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Subject: Riverfolk prices? rss

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Mark Turner
United Kingdom
Farnham
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Played riverfolk for the first time tonight, vs eyre and lizards.

It was a fun faction for sure, but after an early points lead, the riverfolk spluttered out and the lizards took the win. (I was quite pleased to see that, actually... my son had been trying so hard with them!)

The main thing that struck me was that setting prices is hard, and needs some negotiation.

Some rounds no one wanted my services, some rounds I undersold (an ambush is worth something good!). I’d be interested in hearing what strategies people employ to determine the best price for your wares.

Cheers!
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Eira Følling
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One of my favorite memories was when one turn my mercenaries were the only thing between the birds and turmoil and I set the price to four, and then the next turn set the price to one just to mock the birds as they had three warriors and three cards in recruit.
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Steven Durst
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Others have said this, but as Riverfolk, you need to be a salesman. Every turn you should be hawking your wares to the other players.

"Hey Eyrie, I have a bird card in my hand that would work perfectly to fufill a decree. You have all those birds sitting around, why not put them to work?"

"Hey Cats, I have a nice juicy Ambush card, only 2 cards, what a steal!"

"Hey why not utilize my river to get around the map easier?"

"I have all these mercenary soldiers that could give you control or the upper hand in this battle, why not buy their services?"

You'll want to base your prices on what people can afford. Probably want to start off cheap to get people used to paying you. Then you can ratchet up the price when they get desperate (or if they get a lead going and you want to cut them off or make it harder to obtain). Also know that the birds and cats (maybe Lizards) are probably your best customer since they have the most warriors but there is still room for a well-timed sale to the WA or Vagabond.

Some factions may be reluctant to give you their warriors and have them tied up for who-knows-how-long so you can promise to spend them back to their owners quickly if you need to get the customers "in the door" so to speak. I like the Riverfolk personally, came 1 turn away from winning last game I played with them.
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Jonathan Rowe
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Default is 2.

Setting cost to 1 benefits the buyer more than you. You might do this to orchestrate some desperate ploy to stop someone else winning early (e.g. using Dominance).

Upping the cost is... aggressive. You want steady buyers and that means they need to like and trust you and factor you into their long term plans. If your prices keep changing, they won't do that.

Of course in the late game you will hunker down and start buying your victory with Dividends. When you do this you hike your prices to the max to make it difficult for others to slip in ahead of you.
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Jonathan Rowe
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Point being, you never need to increase prices past 2 except in response to exceptional circumstances. You don't want one-off payments of 3 or 4 - you want steady turn-after-turn payments for 2.

Maybe you might allow someone to persuade you to hike a price (such as a player attacking the Eyrie begging you to up prices for cards or someone fighting the Lizards asking you to rein in Mercenaries) but you should resist hiking prices yourself for short term gains
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Mark Turner
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deadmarlowe wrote:
Point being, you never need to increase prices past 2 except in response to exceptional circumstances. You don't want one-off payments of 3 or 4 - you want steady turn-after-turn payments for 2.

Maybe you might allow someone to persuade you to hike a price (such as a player attacking the Eyrie begging you to up prices for cards or someone fighting the Lizards asking you to rein in Mercenaries) but you should resist hiking prices yourself for short term gains


In my game, I found that 3 for a card got consistent buyers early on.

I took too long to do the hunker down and get dividends... that moment seems to be crucial.
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Zachary Olson
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The riverfolk in my games took contract kills. Buy something for 4 and tell them who to mess up.


Prices were usually 3 or 4, no one bought in the late game, the prices should probably go down over time.
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Andrés Santiago Pérez-Bergquist
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deadmarlowe wrote:
Point being, you never need to increase prices past 2 except in response to exceptional circumstances. You don't want one-off payments of 3 or 4 - you want steady turn-after-turn payments for 2.


It clearly varies by service. Riverboats doesn't cost you anything, so it's all upside for you if others buy it, and I feel like the price should stay at two most of the time. Cards are a consumable resource, and require you to commit funds to replenish, so depending on what you have and how badly others want it, upping the price makes sense. Mercenaries doesn't cost you anything if it's used only to temporarily rule a clearing, but can cost you greatly if the buyer gets your armies slaughtered in combat, especially likely if they're planning on attacking the Woodland Alliance. Price mercenaries such that you can use the proceeds to recover from the costs it inflicts on you.
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Benjamin Kadish

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Santiago wrote:
deadmarlowe wrote:
Point being, you never need to increase prices past 2 except in response to exceptional circumstances. You don't want one-off payments of 3 or 4 - you want steady turn-after-turn payments for 2.


It clearly varies by service. Riverboats doesn't cost you anything, so it's all upside for you if others buy it, and I feel like the price should stay at two most of the time. Cards are a consumable resource, and require you to commit funds to replenish, so depending on what you have and how badly others want it, upping the price makes sense. Mercenaries doesn't cost you anything if it's used only to temporarily rule a clearing, but can cost you greatly if the buyer gets your armies slaughtered in combat, especially likely if they're planning on attacking the Woodland Alliance. Price mercenaries such that you can use the proceeds to recover from the costs it inflicts on you.


I played river folk in a 5 player game and boats were at 1 the entire game and no one even thought of buying them.

 
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Andrés Santiago Pérez-Bergquist
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Treesrule14 wrote:
I played river folk in a 5 player game and boats were at 1 the entire game and no one even thought of buying them.


Pricing anything at one opens you to getting screwed, since earning one over the course of a turn is worse than earning zero because if you earn zero, you really earn two from Protectionism. You should only price something at one if you’re really sure you’ll be selling something else as well, and wouldn’t be able to sell the cheap thing at two.
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Doug DeMoss
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Santiago wrote:
Treesrule14 wrote:
I played river folk in a 5 player game and boats were at 1 the entire game and no one even thought of buying them.


Pricing anything at one opens you to getting screwed, since earning one over the course of a turn is worse than earning zero because if you earn zero, you really earn two from Protectionism. You should only price something at one if you’re really sure you’ll be selling something else as well, and wouldn’t be able to sell the cheap thing at two.


There is the point that occasionally one of something else is better than two of your own Funds, when you need it to establish a trade post and already have one of the two you need. But for the most part, I agree.
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Mark Watson
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deadmarlowe wrote:
Default is 2.

Setting cost to 1 benefits the buyer more than you. You might do this to orchestrate some desperate ploy to stop someone else winning early (e.g. using Dominance).

Upping the cost is... aggressive. You want steady buyers and that means they need to like and trust you and factor you into their long term plans. If your prices keep changing, they won't do that.

Of course in the late game you will hunker down and start buying your victory with Dividends. When you do this you hike your prices to the max to make it difficult for others to slip in ahead of you.


Assuming you want to buy your win. You can also go for a military victory in which case bleeding the other players of warriors is quite useful (particularly when you use those warriors to field your own).

Setting prices to 2 is a no-brainer early game since it's what you need for a trading post. Mercenaries are probably the most useful service from your perspective since you can directly influence their value - try marching into a sawmill clearing with enough warriors to claim rule and jack up the price for Cat's turn Cards are a bit trickier - few players can resist extra cards for cheap, but you need to be wary of feeding them points or abilities counter to your own interests. You'll usually want these in the mid-range, however you can jack up prices to protect your hand if you draw cards you can use or lower them if you want to clear out your hand or pull in some decent funds. Riverboats largely depend on the board positions; if they're useful (lots of conflict around the river, or allow one player to bypass another's defences) raise the price, if not lower it. Generally I wouldn't go lower than 2 or higher than 4 unless there's a good reason to.
 
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