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Zombicide: Black Plague» Forums » General

Subject: Split Fixing Rule rss

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Guillaume Gleize
France
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Hello all!

In the big mess of the splitting rules, some players like us just discover after a few years of zombicide that they were wrong!
LOL But because we had fun and were balanced playing the scenarios --> We decided to create a house rule to keep on playing the way we always did:

Imagine 2 zones with survivors (S) and equal noise with no LOS and 1 runner (1) somewhere between them
(the exact middle is not important because the distance never count in the choice of the target):

SOOO1OOOS

First move of the Runners (split because 2 equal noises)

SOO1O1OOS (now we have 2 runners)

Second move of the Runners (split again because still 2 equal noises)

SO1O2O1OS (now we have 4 runners) This is the OFFICIAL RULE

(My God imagine with the Wolves: 1 would become 6 etc.)

But we always played it this way (after the two actions):

SO1OOO1OS (so finishing with 2 Runners)

So we were playing a house rule without knowing it (lol) going:

THE ZOMBIES WITH SEVERAL ACTIONS DO NOT SPLIT AGAIN AFTER THE INITIAL SPLIT AND DURING THEIR MOVEMENT IF THE TARGET SITUATION DIDN'T CHANGE!

To be said - Believe me: We do love hard scenarios and hate winning easily so we create house scenarios that make us swear and die even with this house rule!

The only point is spending time having fun winning or dying but not wasting time splitting tons of zombies while catching headaches after hard days at work!


 
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Max Maloney
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"If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason." -Jack Handey
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GGleize wrote:
Imagine 2 zones with survivors (S) and equal noise with no LOS and 1 runner (1) somewhere between them

Note that the presence of survivors is irrelevant in your example. A zombie with no LOS to a survivor cares only about the noisiest zone, whether it has survivors or not. No other factor is considered. Just in case you were doing this part wrong as well.
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Nathan Stiles
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Brandon
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GGleize wrote:

SOO1O1OOS (now we have 2 runners)
Second move of the Runners (split again because still 2 equal noises)

SO1O2O1OS (now we have 4 runners) This is the OFFICIAL RULE


Not the official rules-- it's not just equal noise, but equal distance route (pg. 23). Since the runners moved, there is a shortest route to one of the zones tied for the most noise-- they will just move in that direction.

SO1OOO1OS
(this is assuming no Survivors are in LOS, and the straight line is just for convenience of drawing)

edit: I found the online FAQ that says differently.
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SaintHax wrote:
Not the official rules-- it's not just equal noise, but equal distance route (pg. 23).


Nope. As silly as it may seem, OP is correct. Zombies take the shortest path to each target zone.

In the original example, the runner caught between two equally noisy zones will split. There are two target zones each in different directions... Hence, the split.

After the runners have taken their first action, target zones need to be reevaluated. There are still two target zones that each runner wants to reach. The two runners will each split.

TIL noise management does matter.
 
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Nick
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I'm so glad I'm not using this crappy rule
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kakuuuu wrote:
I'm so glad I'm not using this crappy rule


I like the rule. I don't think it's stupid or crappy or dumb. It forces players to be aware of what is going on on the map: where survivors are located,
where noise is being produced, where splits can occur.

It adds a bit more strategy to a game heavily dependent on luck. The best way to avoid splitting is better noise management.
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Frank Hoffmann
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The split rule becomes even more annoying in Green Horde. I am glad they fixed the rule in Invaders. It makes the game smoother.
 
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Jim P
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kakuuuu wrote:
I'm so glad I'm not using this crappy rule


Do you mean the official rule? or the OP's rule?
 
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Guillaume Gleize
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Dormammu wrote:
GGleize wrote:
Imagine 2 zones with survivors (S) and equal noise with no LOS and 1 runner (1) somewhere between them

Note that the presence of survivors is irrelevant in your example. A zombie with no LOS to a survivor cares only about the noisiest zone, whether it has survivors or not. No other factor is considered. Just in case you were doing this part wrong as well.


Agree for sure!

By the way: If some zombies have a LOS on 2 survivors in one direction and 3 noises alone (with no survivors) in the other (they "see" the 3 noises) > Were are they going for you?
 
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Guillaume Gleize
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SaintHax wrote:
GGleize wrote:

SOO1O1OOS (now we have 2 runners)
Second move of the Runners (split again because still 2 equal noises)

SO1O2O1OS (now we have 4 runners) This is the OFFICIAL RULE


Not the official rules-- it's not just equal noise, but equal distance route (pg. 23). Since the runners moved, there is a shortest route to one of the zones tied for the most noise-- they will just move in that direction.

SO1OOO1OS
(this is assuming no Survivors are in LOS, and the straight line is just for convenience of drawing)


Sorry but this is official: In case of split because same noises on several targets > They split and re-split and re-split again if they have several activations (runners & wolves etc.)

But (as said at start) here we just prefer our house rule to only split ONCE if the situation do not change during their moves.

This last rule is NOT official > It's just our own house rule!

 
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Nick
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Mightyjim wrote:
kakuuuu wrote:
I'm so glad I'm not using this crappy rule


Do you mean the official rule? or the OP's rule?


The official one. Games are already long enough, and adding this split management adds up to game time. And it's maths hell!
And really not thematic at all.

At the origin, the split rule was there to not favour one path over one another. In those cases, we just roll a dice to see where the group of zombies will go, and we don't think it further.
 
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Jim P
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waxbottle wrote:
The best way to avoid splitting is better noise management.


This
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Nathan Stiles
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GGleize wrote:
SaintHax wrote:
GGleize wrote:

SOO1O1OOS (now we have 2 runners)
Second move of the Runners (split again because still 2 equal noises)

SO1O2O1OS (now we have 4 runners) This is the OFFICIAL RULE


Not the official rules-- it's not just equal noise, but equal distance route (pg. 23). Since the runners moved, there is a shortest route to one of the zones tied for the most noise-- they will just move in that direction.

SO1OOO1OS
(this is assuming no Survivors are in LOS, and the straight line is just for convenience of drawing)


Sorry but this is official: In case of split because same noises on several targets > They split and re-split and re-split again if they have several activations (runners & wolves etc.)


That rule didn't see print until Green Horde, but I see it's in our BGG FAQ. Honestly though-- can you really play this game w/o house ruling "best intention". We could start a whole new thread of RAW abuses and wtf's.
 
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You're incorrect. Those rules were part of Black Plague. If you search the forums for "zombie movement" you'll find threads where users have asked and answered this question. Don't know if Clipper still hangs around the forums, but he's probably the best at explaining zombie movement in BP. GH uses the same rules.
 
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Nathan Stiles
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waxbottle wrote:
SaintHax wrote:
That rule didn't see print until Green Horde, but I see it's in our BGG FAQ.

You're incorrect. Those rules were part of Black Plague. If you search the forums for "zombie movement" you'll find threads where users have asked and answered this question. Don't know if Clipper still hangs around the forums, but he's probably the best at explaining zombie movement in BP. GH uses the same rules.


I'm correct-- you may want to re-read what I wrote. Then check pg. 23 of the Black Plague rule book (or digital copy that includes the FAQ posted under Files on here) and see what sentence has been added to the Green Horde rule book.

Clipper does still hang out on here, but unless he's going to produce an image of what was printed, it is not germane to what I wrote.
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Maybe I did misread what you wrote. It sounds like you don't agree with OP's interpretation of the rules for zombie movement (which are correct).
 
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Alexander
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funny, I also played it the way the op described
how stupid is the official rule?! seriously, I never played this way.

at some point we actually decided to never split at all and simply roll a die to determine direction. simplest solution imo.
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Jim P
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LX1986 wrote:
funny, I also played it the way the op described
how stupid is the official rule?! seriously, I never played this way.

at some point we actually decided to never split at all and simply roll a die to determine direction. simplest solution imo.


If you want to make it really simple, don't bother setting up the map. Just roll a dice: 1-3 you won, 4-6 you lost.
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LX1986 wrote:
how stupid is the official rule?! seriously, I never played this way.


Do you mean unthematic? I don't think the rule is stupid. I prefer being able to make decisions in a game. If I reduce zombie movement down to a dice roll, then there are less decisions that I am making.

When played according to the rules as written, zombie splits only occur if I am not managing noise well or because I want it to happen.

LX1986 wrote:
at some point we actually decided to never split at all and simply roll a die to determine direction. simplest solution imo.


I actually find it easier just to add a miniature than to have to take the time to roll a die to determine movement. By not adding a miniature to the map when a split occurs, you are also making the game easier as there is less of a chance for extra activations to occur.

You're free to disagree with all of this, but by not playing RaW you are making the game easier, making the decision space even smaller than it already is, and introducing even more randomness in an already random game. But the thing with Zombicide is that you can play it however you like.
 
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Nick
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waxbottle wrote:


LX1986 wrote:
at some point we actually decided to never split at all and simply roll a die to determine direction. simplest solution imo.


I actually find it easier just to add a miniature than to have to take the time to roll a die to determine movement...


... and optimize each turn of the game exactly how many noise each survivor is making. That definitely takes more time.

It's true that the game becomes easier, but I'm sorry : the original splitting rules is so silly that it needs to be changed anyway. Turning 1 miniature into 4 is an aberration for me.
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Keeping track of noise is not difficult or very time consuming.

On maps where splits abound (and especially in Green Horde), it can be much more tedious to roll a die for each split.

Quote:
the original splitting rules is so silly that it needs to be changed anyway. Turning 1 miniature into 4 is an aberration for me.


To say that a rule needs to be changed just because you don't like it is silly.
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Nick
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That's why I said I was sorry to say it, but I'm not sorry to think it

When I meant calculating noise, I meant optimizing noise, my bad. And that, can be very tedious if you don't want to double/triple/quadruple some group of zombies.
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Mr Suitcase
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If you think this is tedious, try doing the splitting rules correctly on the Green Horde scenarios. Yeah - hedges. Great idea.
 
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mrsuitcase wrote:


If you think this is tedious, try doing the splitting rules correctly on the Green Horde scenarios. Yeah - hedges. Great idea.


Yep. It's not hedges that are the problem. It's the giant open areas which create multiple equidistant paths to the same target zone.

Hedges would have been cool had they kept the narrow streets of BP with an occasional well placed hedge.
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Alexander
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Mightyjim wrote:
LX1986 wrote:
funny, I also played it the way the op described
how stupid is the official rule?! seriously, I never played this way.

at some point we actually decided to never split at all and simply roll a die to determine direction. simplest solution imo.


If you want to make it really simple, don't bother setting up the map. Just roll a dice: 1-3 you won, 4-6 you lost.


just... wow shake
because getting rid of a simple rule, I don't enjoy in a game that is focused on simple fun rather than deep tactical decisions, is the same as not playing at all?

and besides, in Zombicide: Invader they changed that rule. so obviously even the designers thought it needed changing.
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