Pontifex Maximus
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"‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens"


Quote:
THOUSAND OAKS, Calif. — At least 11 bar patrons and a sheriff’s deputy were killed late Wednesday in a shooting at a country and western dance hall in Thousand Oaks, Calif., that was holding an event for college students, officials said.

The gunman is dead, officials said early Thursday, adding that there was no longer a threat to those at the bar, which had been filled with about 100 people at the time of the attack.

The Ventura County sheriff, Geoff Dean, said there were “multiple other victims of different levels of injuries.” His voice cracking, he identified the slain sheriff’s deputy as Ron Helus. When other law enforcement officers arrived at the scene of the shooting, he added, the suspect had already died.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/08/us/shooting-california-th...

Bolded part indicates the falsehood regarding the "good guy with a gun" theory about prevention. The police officer knew there was a shooting going on, yet still perished.

How long will we be allowing this to happen?
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Leo Zappa
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“If only cops were armed...”
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Rich Shipley
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Kumitedad wrote:
How long will we be allowing this to happen?


How long before it becomes our national sport?
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Dickie Crickets
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Don’t worry; I have a feeling that this particular massacre will be tbe last straw.
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Josh
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It was a cowboy bar. Where were the six shooters?
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Eric Tama
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JPotter - Bits77
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What is it shooters have against country music?

What song was on the jukebox, or was there a live band?

From the article:

“It’s safe. It’s a safe place to be,” said Erika Sigman, a sophomore at Cal State Channel Island. “You can stay out all night at Borderline because there’s major security.”



John, was born in Ventura
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Matt Brown
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Some people there were at the Vegas shooting.
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Wendell
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In addition to the cop who was killed when he (bravely) went in, the first victim was a security guard.

But apart from ruining the lives of those who loved the victims, this'll change nothing. Because, freedom.
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Mac Mcleod
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Shadrach wrote:
It was a cowboy bar. Where were the six shooters?


No but there was a group of brave man who stood as human shields for those escaping through the windows. One of the survivors is calling them true heroes and I agree.

The deputy is reported to have been shot multiple times on Entry to the building so I'm expecting this is going to be a semi-automatic weapon, probably an AR-15.

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mortego
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rshipley wrote:
Kumitedad wrote:
How long will we be allowing this to happen?


How long before it becomes our national sport?


How much longer until the government declares a "Purge" day?
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Jeff Saxton
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And once again, it'll all just boil down to "thoughts and prayers", thoughts and prayers. Sorry you're all dead, but at least we said a prayer ...
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maxo-texas wrote:
The deputy is reported to have been shot multiple times on Entry to the building so I'm expecting this is going to be a semi-automatic weapon, probably an AR-15.
The article indicates a witness saying he had a "big handgun". But, you're probably right a semi-automatic.
 
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Trey Chambers
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If only the bar had three more cops present and every patron was armed to the teeth, this wouldn't have happened!
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rico
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maxo-texas wrote:
Shadrach wrote:
It was a cowboy bar. Where were the six shooters?

The deputy is reported to have been shot multiple times on Entry to the building so I'm expecting this is going to be a semi-automatic weapon, probably an AR-15.


The internet says it was a (legally purchased) handgun - Glock .45
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Mac Mcleod
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spoon wrote:
maxo-texas wrote:
Shadrach wrote:
It was a cowboy bar. Where were the six shooters?

The deputy is reported to have been shot multiple times on Entry to the building so I'm expecting this is going to be a semi-automatic weapon, probably an AR-15.


The internet says it was a (legally purchased) handgun - Glock .45


Ah. That probably explains the relatively low kill number. Smaller magazine. With a larger magazine there would have been deaths closer to the other club shooting.
 
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eaglebeak wrote:
Don’t worry; I have a feeling that this particular massacre will be tbe last straw.
Yeah, If Sandy Hook didn't do it, it will take someone's kid in the upper power structure of the oligarchy to get killed before anything moves on this. Crazy people with guns is a part of the American dream for the foreseeable future.
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Jeff Saxton
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The real fix for this kind of problem is that when you go to a bar and pay your cover charge, they issue you a handgun from their fully stocked rack of weapons. That way, everyone will be able to respond in kind when a shooter tries to muscle their way inside.
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mortego
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I don't own a gun.

I don't want to own a gun.

I know that a gun without a human controlling it couldn't kill anyone.

I believe that purchasing a gun should be the hardest thing to buy, ever.

If I could have it my way I wish for a world void of guns.

As for the argument that people can get guns any way so why have gun control laws, I say the same thing about abortion, why have laws against abortion when people are going to have them any way?

I have many friends who own guns, they collectively groan when a mass shooting is reported, they feel the heat by people's anger from these shootings and pretty much wish they wouldn't happen...
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J.D. Hall
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I just am so proud and happy I live in a country where lunatics have easy access to killing machines and the freedom to enter public places to slaughter strangers.

The local cops are in for some heat, by the way. Evidently, local cops were called to this guy's house in April where he exhibited behavior that was erratic and irate. As the shooter is a former Marine who might have issues such as PTSD, it might have behooved the cops to call for some counseling and a 72-hour stay at the local mental health facility. But naw, too much paperwork.
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Rachel Simmons
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killerjoe1962 wrote:
I have many friends who own guns, they collectively groan when a mass shooting is reported, they feel the heat by people's anger from these shootings and pretty much wish they wouldn't happen...

Well, that’s good, I guess. Really restores my faith in gun owners.
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Pontifex Maximus
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matthean wrote:
Some people there were at the Vegas shooting.


That manages to make this even more horrific. But that was bound to happen. Won’t be the last time either.
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I feel uncomfotable with conspiracy theories, and try to be aware of them.

The problem is that some theories are true.

So, fully cognizant of how this sounds like a poorly written spy novel, I would like to put forward to the forum an odd alignment of facts.

I think most of us were surprised to learn that the NRA was receiving substantial donations from the oligarchy, some for chaneling to the Trump campaign, some for their their own use. Apparently, this has been going on for several years.

The set of possible motives for enriching the pro-gun lobby is small. Now, I'm quite suspicious that in the viewpoint of the leaders of the Russian Federation, ridiculous numbers of weapons flooding our country is a useful disruptive force.

This could explain the constant drum beat of "They want to take away our guns!" whenever a Democrat is elected. The Russian leadership is making sure we have more weapons than we could hope to control. Also, it will be interesting during the upcoming trials to learn when and in what amounts these enemies of our society sent aid to their cat's paws. Was there a bump after Sandy Hook, after Virginia Tech, after Parkland, after Pittsberg? Is this why the gun lobby can consistently outspend the control advocates?

Otherwise, just what is the Russian motivation? Deep discounts on rental cars and hotel rooms?

OK, taking off my tinfoil hat, and...

Damn. The Russians are still real, still attacking our society.

If you want to argue that the Russian influence payments were totally innocent, well then... *offers his hat* You need this more than I do.
 
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Cris Whetstone
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I think if there is a goal with the Russian influence it is more along the lines with supporting extremist, divisive rhetoric than actually buying guns. Though that is a side effect they wouldn't be unhappy about.

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Dickie Crickets
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TheChin! wrote:
eaglebeak wrote:
Don’t worry; I have a feeling that this particular massacre will be tbe last straw.
Yeah, If Sandy Hook didn't do it, it will take someone's kid in the upper power structure of the oligarchy to get killed before anything moves on this. Crazy people with guns is a part of the American dream for the foreseeable future.


Or perhaps we can start dumping all of the bodies on Trump's favorite golf courses.
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