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Robin Hassgård
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I'm getting a bit tired of Imperial Settlers and are looking for something that scratch a similar itch as a replacement. Been looking at Alien Artifacts, but have never tried it so i dunno if it's as similar as it looks. I know about 51st state but never really liked that one. Anyone got any tip?

Cheers!
 
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Marco Teti
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Are you looking for thematic or just an engine building/tableau game? If so take a Look at Terraforming Mars.




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Marco Schaub
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I've played Alien Artifacts twice now and I don't care much for it. It's got some good aspects, but it's not as good as Imperial Settlers. Plus, I feel it's more restrictive. You can do one thing each turn, sometimes only half a thing.

Maybe Deus? You play cards / place buildings and when you place another building of the same type, you can trigger all the builldings of that type you've previously played.

Possibly Race for the Galaxy or Roll for the Galaxy? They both have tableau building and piecing together of engines.
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Travis Merkle
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Everdell is great and is similar to Imperial Settlers. It is a tableau / engine building card game with a worker placement element and great theming. It just went out to Kickstarter backers and should be available for retail soon (although I admit I don’t know about it’s international availability).
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Might be completely off, but to me Rivals for Catan is the best building game I know.
If the pleasure of building something and then enjoying its fruits is what you are after, I would have a close look at that game.
 
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Ryucoo
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Rombie wrote:
I'm getting a bit tired of Imperial Settlers and are looking for something that scratch a similar itch as a replacement. Been looking at Alien Artifacts, but have never tried it so i dunno if it's as similar as it looks. I know about 51st state but never really liked that one. Anyone got any tip?

Cheers!


If you wanted something with a similar feel and complexity, give London (second edition) a try.

Race For The Galaxy is a more streamlined "make something out of what you get" kinda game.

Teraforming Mars is a big step up in complexity and I think it's too long a game to work with the "make something from what you get" style, and if you de-randomise the game with its draft variant it goes on even longer but it's very popular.

For pure engine building card combo bliss you might try Dominion which is the daddy.
 
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Ryucoo wrote:

Teraforming Mars is (...) too long a game to work with the "make something from what you get" style, and if you de-randomise the game with its draft variant it goes on even longer (...)


That is exactly my thought on Terraforming Mars.
 
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Ryucoo
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Si Fei wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:

Teraforming Mars is (...) too long a game to work with the "make something from what you get" style, and if you de-randomise the game with its draft variant it goes on even longer (...)


That is exactly my thought on Terraforming Mars.


Plus for a game about Mars, with a big planet Mars infront of all the players, hardly any of the game takes place on Mars, instead taking place beside Mars in isolated player tableaus. Which is kinda disappointing to me.
 
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+1 on Everdell. I’ve never seen any other games that are quite as comparable to Imperial Settlers but with enough differences to make it feel like a different (and better) game.
 
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Tom Little
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Deus is a great tableau builder in my opinion.
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Ryucoo
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Forget Deus. It’s a backward step. It looks kinda spesh and there is w nice elegance to it but it’s practically broken in the fact that over half the cards aren’t very useful and decent combos are so rare - yet when one player randomly draws such a combo, it’s so powerful they win the game.

Too random, too basic.
 
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Trevor Taylor
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Ryucoo wrote:
Forget Deus. It’s a backward step. It looks kinda spesh and there is w nice elegance to it but it’s practically broken in the fact that over half the cards aren’t very useful and decent combos are so rare - yet when one player randomly draws such a combo, it’s so powerful they win the game.

Too random, too basic.


This sounds like a sore loser to me...

...I've played this a few times physically and a few more online. Not much yet, but even then I won games and lost them and only had 2 that were a white-wash. Yes there ARE cards that aren't as good, but they're more versatile. Also, it is VERY easy to search the deck for cards you do want. Saying half the cards aren't useful is a ridiculous statement.
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Ryucoo
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negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
Forget Deus. It’s a backward step. It looks kinda spesh and there is w nice elegance to it but it’s practically broken in the fact that over half the cards aren’t very useful and decent combos are so rare - yet when one player randomly draws such a combo, it’s so powerful they win the game.

Too random, too basic.


This sounds like a sore loser to me...

...I've played this a few times physically and a few more online. Not much yet, but even then I won games and lost them and only had 2 that were a white-wash. Yes there ARE cards that aren't as good, but they're more versatile. Also, it is VERY easy to search the deck for cards you do want. Saying half the cards aren't useful is a ridiculous statement.


Settle down mate, it's just an opinion - play the ball not the player.

By useful, I mean just not of any real interest. Like, oh - it does this? Well, I can do that already. Sure you can search through the deck to find the interesting combos but I dunno, discarding cards to random draw more cards - I just didn't find that particularly interesting as a game.

I really like the idea of it, the core mechanics are elegant and seem to be a really neat design. But it falls down (for me) on the cards themselves. So much chaff in that deck it just becomes a game about cycling your hand. And when somebody, through zero skill, hits a combo that churns out mega-points it's not even that enjoyable for them; we found it a bit embarassing. While everyone is plodding along with cards that do a little bit of this and a little bit of that in isolation, the guy who picks up a card that chains perfectly with something else he randomly has (which has on occasion been me - I don't lose ALL the time, dude!) fires himself up the track with 3 times as many points as everyone else PUT TOGETHER, they don't really feel like celebrating.

There is a game in there somewhere but it's waay too random and swingy for me. The board is just horrible as well - for such an elegant design mechanically, it's a busy mess to look at and doesn't look like a map at all. Maybe it's too abstract visually for me, for this type of game.

But tastes differ, plenty enjoy it. But it's a backward step to Imperial Settlers - the OP would be way better off going forwards IMO.
 
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Trevor Taylor
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Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
Forget Deus. It’s a backward step. It looks kinda spesh and there is w nice elegance to it but it’s practically broken in the fact that over half the cards aren’t very useful and decent combos are so rare - yet when one player randomly draws such a combo, it’s so powerful they win the game.

Too random, too basic.


This sounds like a sore loser to me...

...I've played this a few times physically and a few more online. Not much yet, but even then I won games and lost them and only had 2 that were a white-wash. Yes there ARE cards that aren't as good, but they're more versatile. Also, it is VERY easy to search the deck for cards you do want. Saying half the cards aren't useful is a ridiculous statement.


Settle down mate, it's just an opinion - play the ball not the player.

By useful, I mean just not of any real interest. Like, oh - it does this? Well, I can do that already. Sure you can search through the deck to find the interesting combos but I dunno, discarding cards to random draw more cards - I just didn't find that particularly interesting as a game.

I really like the idea of it, the core mechanics are elegant and seem to be a really neat design. But it falls down (for me) on the cards themselves. So much chaff in that deck it just becomes a game about cycling your hand. And when somebody, through zero skill, hits a combo that churns out mega-points it's not even that enjoyable for them; we found it a bit embarassing. While everyone is plodding along with cards that do a little bit of this and a little bit of that in isolation, the guy who picks up a card that chains perfectly with something else he randomly has (which has on occasion been me - I don't lose ALL the time, dude!) fires himself up the track with 3 times as many points as everyone else PUT TOGETHER, they don't really feel like celebrating.

There is a game in there somewhere but it's waay too random and swingy for me. The board is just horrible as well - for such an elegant design mechanically, it's a busy mess to look at and doesn't look like a map at all. Maybe it's too abstract visually for me, for this type of game.

But tastes differ, plenty enjoy it. But it's a backward step to Imperial Settlers - the OP would be way better off going forwards IMO.


...and IMO you have given up after a bad experience. This is certainly not a step back from IS and is in fact a meatier game with LESS random elements. The fact YOU don't see the use of a card doesn't mean it isn't useful, just that it doesn't work with what you're trying to build. My last game of this I dumped all my cards the first turn as I didn't have a good starting building. But I nearly always do and from a deck of 96 cards that's a pretty good distribution. It's quite often better to get new cards than to just build what you can afford. if you are building every turn until you run out of cards, you're probably not playing very well (or got VERY VERY lucky in your card draw).
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Glory to rome?
 
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Ryucoo
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negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
Forget Deus. It’s a backward step. It looks kinda spesh and there is w nice elegance to it but it’s practically broken in the fact that over half the cards aren’t very useful and decent combos are so rare - yet when one player randomly draws such a combo, it’s so powerful they win the game.

Too random, too basic.


This sounds like a sore loser to me...

...I've played this a few times physically and a few more online. Not much yet, but even then I won games and lost them and only had 2 that were a white-wash. Yes there ARE cards that aren't as good, but they're more versatile. Also, it is VERY easy to search the deck for cards you do want. Saying half the cards aren't useful is a ridiculous statement.


Settle down mate, it's just an opinion - play the ball not the player.

By useful, I mean just not of any real interest. Like, oh - it does this? Well, I can do that already. Sure you can search through the deck to find the interesting combos but I dunno, discarding cards to random draw more cards - I just didn't find that particularly interesting as a game.

I really like the idea of it, the core mechanics are elegant and seem to be a really neat design. But it falls down (for me) on the cards themselves. So much chaff in that deck it just becomes a game about cycling your hand. And when somebody, through zero skill, hits a combo that churns out mega-points it's not even that enjoyable for them; we found it a bit embarassing. While everyone is plodding along with cards that do a little bit of this and a little bit of that in isolation, the guy who picks up a card that chains perfectly with something else he randomly has (which has on occasion been me - I don't lose ALL the time, dude!) fires himself up the track with 3 times as many points as everyone else PUT TOGETHER, they don't really feel like celebrating.

There is a game in there somewhere but it's waay too random and swingy for me. The board is just horrible as well - for such an elegant design mechanically, it's a busy mess to look at and doesn't look like a map at all. Maybe it's too abstract visually for me, for this type of game.

But tastes differ, plenty enjoy it. But it's a backward step to Imperial Settlers - the OP would be way better off going forwards IMO.


...and IMO you have given up after a bad experience. This is certainly not a step back from IS and is in fact a meatier game with LESS random elements. The fact YOU don't see the use of a card doesn't mean it isn't useful, just that it doesn't work with what you're trying to build. My last game of this I dumped all my cards the first turn as I didn't have a good starting building. But I nearly always do and from a deck of 96 cards that's a pretty good distribution. It's quite often better to get new cards than to just build what you can afford. if you are building every turn until you run out of cards, you're probably not playing very well (or got VERY VERY lucky in your card draw).


What's the point of perseverance in the face of repeated "bad experience"? At somepoint you just have to cut your losses and stop wasting time on something you aren't enjoying. And if one isn't enjoying the rare moment a player by chance hits on a combo and breaks the game, or the act of drawing cards that does something you can already do, or spending a turn just drawing cards, or staring at that weird board, then it's probably fair that they move on to a different game. Plenty out there, no need to plug away at something you find isn't working.
 
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Trevor Taylor
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Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
Forget Deus. It’s a backward step. It looks kinda spesh and there is w nice elegance to it but it’s practically broken in the fact that over half the cards aren’t very useful and decent combos are so rare - yet when one player randomly draws such a combo, it’s so powerful they win the game.

Too random, too basic.


This sounds like a sore loser to me...

...I've played this a few times physically and a few more online. Not much yet, but even then I won games and lost them and only had 2 that were a white-wash. Yes there ARE cards that aren't as good, but they're more versatile. Also, it is VERY easy to search the deck for cards you do want. Saying half the cards aren't useful is a ridiculous statement.


Settle down mate, it's just an opinion - play the ball not the player.

By useful, I mean just not of any real interest. Like, oh - it does this? Well, I can do that already. Sure you can search through the deck to find the interesting combos but I dunno, discarding cards to random draw more cards - I just didn't find that particularly interesting as a game.

I really like the idea of it, the core mechanics are elegant and seem to be a really neat design. But it falls down (for me) on the cards themselves. So much chaff in that deck it just becomes a game about cycling your hand. And when somebody, through zero skill, hits a combo that churns out mega-points it's not even that enjoyable for them; we found it a bit embarassing. While everyone is plodding along with cards that do a little bit of this and a little bit of that in isolation, the guy who picks up a card that chains perfectly with something else he randomly has (which has on occasion been me - I don't lose ALL the time, dude!) fires himself up the track with 3 times as many points as everyone else PUT TOGETHER, they don't really feel like celebrating.

There is a game in there somewhere but it's waay too random and swingy for me. The board is just horrible as well - for such an elegant design mechanically, it's a busy mess to look at and doesn't look like a map at all. Maybe it's too abstract visually for me, for this type of game.

But tastes differ, plenty enjoy it. But it's a backward step to Imperial Settlers - the OP would be way better off going forwards IMO.


...and IMO you have given up after a bad experience. This is certainly not a step back from IS and is in fact a meatier game with LESS random elements. The fact YOU don't see the use of a card doesn't mean it isn't useful, just that it doesn't work with what you're trying to build. My last game of this I dumped all my cards the first turn as I didn't have a good starting building. But I nearly always do and from a deck of 96 cards that's a pretty good distribution. It's quite often better to get new cards than to just build what you can afford. if you are building every turn until you run out of cards, you're probably not playing very well (or got VERY VERY lucky in your card draw).


What's the point of perseverance in the face of repeated "bad experience"? At somepoint you just have to cut your losses and stop wasting time on something you aren't enjoying. And if one isn't enjoying the rare moment a player by chance hits on a combo and breaks the game, or the act of drawing cards that does something you can already do, or spending a turn just drawing cards, or staring at that weird board, then it's probably fair that they move on to a different game. Plenty out there, no need to plug away at something you find isn't working.


No-one said there was anything wrong with you giving up on the game. What was wrong is you made a categorical judgement that the game was broken after a bad experience.
 
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negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
Forget Deus. It’s a backward step. It looks kinda spesh and there is w nice elegance to it but it’s practically broken in the fact that over half the cards aren’t very useful and decent combos are so rare - yet when one player randomly draws such a combo, it’s so powerful they win the game.

Too random, too basic.


This sounds like a sore loser to me...

...I've played this a few times physically and a few more online. Not much yet, but even then I won games and lost them and only had 2 that were a white-wash. Yes there ARE cards that aren't as good, but they're more versatile. Also, it is VERY easy to search the deck for cards you do want. Saying half the cards aren't useful is a ridiculous statement.


Settle down mate, it's just an opinion - play the ball not the player.

By useful, I mean just not of any real interest. Like, oh - it does this? Well, I can do that already. Sure you can search through the deck to find the interesting combos but I dunno, discarding cards to random draw more cards - I just didn't find that particularly interesting as a game.

I really like the idea of it, the core mechanics are elegant and seem to be a really neat design. But it falls down (for me) on the cards themselves. So much chaff in that deck it just becomes a game about cycling your hand. And when somebody, through zero skill, hits a combo that churns out mega-points it's not even that enjoyable for them; we found it a bit embarassing. While everyone is plodding along with cards that do a little bit of this and a little bit of that in isolation, the guy who picks up a card that chains perfectly with something else he randomly has (which has on occasion been me - I don't lose ALL the time, dude!) fires himself up the track with 3 times as many points as everyone else PUT TOGETHER, they don't really feel like celebrating.

There is a game in there somewhere but it's waay too random and swingy for me. The board is just horrible as well - for such an elegant design mechanically, it's a busy mess to look at and doesn't look like a map at all. Maybe it's too abstract visually for me, for this type of game.

But tastes differ, plenty enjoy it. But it's a backward step to Imperial Settlers - the OP would be way better off going forwards IMO.


...and IMO you have given up after a bad experience. This is certainly not a step back from IS and is in fact a meatier game with LESS random elements. The fact YOU don't see the use of a card doesn't mean it isn't useful, just that it doesn't work with what you're trying to build. My last game of this I dumped all my cards the first turn as I didn't have a good starting building. But I nearly always do and from a deck of 96 cards that's a pretty good distribution. It's quite often better to get new cards than to just build what you can afford. if you are building every turn until you run out of cards, you're probably not playing very well (or got VERY VERY lucky in your card draw).


What's the point of perseverance in the face of repeated "bad experience"? At somepoint you just have to cut your losses and stop wasting time on something you aren't enjoying. And if one isn't enjoying the rare moment a player by chance hits on a combo and breaks the game, or the act of drawing cards that does something you can already do, or spending a turn just drawing cards, or staring at that weird board, then it's probably fair that they move on to a different game. Plenty out there, no need to plug away at something you find isn't working.


No-one said there was anything wrong with you giving up on the game. What was wrong is you made a categorical judgement that the game was broken after a bad experience.


What are we to judge games on if not our experience with it?
 
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Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
Forget Deus. It’s a backward step. It looks kinda spesh and there is w nice elegance to it but it’s practically broken in the fact that over half the cards aren’t very useful and decent combos are so rare - yet when one player randomly draws such a combo, it’s so powerful they win the game.

Too random, too basic.


This sounds like a sore loser to me...

...I've played this a few times physically and a few more online. Not much yet, but even then I won games and lost them and only had 2 that were a white-wash. Yes there ARE cards that aren't as good, but they're more versatile. Also, it is VERY easy to search the deck for cards you do want. Saying half the cards aren't useful is a ridiculous statement.


Settle down mate, it's just an opinion - play the ball not the player.

By useful, I mean just not of any real interest. Like, oh - it does this? Well, I can do that already. Sure you can search through the deck to find the interesting combos but I dunno, discarding cards to random draw more cards - I just didn't find that particularly interesting as a game.

I really like the idea of it, the core mechanics are elegant and seem to be a really neat design. But it falls down (for me) on the cards themselves. So much chaff in that deck it just becomes a game about cycling your hand. And when somebody, through zero skill, hits a combo that churns out mega-points it's not even that enjoyable for them; we found it a bit embarassing. While everyone is plodding along with cards that do a little bit of this and a little bit of that in isolation, the guy who picks up a card that chains perfectly with something else he randomly has (which has on occasion been me - I don't lose ALL the time, dude!) fires himself up the track with 3 times as many points as everyone else PUT TOGETHER, they don't really feel like celebrating.

There is a game in there somewhere but it's waay too random and swingy for me. The board is just horrible as well - for such an elegant design mechanically, it's a busy mess to look at and doesn't look like a map at all. Maybe it's too abstract visually for me, for this type of game.

But tastes differ, plenty enjoy it. But it's a backward step to Imperial Settlers - the OP would be way better off going forwards IMO.


...and IMO you have given up after a bad experience. This is certainly not a step back from IS and is in fact a meatier game with LESS random elements. The fact YOU don't see the use of a card doesn't mean it isn't useful, just that it doesn't work with what you're trying to build. My last game of this I dumped all my cards the first turn as I didn't have a good starting building. But I nearly always do and from a deck of 96 cards that's a pretty good distribution. It's quite often better to get new cards than to just build what you can afford. if you are building every turn until you run out of cards, you're probably not playing very well (or got VERY VERY lucky in your card draw).


What's the point of perseverance in the face of repeated "bad experience"? At somepoint you just have to cut your losses and stop wasting time on something you aren't enjoying. And if one isn't enjoying the rare moment a player by chance hits on a combo and breaks the game, or the act of drawing cards that does something you can already do, or spending a turn just drawing cards, or staring at that weird board, then it's probably fair that they move on to a different game. Plenty out there, no need to plug away at something you find isn't working.


No-one said there was anything wrong with you giving up on the game. What was wrong is you made a categorical judgement that the game was broken after a bad experience.


What are we to judge games on if not our experience with it?


You can obviously decide whether you like something or not in whatever way you wish.

But if you don't understand that deciding a game is broken after a bad experience is foolish, then there's no point discussing further with you. Making it worse by ignoring people's response to your criticism of the game. Instead responding with complaints that you aren't being allowed to have an opinion, rather than reflecting on how their experiences might help you better understand the game, or at least why you had your experience.
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negatrev wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
What are we to judge games on if not our experience with it?


You can obviously decide whether you like something or not in whatever way you wish.

But if you don't understand that deciding a game is broken after a bad experience is foolish, then there's no point discussing further with you. Making it worse by ignoring people's response to your criticism of the game. Instead responding with complaints that you aren't being allowed to have an opinion, rather than reflecting on how their experiences might help you better understand the game, or at least why you had your experience.


I tend to agree. Judging a game is broken after one play is generally shortsighted. One play can always be a statistical outlier.

Imagine if people judged you by your worst behavior. That's not a fair representation of who you are. We all have good and bad days. And we shouldn't dismiss people - and more importantly, board games - after one encounter.
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I didn’t play it just once. I owned it and traded it away when I found that our group were not enjoying it for the reasons I gave.

We can only judge a game by our experience with it, it’s daft to think otherwise and there is a whole industry based around people experiencing the games for us and providing their subjective opinions.

If the game works for you, great! No need to get rattled with me and call me foolish or shortsighted - there’s every chance those pejoratives could be true of the other side for not noticing the flaws in the game design? Who knows! But I don’t think it’s a useful path to go down.

I’m sorry if you didn’t feel I responded properly to your response, but I’m not really sure you said anything beyond a rather stern telling off about not judging a game by playing it, that needed addressing. I’m glad you had an anecdote about mulliganing your hand (I still think a turn consisting of dumping randomly drawn cards to draw more random cards in hope something useful will show up is indicative of good game design), but let’s assume I nodded politely and moved on to more contentious issues.
 
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Ryucoo wrote:
I didn’t play it just once. I owned it and traded it away when I found that our group were not enjoying it for the reasons I gave.

We can only judge a game by our experience with it, it’s daft to think otherwise and there is a whole industry based around people experiencing the games for us and providing their subjective opinions.

If the game works for you, great! No need to get rattled with me and call me foolish or shortsighted - there’s every chance those pejoratives could be true of the other side for not noticing the flaws in the game design? Who knows! But I don’t think it’s a useful path to go down.

I’m sorry if you didn’t feel I responded properly to your response, but I’m not really sure you said anything beyond a rather stern telling off about not judging a game by playing it, that needed addressing. I’m glad you had an anecdote about mulliganing your hand (I still think a turn consisting of dumping randomly drawn cards to draw more random cards in hope something useful will show up is indicative of good game design), but let’s assume I nodded politely and moved on to more contentious issues.


My mistake, I thought you had played it only once.

You gave it multiple tries, you didn't like it for the reasons you stated and moved on. That's fine by me.

Many games of this ilk have the stumble-upon-a-powerful-combo problem. It's present in Imperial Settlers, as well as in Race for the Galaxy and Roll for the Galaxy, also in San Juan. I actually like the possibility to dump your hand as this alleviates this problem to a certain degree.
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Ryucoo
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emptyset wrote:
Ryucoo wrote:
I didn’t play it just once. I owned it and traded it away when I found that our group were not enjoying it for the reasons I gave.

We can only judge a game by our experience with it, it’s daft to think otherwise and there is a whole industry based around people experiencing the games for us and providing their subjective opinions.

If the game works for you, great! No need to get rattled with me and call me foolish or shortsighted - there’s every chance those pejoratives could be true of the other side for not noticing the flaws in the game design? Who knows! But I don’t think it’s a useful path to go down.

I’m sorry if you didn’t feel I responded properly to your response, but I’m not really sure you said anything beyond a rather stern telling off about not judging a game by playing it, that needed addressing. I’m glad you had an anecdote about mulliganing your hand (I still think a turn consisting of dumping randomly drawn cards to draw more random cards in hope something useful will show up is indicative of good game design), but let’s assume I nodded politely and moved on to more contentious issues.


My mistake, I thought you had played it only once.

You gave it multiple tries, you didn't like it for the reasons you stated and moved on. That's fine by me.

Many games of this ilk have the stumble-upon-a-powerful-combo problem. It's present in Imperial Settlers, as well as in Race for the Galaxy and Roll for the Galaxy, also in San Juan. I actually like the possibility to dump your hand as this alleviates this problem to a certain degree.


Ta.

I’m cool with the odd powerful combo popping up in games. For me (but obviously not everybody), it felt that in Dues, these combos were substantially more powerful than those I’ve seen in other games - or at least, more powerful than my personal taste would like. And I feel in games like Race, San Juan, it’s bigger brother Puerto Rico and here with Imperial Settlers, those powerful yet surmountable combos felt more earned, like you had to set yourself up for them or built towards them - yet In Deus it felt like they just happened. Doesn’t matter what my gamestate is, I just draw something and boom - I’m a fuck-tonne of points ahead of everybody else, shrugging with slight embarrassment while my opponents force a smile of empty congratulations, disappointed that their dull turn of just discarding their hand didn’t result in a ‘fuck you guys’ card too, instead of yet more cards that just do something they could do already.

Sure, one game like that you could take as a humours anomaly but it happened too frequently and that was a big reason I got shot of it. So my advice, as it was asked, is not to get Dues if you are looking to move forward from Imperial Settlers. Even if I thought it was a good game, I’d still probably say it was a step backwards. It simply didn’t feel any deeper or richer in strategy (quite the opposite) and I imagine what the OP is looking for is something heavier and more advanced.

Apologies if knocking Dues causes offence, but it’s a forum for sharing opinions on games - I’m not attacking any individual and just adding information that is sincere in the hope to aid a good purchasing decision.
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