Recommend
6 
 Thumb up
 Hide
29 Posts
1 , 2  Next »   | 

BoardGameGeek» Forums » Gaming Related » General Gaming

Subject: GMT pre-orders from overseas rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: p500 [+] preorder [+] gmt [+] shipping [+] customs [+] [View All]
Adam Knight
New Zealand
Titirangi
Auckland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Has anyone outside the US made many GMT (or any other company's) pre-orders? There are a heap of games on P500 that I'd like to get: PQ-17: Arctic Naval Operations 1941-1943, 1805: Sea of Glory, Asia Engulfed, and Combat Commander: Mediterranean amongst them. What I'm worried about though, is them all being ready at different times, and ending up paying a fortune shipping them separately.

Is there any way to get these companies to batch up your orders, so you can ship P500 items together? I would really like to support the P500 effort and get more games published, but shipping individually can easily cost as much again as the game itself.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian Morris
United States
Raytown
Missouri
flag msg tools
2nd, 6th and 7th Wisconsin, 19th Indiana, 24th Michigan
badge
24th Michigan Monument Gettysburg Pa
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The problem is all these games you mention are going to be released widely apart in terms of time. For example Asia Engulfed is about to ship in a few weeks and Combat Commander Mediterranean sometime this fall. Meanwhile PQ-17 and 1805 won't be out until sometime in 2008.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Philip Thomas
United Kingdom
London
London
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I have made pre-orders from GMT from the UK. I made no attempt to batch them though.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Adam Knight
New Zealand
Titirangi
Auckland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Quote:
The problem is all these games you mention are going to be released widely apart in terms of time.


Oh. blush That won't help at all then. I might be better waiting until they are released, and I can get a bunch of games together.

Thanks for your replies.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Roberto Silva
Italy
CARPI (MO)
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
In my opinion you have not taken an account the difference in prices from the P500 version to the normal retail version.

Try this one by yourself:

choose a medium game for example ... $65 RETAIL PRICE, $45 P500 PRICE.
After select the appropriate AIR SHIPMENT for your destination.

For me that I live in Europe the shipment costs are $16 so the total will be $61 ... lower that the retail price and already including shipment!

For you the shipment costs are $21 so the total will be $66 ... yes, 1$ dollar more than the retail price but we already taken in account the shipment costs!
I don't think that if you consolidate many games in a single shipment at the end you'll pay a shipment cost lower less than $1 for every game, so it should be cheaper to to use P500.
Few of considerations more:

1) you won't pay a big large amount of money once because the P500 are published in many months
2) you'll have the games a lot before than waiting for the last one to be published.
3) For my country (maybe it is the same in your) if you receive a package with an high currency value for sure you'll pay the VERY EXPENSIVE (for us) import fees that, in my country, are calculated over the sum of the game + the shipment costs (!!); but if the value is low (like $45) many times you don't pay anything as import fees because the costs for the custom operations are superior to the income.

Roberto
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Richard Dewsbery
United Kingdom
Sutton Coldfield
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I agree with Roberto - GMT's shipping prices are very reasonable, which makes buying a single game economically viable for me.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Diz Hooper
Japan
Osaka
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb


I'll add another vote for pre-ordering. The pre-order prices are similar to what you'll find at online discount retailers. However, the shipping options from GMT are a lot cheaper than what online retailers are offering for some reason. Perhaps GMT is absorbing some of the shipping expenses for overseas pre-order customers. Of course that's just speculation.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Adam Knight
New Zealand
Titirangi
Auckland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thanks Guys, you've convinced me. I'll place a bunch of pre-orders. There are 9 games I want from them in the P500! It will be nice not to have to pay for them all at the same time, as you say Roberto.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gordon Watson
United Kingdom
Banstead
Surrey - United Kingdom
flag msg tools
ASL - other tactical wargames call it Sir.
badge
Beneath this mask there is an idea.....and ideas are bulletproof.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
You do also need to be careful about possibly incurring import duties etc. I'm not sure what rules are in place in NZ (I'm not completely sure for the UK either) but some of the more expensive games may trigger the possibility of import duty.

Until recently GMT seemed to have marked games I had pre-ordered as contents value $10 and I was never charged - however they have changed their shipper recently and the actual sale value is now stated, which will push it close to the UK threshold. Due to this I have stopped pre-ordering. In the UK you can potentially be charged VAT for items over £18 (approx $35), import duty if the amount of the duty would exceed £7 (I don't know what the duty rate is for boardgames - may even be 0%) and a handling fee by the Post-office for having to charge you the above.

This is a bit frustrating as I did like supporting the P500 program.

It might be a good idea for GMT to look at potentially grouping overseas pre-orders that are around the same time into consolidated shipments - however this may make it more likely for import duties to be incurred.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Adam Knight
New Zealand
Titirangi
Auckland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
We're pretty lucky here with that. Board games have no duty on them, but incur GST (VAT to you, or sales tax to others) when the total value is above $400NZ. Which I recently found out to my cost
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Niko Ruf
Germany
Schönaich
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
domus_ludorum wrote:
Until recently GMT seemed to have marked games I had pre-ordered as contents value $10 and I was never charged - however they have changed their shipper recently and the actual sale value is now stated, which will push it close to the UK threshold. Due to this I have stopped pre-ordering.


You could preorder GMT games via their German partner, Udo Grebe Gamedesign: http://www.ugg.de/

Of course, that doesn't help Adam much as he's not from the EU.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tim Franklin
United Kingdom
Braintree
Essex
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
domus_ludorum wrote:

Until recently GMT seemed to have marked games I had pre-ordered as contents value $10 and I was never charged - however they have changed their shipper recently and the actual sale value is now stated, which will push it close to the UK threshold. Due to this I have stopped pre-ordering. In the UK you can potentially be charged VAT for items over £18 (approx $35), import duty if the amount of the duty would exceed £7 (I don't know what the duty rate is for boardgames - may even be 0%) and a handling fee by the Post-office for having to charge you the above.


I haven't - yet - been hit, and I've had a couple of packages from GMT since they started honest labling.

I've also had a package from Deep Thought Games correctly labelled at something like $110 (inc. shipping) come through untouched. Maybe someone in Customs likes board-gamers?

Aside: how is the huge tax on shipping justified? Surely that's a service I've purchased in another country that's been supplied in another country (or at least, most of it has)?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Niko Ruf
Germany
Schönaich
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
tim-pelican wrote:
Aside: how is the huge tax on shipping justified?


The main justification for taxes seems to be that governments need money*. Also, you have to pay for the privilege of having customs inspectors look at your order and charge you import duties.

* Case in point: Germany still has a special tax on sparkling wine that was originally introduced by the German Empire prior to WWI - to finance the navy. I'm quite sure the money is no longer used to challenge British naval superiority, but that doesn't stop the state from collecting it.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Philip Thomas
United Kingdom
London
London
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It isn't a tax on shipping, it is an import duty. The right of governments to tax goods entering and leaving their jurisdiction is very ancient indeed...
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tim Franklin
United Kingdom
Braintree
Essex
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Philip Thomas wrote:
It isn't a tax on shipping, it is an import duty. The right of governments to tax goods entering and leaving their jurisdiction is very ancient indeed...


I think you're missing my point - that they charge you on the value of the goods plus the value of the shipping. If I went to the USA and brought a GMT game back, I would pay less import duty than if GMT post it to me. This is nonsensical. (Actually, if I went to the USA I believe I'd have a greater threshold that I could bring back before paying any duty at all, which is even more nonsensical, but I digress.)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Philip Thomas
United Kingdom
London
London
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Yes, I was missing your point. I guess they charge on the full price for simplicity. One could also note that otherwise nobody gets to collect tax on the shipping, which probably doesn't bother you...
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gordon Watson
United Kingdom
Banstead
Surrey - United Kingdom
flag msg tools
ASL - other tactical wargames call it Sir.
badge
Beneath this mask there is an idea.....and ideas are bulletproof.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It does seem to be a bit hit or miss as to whether we get charged in the UK or not.

I will check out the Udo Grebe link - I knew GMT offer a similar service to US customers for UG games - I hadn't thought about it the other way round. Do you still get the same pre-order discount, and does your order count against the pre-order numbers?

Has anyone else from the UK used UG for pre-ordering english editions of GMT games?

Sorry for taking your post slightly off topic Adam.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Adam Knight
New Zealand
Titirangi
Auckland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
domus_ludorum wrote:
Sorry for taking your post slightly off topic Adam.


No worries. That's amazing that they charge you tax/duty on a service that occurred overseas. Fortunately NZ Customs don't seem to. Gee, I hope they're not reading this

EDIT: Well, the Customs guy I paid said he wouldn't, but looking at the numbers it seems he did after all. I should have used a calculator at the time!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Colin Hunter
New Zealand
Auckland
flag msg tools
badge
To approach the Other in conversation is to welcome his expression, in which at each instant he overflows the idea a thought would carry away from it. It is therefore to receive from the Other beyond the capacity of the I...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
yep they don't send them all at once, you need to watch your GMT pre orders like a hawk, they make mistakes frequently. So watch to see when they are charging and make sure you are charged. Also make sure you get some kind of confirmation of your pre order. I've placed several preorders, but none worked off the web, I had to call them direct, which was a pain in the neck.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stephen Groves
New Zealand
Auckland
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
From what I've read there is no duty is calculated on board games but GST is applied to the goods and postage combined. The less than $400 appears correct as GST is 12.5% and they state "No revenue collection will be made if the total amount owing on the goods imported is less than $50".

Out of curiousity Adam, how much was the order that got stung by customs and who did you order off. It is my impression good packaging with all the official documentation has a much better chance of clearing without hassle, even if it does slightly exceed the $50.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Adam Knight
New Zealand
Titirangi
Auckland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
A friend and I went in together and made a $360US order with Boards and Bits. Tom always fills out the customs declaration correctly, which was a saving grace in this case. The package weighed 10kg, so if it showed a value of $10 we'd have had it seized. As it was, a payment of $75NZ got the parcel released and delivered the next day.

Just looking at this amount, it seems they did charge us GST on shipping as well - 12.5% of $460 is $60, but if you add postage into the total it's correct. Ouch!

This parcel was just too far over the $400NZ limit to be ignored ($460NZ) so we got pinged. In hindsight getting that many games together was asking for trouble, but I have since had a $300US order come through without fuss - slightly over the $400NZ limit.

Just reading this again, maybe I should check myself into Gamer's Anonymous?

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stephen Groves
New Zealand
Auckland
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I think you were unlucky (we should play a game some time - Diamant? ). My last 2 orders were $435 and $475 and I got away with it but your post will stop me from pushing my luck. This damn hike in US postage prices makes it tricky.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Niko Ruf
Germany
Schönaich
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
domus_ludorum wrote:
I will check out the Udo Grebe link - I knew GMT offer a similar service to US customers for UG games - I hadn't thought about it the other way round. Do you still get the same pre-order discount, and does your order count against the pre-order numbers?


You get a 20% preorder discount on the price set by UGG. I don't know what their policy is for converting $ to Euros, so you might end up paying a different amount than you would pay to GMT. Best check in each case whether it's worthwhile.

The offers are clearly marked as belonging to the GMT P500 program, so I'd be very suprised if they didn't count towards the preorder total. I'm just not sure how often they actually report new preorders to GMT.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Niko Ruf
Germany
Schönaich
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jvdv wrote:
1. When games are shipped to me (in Holland) by USPS, I don't get import taxes. If UPS is the carrier, I do. So I only buy from stores that use USPS. With their Priority Mail International service I get my order in six days from the moment I receive the order confirmation.


Unfortunately, it works differently in Germany, where USPS parcels also have to go through customs. I would also be careful with UPS. There recently was a complaint in the MMP folder at Consimworld that UPS had charged French customers a hefty fee (on top of taxes) for getting their order through customs.

Quote:
2. The calculation presented earlier that a game is actually cheaper P500 including shipping than the retail price excluding shipping, is of course correct. If you are using the GMT retail price, which is a recommended retail price.


With the German online retailers I use, I usually pay an amount equal to MSRP in Euros instead of $. Preordering directly from GMT costs about the same.

I have yet to find a store that is cheaper when you take shipping and taxes into account. E.g., the one time I looked at ordering from Thoughthammer, they quoted me 50$ shipping for a 50$ game.

Quote:
Example: Twilight Struggle is $57 at GMT, and $37,05 at Troll and Toad (both excluding shipping costs).


How much is shipping to Europe at T&T? GMT has relatively low shipping costs. I suppose they can afford it as their margin on direct sales is much higher than via a distributor.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jérôme
Netherlands
Eindhoven
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jvdv wrote:
1. When games are shipped to me (in The Netherlands) by USPS, I don't get import taxes.


Don't count on it: I got taxed the last three times, twice GMT (by boat) and once Simmonsgames (by air). All were shipped by USPS.
Customs pick out packages randomly, so you just got lucky. I got lucky only once, the first time GMT sent me a game.



EDIT: Obviously I don't live in Holland but in another part of The Netherlands.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.