not quite right.

If the Soviets take 4 losses they COULD retreat, but it would be with only /one/ remaining Infantry. I.e. they could take 3 losses, then use the retreat to satisfy the 4th, leaving one infantry alive.

-K
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David Murray
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Thank you both!
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Adam Ruzzo
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kbernatz wrote:
Not quite right on #4, but question #4 is also not quite right.

If the Soviets take 4 losses they COULD retreat, but it would be with only /one/ remaining Infantry. I.e. they could take 3 losses, then use the retreat to satisfy the 4th, leaving one infantry alive.

-K


Ugh, typing too fast for my brain this morning. Thanks for the correction Kevin. I've edited my original post.
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Scott Muldoon (silentdibs)
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The rules are worded so that first you check for disaster, then (if no disaster) declare the retreat, reduce losses, apply losses, then execute the retreat.
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