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Isle of Skye: From Chieftain to King» Forums » Rules

Subject: 5 mountains or 3?? rss

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Rich Charters
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Ignore the top 4 tiles of this image. Are there 3 mountain ranges or 5??

This is potentially a duplicate post....if it is, it will be deleted.
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Jonathan Chaffer
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I see 5. The rivers feeding the lake in the central tile mean that there are 5 distinct areas on the tile, with plains to the north, water in the middle, and three separate mountains on the east, south, and west.
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James Ataei
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Ignoring the 4 tiles at the top, there are 3 complete mountain areas and 1 incomplete mountain area. The largest mountain range is 5 tiles. There are no “rivers” in Isle of Skye (yet whistle ) it’s just some nice art detail.
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Korric Morgan
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There are 3. On the 5 lower tiles, the mountains are all connected as a single mountain range.
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korric2000 wrote:
There are 3. On the 5 lower tiles, the mountains are all connected as a single mountain range.
I agree there are 3.
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David Combs
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It's 3. The rules for the promo set that the tile with the horseshoe shaped mountain comes from, gives an example that indicates that the tile has one mountain area.
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Gillum the Stoor
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See this post: Re: Features: Connected and Single time completed features

One of the designers stated, "if two adjacent borders of a tile show the same terrain, they are always connected."
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Jonathan Chaffer
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gillum wrote:
"if two adjacent borders of a tile show the same terrain, they are always connected."
That's very helpful! And an unfortunate art design decision, because they definitely appear to be separated by water. Oh well.
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Rich Charters
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JonBob wrote:
...an unfortunate art design decision, because they definitely appear to be separated by water. Oh well.
I agree. It's pretty clear that the artist mean to separate those mountains ---- just like the castles are separated in Carcassonne. It would be 99% clearer if the water didn't go down to a point that close to the corner.

I'm temped to get a brown magic marker and coloring over those points of the lake. The only thing stopping me is that it seems this decision could easily be reversed!
 
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richcharters wrote:
It seems this decision could easily be reversed!
Why do you think that?

The ruling was made the year the game came out and has stood in the 3+ years since then.

Have there been other cases in which the designers have waffled on the rules over the years? (I have not been paying that much attention, but I wasn't aware that things had been sliding around.)
 
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James Ataei
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richcharters wrote:
JonBob wrote:
...an unfortunate art design decision, because they definitely appear to be separated by water. Oh well.
I agree. It's pretty clear that the artist mean to separate those mountains ---- just like the castles are separated in Carcassonne. It would be 99% clearer if the water didn't go down to a point that close to the corner.

I'm temped to get a brown magic marker and coloring over those points of the lake. The only thing stopping me is that it seems this decision could easily be reversed!
No, not really. This ruling is pretty clear cut, if I was going to complain about a ruling, it would be the scroll that is “on the water” instead of being on the mountain with 1vp/broch.
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Rich Charters
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gillum wrote:
richcharters wrote:
It seems this decision could easily be reversed!
Why do you think that?
It has nothing to do with a trend of reversals. It's just when a ruling is in direct conflict with the art on their game, it seems like it could/should be reversed.

I'm no artist (as you will notice when you look at the drawings below), but even I could draw a tile with no ambiguity....see below.




Thoughts??
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Pat Connolly
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richcharters wrote:
gillum wrote:
richcharters wrote:
It seems this decision could easily be reversed!
Why do you think that?
It has nothing to do with a trend of reversals. It's just when a ruling is in direct conflict with the art on their game, it seems like it could/should be reversed.

I'm no artist (as you will notice when you look at the drawings below), but even I could draw a tile with no ambiguity....see below.




Thoughts??
I concur with your comment about the artwork. While this thread is concentrating on mountain regions, the same argument applies to any other type of terrain. (I don't have my copy handy so I don't know if this crops up with other terrains.) If the interior edges of any terrain go to a point at the corner of a tile, then that SHOULD indicate the edge of the terrain. If that happens on two adjacent sides of a tile, then I would interpret that as a valley or fjord (or a pass or strait) between 2 mountain regions.
 
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gillum wrote:
See this post: Re: Features: Connected and Single time completed features

One of the designers stated, "if two adjacent borders of a tile show the same terrain, they are always connected."
What?? So in the row of 4 horizontal tiles (2 of which depict boats) all of the grass/plains are connected??
 
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Jonathan Chaffer
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squash wrote:
gillum wrote:
See this post: Re: Features: Connected and Single time completed features

One of the designers stated, "if two adjacent borders of a tile show the same terrain, they are always connected."
What?? So in the row of 4 horizontal tiles (2 of which depict boats) all of the grass/plains are connected??
No, the quote is saying that two adjacent borders of the same tile are considered connected iff they have the same terrain.
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Pat Connolly
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I just got home and pulled out the game and checked all the tiles.


There are 7 tiles with mountains on three edges. There is absolutely no way that these can be thought of as parts of separate mountain ranges since the corners are fully mountainous, with no hint of another terrain sneaking into the corner.

There are 10 tiles with mountains on just two adjacent edges. These are also quite clearly parts of the same mountain range since the corners are fully mountainous.

There is 1 tile that has just two adjacent mountain edges and maybe the slightest possibility that these are not connected. But not really if you look even a little closely at the corner. It's the tile with 2 adjacent mountain and 2 adjacent grass edges, with a squarish pond in the middle, a bridge road connecting opposite edges and a farm in the grass part.

Neither were any of the other tiles were at all ambiguous when adjacent edges had the same terrain type.

I can only surmise that the photo from the original post was from an earlier edition (mine is from Mayfair Games) and that the designers addressed the problem by adjusting the artwork in the manner suggested by Rich Charters.
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Rich Charters
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It wasn't my copy, but I do know he had all the expansions.

Did you have the tile shown in the photo above?
 
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Ryan Feathers
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The problematic tile pictured above is from an expansion. (I don't know what one to be honest, I just know that VP barrel tiles are expansion elements not found in the base game).

I agree that the artwork on that tile is a bit problematic.

However for me personally I would've thought the ruling here fairly intuitive. But that's because I've always worked off the implicit "rule" that if any two adjacent edges of a single tile share the same terrain type than they are considered part of the same region.

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Isle of Skye: From Chieftain to King – Tunnelplättchen
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Dean Jones
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Tunnel Expansion Rules

This shows an example of how mountains work with tiles like this.

There are three ranges in the original photo.
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Rich Charters
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Ranior wrote:
I've always worked off the implicit "rule" that if any two adjacent edges of a single tile share the same terrain type than they are considered part of the same region.
How about in Carc? 3-sides share the same terrain type (city), but it's clear to me that there are 2 city areas, not one. It's that wedge of grass to the corner that separates the two areas. Isle of Skye should be the same IMO.


Well I've beat this topic into the ground.
But thanks for the exchange.
 
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Cube1701 wrote:
Tunnel Expansion Rules

This shows an example of how mountains work with tiles like this.

There are three ranges in the original photo.
Right. The example makes explicit that the three mountain sides in that one tile (the one with the two barrels) are part of a single mountain range.
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Ryan Feathers
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richcharters wrote:
Ranior wrote:
I've always worked off the implicit "rule" that if any two adjacent edges of a single tile share the same terrain type than they are considered part of the same region.
How about in Carc? 3-sides share the same terrain type (city), but it's clear to me that there are 2 city areas, not one. It's that wedge of grass to the corner that separates the two areas. Isle of Skye should be the same IMO.


Well I've beat this topic into the ground.
But thanks for the exchange.
Well that's a different game with it's own differences. In Carc, as I believe the rules make clear, tiles can have regions separated in the corner of the tiles and so you need to get used to that.

In IoS however there are not tiles like that. Every tile in the game follows the "rule" I laid out above.

Finally however it doesn't seem to matter much as others have correctly pointed out the rulebook for the expansion tiles helps to explain this. Overall I still completely agree the art could be clearer and probably should be, but I don't think the actual rule should be in any doubt given the rulebook and how IoS tiles follow the same "rule" I laid out.
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